Manny wants out

[YankeeDoodle]

He can always hide in the Green Monster to drown it out. That is, if he's not blaring MP3s loud enough as it is behind those shades.

 

It's been confirmed by the Red Sox that Ramirez wanted to a trade for four years now, so it's not anything new. Even Larry Lucchino commented on this - doesn't seem like any team will take him, not by the trade deadline, anyways.

[yankeessuck013]

At this point they HAVE to entertain offers in my humble opinion. Look, one of your teammates just got drilled off the head with 120 MPH shot of Crawford's Bat. Nixon goes down with an injury and yuor manager comes to you and asks you to suck it up, be a team guy and help out. Manny could care less.*I am tired of Manny's act, I really am. I know he gives you 40 Homers and 130-140 RBI but I am tired of his act.

[bigpapi349]

rumored trade on the radio----

RED SOX- Cameron, Looper, Benson

METS- Manny

[soxie thefangirl]

Ohhh Benson. He's quite good. I want Wright in the deal, though.

[riverside sluggers]

Ok I was assuming since he was having the day off, hed be away from the ballpark, no he was on the bench watching the game. It just got me so mad at some times Sox were struggling for game 3 against Tampa Bay, and then it was showing Manny just sitting there watchging and chewing his gum. Hope he realizez there wont be cheers he'll be hearing tonight at Fenway.

[riverside sluggers]

Id like:

 

Boston: Manny Ramirez, Kelly Shoppach, Abe Alvarez, Kevin Youkilis

Mets: Cliff Floyd (278 avg with 23 HRs), Looper, and Wright--that would be adding two big bats for us in Wright and Floyd

 

Floyd is the better option to take over the void left by Manny, Cameron this year just has 10

[elsrbueno]

rumored trade on the radio----

RED SOX- Cameron, Looper, Benson

METS- Manny

 

That means my trade idea was the closest.

 

I was the only person to mention Cameron. I know y'all are hell bent on getting Wright, but that trade works for the Red Sox IMO:

 

I've already stated why I like Cameron. He doesn't have the offensive prowess of Ramirez, but he DOES have a tremendous glove in the outfield, a decent bat, and speed on the basepaths (a welcome addition IMO). Plus, Cameron is hitting .283/.369/.547 away from Shea, and he'd be moving into a hitters' park at Fenway.

 

On the same token, Kris Benson is a COMPLETELY different pitcher on the road vs at Shea stadium. At home, he's 4-2 with a 2.31 ERA. On the road, 3-1 with a 4.62 ERA. That makes me a bit nervous. Overall, his numbers are decent but unimpressive. He's got a 5.40 K/9 ratio and 2.5 K/BB. That's good because he doesn't seem to get himself in a lot of trouble with walks, but he doesn't blow people away.

 

All I kept hearing about Braden Looper this season was that he was incapable of closing. That having been said, he's 22 for 26 in save opportunities and has a 3.05 ERA for the season. There are some troubling numbers with him, like his 4.23 K/9 and 1.39 K/BB, meaning this guy simply doesn't dominate opposing hitters. They're hitting .247 against him. This guy was an average setup man in Florida, and took a lot of crap in NY because he wasn't a dominant closer, but he could be an average setup man again in Boston.

 

 

Cameron $7.3 million

Benson $5.3 million

Looper $5.3 million

 

Manny: $20 million

 

The best part as far as I'm concerned with this deal is that the Red Sox are making out ahead of the game as far as money goes. Sure, it's only a couple million, but 3 slightly overpaid players are way more managable than one WAY overpaid player.

 

The Red Sox add a back end of the rotation starter, a gold glove outfielder, and another arm for what is still a below average bullpen.

 

I like this trade idea.

[soxie thefangirl]

I still say Wright. And word has it the Sox will push for a deal involving Wright, which would be a huge upgrade for the Sox.

 

Benson looks to me like an excellent pitcher. But what would that do to the rotation? Arroyo and Wake to the pen?

[elsrbueno]

I still say Wright. And word has it the Sox will push for a deal involving Wright, which would be a huge upgrade for the Sox.

