moonslav59
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Everything posted by moonslav59
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It seemed to me, some posters took issue with that term, and it was harsh. The thing is, you have even said, if we aren't going to extend Bogey, we should have traded him, and I agree, but when we do make a deal like the Betts one, the trade will be very unlikely one that pleases most fans-not just the "crybaby" ones. Most will likely take years to judge, properly, but the instant feeling will be anger or disgust. I felt angry when we traded Betts. Most did. Now, I see the deal was forced and necessary and don't think we could have done a significantly better deal. I remember, at the time, thinking I'd rather have Maeda than Downs & Wong or Graterol, and for a short while, that did look like a better deal, but I'm liking more and more of Wong with each passing day. 5 years of Dugo for a 60 game lost season of Betts seems fine, now. It's also helped me see the virtue in trading stars about to bolt going forward.
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The Sox have the option on Paxton, not the other way around. I don't think they signed him for 2022, in the first place. The deal was for 2023 & 2024. I'm 99% sure the Sox take the $13M x2 option, and Paxton is with the Sox going forward.
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Not totally. Too many cheap teams don't trade away stars at the right time. They also don't get the returns the Rays seem to get or know precisely when the time is right.
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Yes, and I never said there was no upside to them. Nobody cared when we traded Slocumb, especially a few years later, but I do remember some griping when we traded David Wells, and we saw some when we traded Vaz, who IMO, was not coming back on an extension. .
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Your points are true. They do comeback, when the team wins or gives the perception they can or will compete, but when the suck, revenue is down. It is a factor for most teams, less so for TBR.
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I basically said this, after the deadline, but put it in words that offended some. I said something like, the Sox did not do what was in their best interests because of "crybaby fans."
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And, that's why they chose that plan- or one reason, anyway. I'm one fan that wishes we'd go that way. It may suck to see stars go, but the Rays keep having new and exciting stars, seemingly every year. I want a sustainable system in place, and I know that does not have to depend on dumping players about to make too much money in time to get nice returns that may not show anything for years, or may be busts, I might add. The other thing the Rays seem to be experts at is dumping players right after their best career year and or right before they start declining steeply. Maybe because they've dumped so many good players, it just seems that way, but the list is long and goes way back. (Snell is but one example.)
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We might be able to get Devers on 8-10 years, if we give him an opt out after 2-3 years.
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We could wait on Devers, and all he costs for 2023 is his arb number.
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Kike Hernandez signs 1 year extension
moonslav59 replied to Jasonbay44's topic in Boston Red Sox Talk
I think Pham is tradeable at $6M, but maybe he re-signs for $9-10M/2. If we sign someone like Nimmo, Ref & Pham are out of options, and we don't need Pham. -
Clausen was good in '09 and Powlus wasn't bad in his So-Jr years, but no great ones for a long time.
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The Ray's Way, while usually about money, is also geared towards building on long term success. While trading stars in their prime, at the deadline or once they start getting high arb pay, looks like it sucks for the present team, but if you continuously do it, you start seeing the rewards of the ones you traded 2-4 years ago, today, and the cycle continues, pretty much uninterrupted. The problem is, our fan base would get irate, if we traded Bogey, Wacha and Nate. The Rays fanbase (I know- oxymoron) is used to it, but also realizes the benefit of continuing the cycle.
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I meant knowing what the fan reaction would have been.
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The finger was a fluke, but I think it's probably safe to count on Sale + Paxton for 30+ starts, combined.
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I'm pretty sure, he found out what offers were out there for those two, plus Wacha, Strahm and maybe even Kike, but I doubt the latter, as they just extended him. IMO, JD is not getting a QO, so I'd have paid some or most of his contract and gotten the best we could, even if a Hamilton or Binelas type prospect. If they intend to offer Nate a QO, the return would need to be greater, but getting us under the tax line has some very high benefits, in coming years. Same with Wacha and the QO, but trading him would have been a clear white flag. My guess is, he'd have gotten the best return, but alone would not help us reset. Strahm would not have brought back much, but maybe more than JD with no money attached. The question to me is "what was considered "the right return?"
