moonslav59

I seriously doubt he gets $19M x 2, which is what VMart will make. I'm not saying I'd go that high for Beltran, but I'd rather pay him that than trade anything of value for VMart and pay the same.

Thanks. I knew someone would step forward with the details.

Word is, the limit will only rise to $200M as the league is willing to give up the comp pick for qualifying offer FAs- which is a huge give-away. The league wants the players to agree to an international draft.

I guess you don't believe that eating disorders are diseases. They are also diseases that can be cured. Yeah, we can blame Pablo for not "getting help" earlier, if that's what floats your boat, but I'm not giving up on Pablo. He'll get a chance to show what he looks like first, and then to show if he can still play at or near the level he showed in SF (as a fat guy, I might add).

Talk is the luxury tax limit may only go up to $200M. If the Sox try to stay near the limit, they will not have much to spend this winter, unless they are able to dump salary some where. I have us close to $185M right now. That doesn't leave enough room to sign just Beltran and G Holland.

Why trade players for VMart? Just sign Beltran.

No love for Sox killer Longoria?

I'm still against the deal, but your point is well taken. At the time, it looked like $13M a year was close to FA money for a closer- that was what bothered me most. We gave up several good prospects for a closer that others got by just signing them. (Although there were no top closers on the FA market that year.).

Maybe he can be converted to a RP'er.

I'm no expert on the history of Tiger prospects. The only one that jumps out is Andrew Miller,but they got Miggy (& Willis) for him, so it's hard to criticize that one.

MLB Offers To Remove Draft Pick Forfeiture In Next CBA By Charlie Wilmoth | November 26, 2016 at 3:52pm CDT A lockout is still a possibility as the league and the union negotiate the next CBA in advance of Thursday’s deadline, but there are strong hopes it can be avoided after MLB offered to remove the current system of draft pick forfeiture associated with the qualifying offer, Jon Heyman of Fan Rag Sports writes. Such a change would make MLB free agency “the freest free agency in sports,” in the words of one of Heyman’s sources. In return, the league wants the players to agree to an international draft. Under the current system, if a player refuses a qualifying offer, interested teams must give up a top draft choice to sign him. The players dislike this rule because it reduces the market value of players on the edges of the qualifying offer system — including, in recent years, players like Ian Desmond, Kendrys Morales, Stephen Drew and Nelson Cruz. Recently, players such as Neil Walker, Jeremy Hellickson and Brett Anderson have accepted qualifying offers, receiving less long-term security than they perhaps would have gotten on the open market. The players also do not like the idea of an international draft, which would affect prospects throughout Latin America. Heyman writes, though, that draft pick forfeiture is considerably more costly to them than an international draft would be, particularly since a significant percentage of international bonuses go to players who don’t make the Majors. Still, there are other topics that must be resolved, Heyman notes. One issue is the luxury tax threshold — the league has reportedly agreed to increase it from $189MM to $200MM, but the two sides have not agreed on a final number. FOX Sports’ Ken Rosenthal had previously reported that a lockout was a possibility. Reporting since then from Buster Olney and Jayson Stark of ESPN has suggested that there was reason for optimism that a deal could be completed.

I know what you mean, and your point is well founded. There are too many examples of Lars Andersons who made it to #17 in BA rankings and flamed out badly. Sam Travis does seem to deserve a longer look after the injury setback, and he has a significant chance of becoming a FT'er in MLB, but I don't see any indication of him being close to a sure bet. I'm hopeful but doubtful. I do think Beni is very close to a sure bet. I think Moncada is as close to a sure bet of becoming a good hitter in MLB as you can be, but his defense is what is keeping him down. Devers is a little more sketchy, but his upside is enormous, and he has "shown it" on the farm. Kopech is getting very impressive reviews. He may climb way up in the midseason rankings. Basabe is nearing the point of determination. Groome is still highly speculative.

Why not get a guy like Cain who may turn things around? If he doesn't, we're even with just giving the other team $30M. If we come up against a roster crunch, then we can just cut or trade Cain away.

Yes, it was easy to understand, but if he never had great prospects to wrongly trade away, then what do we learn, if we discover he never traded away or hardly ever did trade away a prospect that went on to do great things?

I'll take all the verbal, emotional and mental abuse aw hole city can muster for $95M. Heck, I'd take it for $95K.

Even if he never pitches an inning for us, we'd save $30M with a straight up trade.

Do you, in all seriousness, think it would take a Beni to get SF to take Pablo with no money involved?

Saving $58M by including a prospect is not an outlandish idea. Naming Moncada or Beni is. If a deal ever does happen with SF, it might be simply us adding $30M towards the $58M owed. Saving $18M is better than releasing him. I don't see any other salary dump players on SF to take back to partially offset Pablo's deal, so that's why I brought up Cain. I'd rather get a player with some hope of contribution rather than just pay $25-30M. I'd give Pablo, Abad and Hembree (both out of options) plus maybe up to $10M for Matt Cain.

SF must think he has a shot at returning. They were very upset when he signed with BOS.

My thought was that if we traded Pablo and saved $20M or so, we could trade for Frazier or go big on someone like Turner. If we got Turner, we'd probably trade Moncada or move him to LF. I think Moustakas would be too costly for a one year rental. If we could get him to extend, I'd listen. . I'm not content with going with Shaw-Holt-Hernandez at 3B for 2017. I also don't think Pablo improves our 3B outlook too much for 2017. I see his best chance at winning a slot is as our platoon DH with Young.

Agreed. He might have the arm for 3B, but not the athleticism. This from soxprospects... Arm: Average arm strength. Plenty of arm for first base, but doesn’t get to show it off often. Field: Lack of athleticism and foot speed best suited for first base. Soft hands. Confident picking balls out of the dirt.

Not if Cain was part of the deal. Pablo's $58M owed is reduced to $30M/3. We might still have to pitch in $3M a year plus give them Owens and Hembree, but I think they might listen. I'm not suggesting this trade offer out of a belief that Cain is going to win a starter slot. I'm doing it to get out from under some of Pablo's absurd contract.

That's not the point. He'd possibly be starter depth, but the plus comes from saving some on Pablo's contract costs. I could say this... I see little reason to believe Pablo is a substantial upgrade over the guys we have right now at 3B: Shaw, Holt, Hernandez and maybe eventually Moncada then Devers.

Does Matt Cain have any chance of returning to glory? Would a Pablo plus small pieces trade for Cain help balance the salary enough? Cain is owed $27.5M/1 or $41M/2 with club option.

Sample sizes are small, but for a 1Bman, I wouldn't call these minor league numbers eye-popping or even above average for a MLB first baseman: AAA: .765 (190 PA) AA: .821 (281 PA) (If you combine AA & AA, he's over 370 PAs with an OPS below .800- not really that good.) A+: .845 is respectable. A: .826 is good. A-: .813 is pretty good. Here's what soxprospects.com has to say about Travis: Hit: Solid approach and strong contact skills. Compact swing lends itself to hard contact to all fields. Swing lacks loft. Solid-average bat speed. Could struggle with velocity as he moves up, as his swing can get long and he has shown vulnerability to fastballs inside. Tracks pitches, works counts and understands the strike zone. Potential solid-average hit tool.