 

Benson looks to me like an excellent pitcher. But what would that do to the rotation? Arroyo and Wake to the pen?

 

What word? Do you have a source on that? (RE: The Sox pushing for Wright).

 

I wouldn't classify Benson as an "excellent" pitcher. He's been helped out a lot by pitching half his games at Shea Stadium (as I pointed out before) which is a pitcher's park. He wouldn't have that advantage. He's about 1:1 groundball to flyball, and he doesn't strike out a lot of batters so he would depend a great deal on the defense. Now with Cameron in the fold that defense would be greatly improved so that wouldn't be as big a deal, but the Sox defense is average at best.

 

I would say Kris Benson is a #4 starter-- maybe #3.

[SchillingIsTheNatural]

Manny Ramirez + Kevin Youkilis = Carlos Beltran + David Wright

[soxie thefangirl]

Oh it was on the radio. Wright is definitely of high value and someone the Sox would request from the Mets if they were to give up Manny.

 

Wright & Beltran would be a sweet deal.

[CrespoBlows]

It's more likely that you'll find a mountain of s*** located in your bedroom.

 

That trade won't happen, neither would the Benson deal.

[soxie thefangirl]

Ok 'cause you know. We'll see what happens.

[CrespoBlows]

Ok 'cause you know. We'll see what happens.

 

Think about it though, Beltran is another big contract, for a good player, not a great one. Also, why would the Mets give up David Wright, he's making the league minimum and is a star in the making.

[SchillingIsTheNatural]

ok ok here is what im trying to piece together....

 

Arroyo, Shoppach, and Youk package is on the table for the Phillies....it would involve Wagner...

 

Ramirez and Mueller would be a possible package to the Mets for Wright and Benson....

 

there is a chance Benson could then turn around and jump toward Florida in a possible last minute pacakge for AJ Burnett

 

....there is also a good chance that NONE of the above happen lol....but its fun to think about

[soxie thefangirl]

Because the Mets don't care enough to build around a young organization. They're obsessed with Manny and besides that Manny would bring in a lot of crowds, the same way Pedro boosted it for them. Wright is great, but they also have Reyes, so giving up Wright wouldn't kill them.

[SchillingIsTheNatural]

Think about it though, Beltran is another big contract, for a good player, not a great one. Also, why would the Mets give up David Wright, he's making the league minimum and is a star in the making.

 

Because he is not latino....just gotta say it how the Mets see it......Manny Ramirez is a huge marketing strategy for the NY Mets. Think about the players Omar has brought in....it was made by design for them to be latino because the majority of Met fans...are latino

 

David Wright (as good as he is) will probably not be as big a fan favorite for the Mets as he would for other teams. Again though...the Red Sox fans downplay the abilities of Manny Ramirez....he is a top 5 hitter in baseball....that is something you dont take lightly and just throw away....in order to obtain a "Manny Ramirez" caliber player...it will cost you a future star or a current star....

 

this crap about Mike Cameron, Cliff Floyd, I heard Tom Glavines name....is just not true....if the Red Sox were to trade Manny Ramirez if would involve David Wright or Carlos Beltran

[elsrbueno]

Because he is not latino....just gotta say it how the Mets see it......Manny Ramirez is a huge marketing strategy for the NY Mets. Think about the players Omar has brought in....it was made by design for them to be latino because the majority of Met fans...are latino

 

David Wright (as good as he is) will probably not be as big a fan favorite for the Mets as he would for other teams. Again though...the Red Sox fans downplay the abilities of Manny Ramirez....he is a top 5 hitter in baseball....that is something you dont take lightly and just throw away....in order to obtain a "Manny Ramirez" caliber player...it will cost you a future star or a current star....

 

this crap about Mike Cameron, Cliff Floyd, I heard Tom Glavines name....is just not true....if the Red Sox were to trade Manny Ramirez if would involve David Wright or Carlos Beltran

 

SITN-- I agree with you most of the time, but I'm siding with Crespo on this issue. You guys are living in a dream world. This is the same Manny Ramirez who the Red Sox put on IRREVOCABLE waivers 2 years ago. Meaning any team could have picked him up for ABSOLUTELY NOTHING if they were willing to take on his contract. The Mets, among other teams, did not take that chance.