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Kike Hernandez signs 1 year extension
moonslav59 replied to Jasonbay44's topic in Boston Red Sox Talk
If either Pham or Ref hit lefty, I'd be okay with a platoon, but they aren't, and I agree. I'm not even sure I want either as part of a DH rotation or platoon, either, but if we upgrade enough, elsewhere, I can see going light in the OF or DH. We could sign a RF/DH type, like Mancini, but I'm not sure I want him in Fenway's RF. (Haniger?) -
Kike Hernandez signs 1 year extension
moonslav59 replied to Jasonbay44's topic in Boston Red Sox Talk
I'm not sure Eovaldi is "likely" to get a QO, but certainly 1 year deals are less risky. I'd prefer giving Wacha a QO to Nate. maybe we give both one, and our rotation will be set. 1. Sale or Paxton 2. Wacha 3. Nate 4. Pivetta 5. Paxton or Sale (Bello & other prospects) -
Kike Hernandez signs 1 year extension
moonslav59 replied to Jasonbay44's topic in Boston Red Sox Talk
If we went with an OF of Dugo, Kike, Pham, Refsnyder, I'd want some minor league depth, and not just for injuries. If we add Nimmo, we might have to trade Pham or Ref, since neither have options, or make them part of the DH role. -
Yes, agreed, and that's why they did not do what was best for the long term. They buckled to fan pressure and maybe taking a hit on gate and cable revenue for a few months to maybe a year.
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How's your line-up, now? Take away Judge...LOL!
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Yes, third before any more signings, plus we likely will not see these guys batting (much if any), next year: .644 Dalbec (6th in PAs w 340) .578 JBJ (9th at 290) .697 Cordero (1oth-275) .648 Duran (12th w 219) .563 Plawecki (13th w 167) .322 Sanchez (18th w 44) .427 Downs (19th w 41) That's about 1400 PAs being replaced by more from Ref and hopefully Arroyo, Pham, Hosmer, Casas and McGuire/Wong. Yes, we lose some O from Vaz (7th w 318 PAs ay .759) and maybe Bogey & JD, but a small step down to Swanson and a DH that can do better than .770 is not unthinkable. Add Nimmo to RF and the expected plus at 1B with Casas/Hosmer, and we should have a amuch better offense. It does not take much to improve on these positional numbers, next year: .652 RF (Dugu/Ref>JBJ) .657 1B (Casas/Hosmer>Dalbec/Cordero) .668 CF (Kike) .745 2B (Story) .754 DH (Even a Hosmer or Cordero v R and Pham/Arroyo/EValdez v L should reach .754) We may lose ground at.. .699 C .838 SS maybe .754 DH
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Wow, 2 weeks in '21. You wish the yanks could be that healthy! He wasn't hurt in LA, much at all. He was often platooned or was on the bench, because they had All Stars at middle IF and OF. Don't confuse 140 games with being hurt.
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Posts like this give me great hope, because you have been so wrong about the Sox for many years in a row. 1. We will have at least $80M to spend. 2. We can trade some prospects for one key role. 3. We don't need 5 SP'er. Pivetta is a plus 4/5 SP'er ("4/5, at best?" come on! Look around, dude!), and Sale/Paxton should give us at least 33 starts between them. That's at least 2 SP'er. We can QO Wacha and not have to sign a FA SP'er for the 2 slot. We could try to count on a prospect to fill the 5 slot, and we have a lot of hopeful arms to find one (Bello/Crawford/Mata/Wink/Walter). If Bello were a Yank, you'd be pumping him up. 4. Explain about how many times Kike has been on the IL over the last 4-5 years. He's not a hulk and bulk Yankee. He's a true athlete. 5. We don't need a .700 catcher. We need a great defensive one who can handle the staff well. McGuire and Wong both seem capable and will not be a net minus, IMO.
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I would not say it couldn't have happened that way, but I see it going more like this: July discussions: top brass, Bloom and probably Cora discuss all options, including a firesale of 1 year players, only. When they speak about this option, Bloom seems more willing to go this route than Kenndey, JH and probably everyone else. When they speak of going all out, nobody takes the driver's seat. They settle on not doing anything to harm the future. Then, they look for ways to make the fans think they are not giving up, while trying to improve the future as much as they can, and I think that's what they agreed to and then actually pulled off. I do think, if it was totally up to Bloom, he'd have traded any and almost all FAs-to-be, he did not want to try and extend (like Kike.) It's just my opinion, and this should not be viewed as just the Ray's Way. It's what any team should do when the odds are as low as they were at the end of July for the Sox.
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Kike Hernandez signs 1 year extension
moonslav59 replied to Jasonbay44's topic in Boston Red Sox Talk
Agreed, but I prefaced my statement with countering a rather weak OF by greatly upgrading in other areas, like SP, RP and staying even at SS/2B. (Maybe spend more on C or 1B or stack the pen.)