 

What makes you believe they will have changed their minds, now willing to not only take on that contract, but give up TOP NOTCH talent in the process? It just doesn't make sense. I understand your theory that the Mets are infatuated with Latin players, and Manny Ramirez would fit in well with that plan, but it doesn't make sense.

 

The problem with trying to pry top notch talent from the Mets is this: Theo has NO BARGAINING power here. There's one team that would even think about picking up Manny Ramirez, and that's the Mets. Because there's that ONE team interested, the Red Sox are forced to either accept what the Mets have to offer, or keep him. Considering that he's undermining the team with his selfish antics, it's very widely known that the Red Sox would not only LOVE to unload his contract, but that they'd do it for NOTHING (like they tried to do it 2 years ago). Would Omar Minaya give up his top young players on good faith? That's not how these guys work.

 

If Theo Epstein somehow gets David Wright in a trade for Manny Ramirez, he should instantly win executive of the year award.... because that's amazing in my book.

[ORS]

I don't think this trade will happen either, but your logic is slightly flawed. There is a big difference between the Mets of two years ago and the Mets of today. His name is Omar Minaya, and he wasn't in charge to not take on Manny's contract when he was on waivers.

[SchillingIsTheNatural]

All I know is this....

 

Omar called the Red Sox immediatly when stuff popped up about Manny being potentially traded. Since Larry was on WEEI...the Red Sox front office has not been around to comment and has not been returning phone calls. Something is probably going to happen! Is it the Mets? Not positive but a good chance since the Mets front office hasn't been around either. It is possible the Sox are talking to the Phillies and not the Mets while the Mets may be talking to the Devil Rays...I'm not sure its crunch time for teams to get stuff done over the weekend......

 

Now here we have Manny....a problem with the media and off the field? sure I'll agree to that. Do other teams care? not if you are the Mets because a majority of your team is made up of players like Manny Ramirez. The off season money issue?...at the time the NY Mets were aquiring the likes of Carlos Beltran and Pedro Martinez. Are they doing the job? Pedro is good and Beltran is not bad but this team is still struggling offensivly. Why trade for Manny now when you could have had him for nothing? Becuase they could rid themselves of a longterm deal put in place for Carlos Beltran and pick up a three year deal with Manny that would certainly improve there offense. The problem with baseball is that not everything happens perfectly. Teams try to come up with a cheaper way in the beginning of the year to handle problems and fill a team. Beltran (although expensive) looked like a world beater and was less money. Now what does it look like? He looks overrated where Manny looks like a sudden nice fix for the Mets. Not to mention the Mets have 2 CFs.

 

.....soooo many questions and things change quickly in baseball. Taking on Manny with that salary is not necessarily a move that a MLB team wants to take on at the beginning of a season...they want to try other forms first. Look at the Sox bullpen...at first glance I said....we have a potential stud setup man in Matt Mantei if healthy and John Halama is a great alternative to Alan Embree.....some things just dont work the way as planned.

 

the NL East is wide open and Omar may feel Manny is the key ingredient to jump ahead and win this thing now....he probably didn't think he needed Manny in the beginning of the year.

 

David Wright would be tough to get but I honestly think thats the type of player it takes....otherwise...why would the Sox do it??? If they can't get caliber players like that for Manny....then he isn't going anywhere. You cannot replace Manny's bat in the lineup but at least they could get close. All I'm saying is if Beltran or Wright is not in the deal....I see Manny hitting 4th in the Sox lineup for the rest of the season.

 

....and im sorry for the rediculously long post lol

[elsrbueno]

All I know is this....

 

Omar called the Red Sox immediatly when stuff popped up about Manny being potentially traded. Since Larry was on WEEI...the Red Sox front office has not been around to comment and has not been returning phone calls. Something is probably going to happen! Is it the Mets? Not positive but a good chance since the Mets front office hasn't been around either. It is possible the Sox are talking to the Phillies and not the Mets while the Mets may be talking to the Devil Rays...I'm not sure its crunch time for teams to get stuff done over the weekend......

 

Now here we have Manny....a problem with the media and off the field? sure I'll agree to that. Do other teams care? not if you are the Mets because a majority of your team is made up of players like Manny Ramirez. The off season money issue?...at the time the NY Mets were aquiring the likes of Carlos Beltran and Pedro Martinez. Are they doing the job? Pedro is good and Beltran is not bad but this team is still struggling offensivly. Why trade for Manny now when you could have had him for nothing? Becuase they could rid themselves of a longterm deal put in place for Carlos Beltran and pick up a three year deal with Manny that would certainly improve there offense. The problem with baseball is that not everything happens perfectly. Teams try to come up with a cheaper way in the beginning of the year to handle problems and fill a team. Beltran (although expensive) looked like a world beater and was less money. Now what does it look like? He looks overrated where Manny looks like a sudden nice fix for the Mets. Not to mention the Mets have 2 CFs.

 

.....soooo many questions and things change quickly in baseball. Taking on Manny with that salary is not necessarily a move that a MLB team wants to take on at the beginning of a season...they want to try other forms first. Look at the Sox bullpen...at first glance I said....we have a potential stud setup man in Matt Mantei if healthy and John Halama is a great alternative to Alan Embree.....some things just dont work the way as planned.

 

the NL East is wide open and Omar may feel Manny is the key ingredient to jump ahead and win this thing now....he probably didn't think he needed Manny in the beginning of the year.

 

David Wright would be tough to get but I honestly think thats the type of player it takes....otherwise...why would the Sox do it??? If they can't get caliber players like that for Manny....then he isn't going anywhere. You cannot replace Manny's bat in the lineup but at least they could get close. All I'm saying is if Beltran or Wright is not in the deal....I see Manny hitting 4th in the Sox lineup for the rest of the season.

 

....and im sorry for the rediculously long post lol

 

 

I like reading the rediculously long post because it fascinates me. First, Tek: Good point about Omar not being the GM of the Mets when Manny was on waivers. Gives a man hope.

 

Now on to Schilling's comments: I understand I'm in the minority here, but at this point I see a trade of Manny Ramirez as addition by subtraction. I know his clubhouse presense isn't THAT bad, but think about how you'd feel if one of your co-workers was making 10x what you were, and you KNEW it, and he was ducking out early on Fridays? You'd be PISSED off. Nobody's saying anything, but guys like Varitek, Nixon, Mueller, have got to want to throttle Manny by now. I know I would. I was pissed that I spent $100+ a ticket to see my beloved Red Sox and Ramirez asked out of that game early (7/20). Imagine how the players feel? He's letting his team down and he's not earning his paycheck.

 

Speaking of his paycheck, imagine what the Red Sox could do with that extra money? No, they couldn't replace Manny's bat with one player, but they could drastically improve the team in other ways and could make up for the loss very easily. $20 million a year is a lot of effing money, especially a guy who refuses to run out ground balls.

 

I'm fed up with Manny Ramirez. It's a good thing I'm not in charge of the Red Sox because I'd have traded him YEARS ago, the first time he started bitching.

 

I sincerely believe that the Red Sox could cut a deal with the Mets. I think this is a GOLDEN opportunity to trade Manny Ramirez and Kevin Millar (The Mets are said to be interested in also getting an offensive first baseman) and I'd do it for prospects, or I'd do it for a package that centered around the likes of Mike Cameron (who I like, it's no secret) and others.

 

I'd LOVE for the Sox to get their hands on a guy like David Wright for all the reasons you guy have already stated. I just don't think it's realistic right now. I hope you're right and I'm wrong.

[SchillingIsTheNatural]

Speaking of his paycheck, imagine what the Red Sox could do with that extra money? No, they couldn't replace Manny's bat with one player, but they could drastically improve the team in other ways and could make up for the loss very easily. $20 million a year is a lot of effing money, especially a guy who refuses to run out ground balls.

 

I sincerely believe that the Red Sox could cut a deal with the Mets. I think this is a GOLDEN opportunity to trade Manny Ramirez and Kevin Millar (The Mets are said to be interested in also getting an offensive first baseman) and I'd do it for prospects, or I'd do it for a package that centered around the likes of Mike Cameron (who I like, it's no secret) and others.

 

I'd LOVE for the Sox to get their hands on a guy like David Wright for all the reasons you guy have already stated. I just don't think it's realistic right now. I hope you're right and I'm wrong.

 

Exactly! I said before if the Sox were able to dump Ramirez in the beginning of the year they were going to attempt a run at Adrian Beltre and JD Drew. Now I know most of you say HORRIBLE! But things may have been different....its hard to predict. I think JD Drew is a hell of a "baseball" player when healthy. The point though is they were more aggressive if they didn't have all that money tied up...they are already aggressive can you imagine how much easier Theo's job would be.

 

Interesting note about Kevin Millar. I didn't think about that but its a possibiltiy as well. Only thing I would say is if you deal Manny and Millar...the OF is pretty shallow but I think I would be alright with Kapler and Stern filling in...since Theo wouldn't let it stay that way for long. Not to mention me and elsrbueno have been dieing to get Millar's fat ass off this team for a while (I dont care if he is on a streak he will go into a big funk again, I promise!) I doubt if any deal were to go down that Theo would open more holes. He is trying to fill in the holes for another run at the World Series.

 

Its amazing how many Red Sox players have been linked to possible trades...Manny, Stern, Millar, Mueller, Shoppach, Alvarez, Sanchez, Youkilis, Wade Miller, Arroyo, Embree....2 days left

[Sox fan in Tex]

Since this is about trade talk, I thought I'd bring up that tonight Baseball Tonight, today is a special trade talk edition for whatever it's worth. ESPN isn't worth crap, but if you want to know what's going on around baseball I'm sure this would be good to tune into. Plus, I'm sure Gammons will be there.

[bigpapi349]

Wright-22 years old, .299 with 15 hrs ------322,500$$ WONT BE TRADED!!

Beltran- 11,571,429$ +

Looper-5,300,000$ +

Cameron-7,333,333$ ===== 24,204,762

FOR---

Manny-19,806,820$ +

Millar- 3,500,000$ +

Embree-3,000,000$ ====== 26,306,820

[ahhchon]

Ohhh Benson. He's quite good. I want Wright in the deal, though.

 

the mets are stupid, but not stupid enough to give up their young 3b also...

 

john

[curse reversed]

they can't trade manny. they cant replace his spot in the batting order and his contract is wayyyyyyyyy to big

[elsrbueno]

the mets are stupid, but not stupid enough to give up their young 3b also...

 

john

 

Thanks John, finally a voice of reason!

[SchillingIsTheNatural]

Since this is about trade talk, I thought I'd bring up that tonight Baseball Tonight, today is a special trade talk edition for whatever it's worth. ESPN isn't worth crap, but if you want to know what's going on around baseball I'm sure this would be good to tune into. Plus, I'm sure Gammons will be there.

 

They really are worthless aren't they. I've deffinitly come to that conclusion. One night they tell you one thing then the next its the opposite...and everything they say for the most part is there opinion....which is worth just as much as the opinions on this board. Sidney Ponson and Phil Nevin will deffinitly be traded. No they won't I saw that coming a mile away. Why would Nevin have been different this time around. At least Gammons has some insight...but I've seen him make plenty of mixups as well.

 

I don't believe too many teams are talking at the moment to anyone because they are hacking away at deals and trying to figure something out....they certainly arent talking to the baseball tonight guys.

 

They will say the same thing as everyone else. Manny's contract is really big and hard to move. Well no s*** thanks guys. The Red Sox have talked to the Mets but a deal is unlikely....considering nobody is in the war room with either teams...its impossible to know...until sunday at 4pm or whenever the deadline is.

[soxie thefangirl]

Yes the Mets have Reyes left if they deal Wright. And like someone said, Wright just won't be popular within the Mets organization. And besides the fact they're obsessed with veteran players such as Manny, I wouldn't be altogether shocked if they dealt Wright for Manny.

[SchillingIsTheNatural]

Come to think of it.....they did deal away there future last year to make a run at the playoffs....

 

why wouldn't they do it again?? this time involving bigger names

 

especially when they add an ace like Pedro and are looking at a closer in Baez...hmmmmm