moonslav59

Only Barnes is on Bloom, unless you count Story or Kike. He still wants to blame Bloom for the cliff.

.Dream on.

No, I meant what person has been the best thing that has happened to the Sox in over 80 years. Not who was the best person to watch. Sure, we don't win in 2004 and 2007 without Papi, Manny and maybe a couple other players. 2013 without Papi, too. We don't win in 2018 without a handful of key players, but JH is directly responsible for all 4 rings and a bunch of highly competitive non ring teams. Without Henry we'd be looking at 100+ years without a ring. It's not close.

I was hoping we might finish in the top half of AL teams by W-L records, but these last 3 tight games have pretty much dashed those hopes. 7. CWS 76-76 8. MN 74-78 (-2.0) 9. BOS 72-79 (-3.5) with 11 games to play v tough opps

The Sox have always been near the luxury tax line and go through cycles of re-setting and going over the line, but never by too much. In that sense, nothing has changed, and maybe it never will, but IMO, the team seems to spend only when they think a ring season is near or upon us. 2013 was the exception, as I think that team surprised Henry. (They did trade Iggy & Montas for Jake Peavy at the deadline, and that added to the payroll.) I think sometimes JH gives the okay to spend more, when the team has done so badly that fans are restless- like after 2015, but even then, we had a solid core of young players on that 2016 team and had a chance to compete, that year, when spending grew. I don't think Henry and Bloom felt like 2021 was "the year," either. I actually think the Story signing was a late decision based on falling ticket and NESN purchases and grumbling about not "going for it." This time, however, increased spending was not paired with trading several highly-ranked prospects, like it was from 2016-2018. I think that part of the our history has changed, and maybe for good. That does not mean we will never trade top prospects, again, but I doubt we ever come near to what DD's plan entailed. That was not a plan for sustained winning. Just my opinion. Here is a list of the biggest gains in opening day player spending budgets by year: 47 2010 (ended up worse than 2008 and 2009) 36 2018 28 2004 28 2015 (after finishing last in 2 of the previous 3 years- did improve, some) 26 2022 (after 3 years of ups and downs- ended up worse than '21) 23 2007 19 2000 (the beginning of the building up to 2004) Years the Sox paid a luxury tax: 1998 1999 (pre-Henry) 2004 2005 2006 2007 2010 2011 2015 2016 2018 2019 2022 Some observations: 1. Once the 3rd year in a row penalties were added, the Sox have never gone 3 years paying the tax. 2. Going over 2 straight years has been common. 3. Staying under for 1-3 years has been the range ( 1 year twice, 3 years once, since 2004. (4 years from 1999-2003- mostly pre JH)) I think we go over in 2023 or 2024 but not both. The nation is restless and grumbling, but the second criteria for spending big- having a rising young core is not quite there, yet.

Of course I enjoy watching the players and the great game of baseball more than an owner. I hardly know anything about Henry. He is still, b y far, the best thing that has happened to the Red Sox for over 80 years. It's not even close. Without him, we'd still have zero rings since 1918. Unless you think we'd have won without him, there is no debate, IMO.

Do you have a link to Henry's edict?

I hope you are being sarcastic. Henry has been the best thing to happen to the Sox in almost 90 years.

So, with these you forgot #5 JH sells the team to a bigger spender.

If Diekman can net us a starting catcher, I’m not sure about anyone’s trade value or lack there of.

I’m called by my middle name as many are. I did not choose it.

My optimism on 2023 is not as high as it was pre-2022, but I think we should get better. Brining back Bogey and Wacha will take up a significant chunk of the winter spending budget, but we should have enough to improve on the 2022 JD, Hill, JBJ, Diekman and Strahm. I think we have already improved our 1B for 2023 with Casas and Hosmer. We should be able to equal or better our .750 DH OPS by using some sort of rotation or platoon which may include some from this group: Arroyo, Refsnyder, Casas or Hosmer (whoever is not at 1B), Dalbec, Cordero, Pham or E Valdez. It's not glitzy, but if we can improve at 1B/DH without spending a dime, we can then upgrade other slots with more resources: SS (Bogey or Swanson?) or 2B (K Wong?), if Story can play SS. RF (Nimmo?) SP 1 or 2 (via trade?) RP (too many to list) SP 3 or 4 (too many to list) Bloom has to hit on nearly all of these key 5 slots, but he'll have more money than he had in 2020, 2021 and 2022.

That's why I said "I get why the pen runs are more memorable." 2023 Pen Whitlock, Houck and Schreiber Addition Addition Taylor Barnes Crawford German That's 9 for 8 slots. On the farm: Kelly, Danisg, Wink, Seabold plus maybe converted minor league SP'ers Mata, Ward, Walter, Murphy, Santos and maybe Bazardo or Ort. I think we'll add one solid RP'er or two that I hope do better than Deik & Strahm.

He has trade value. Not much, but some.

Will Casas be our next Yankee killer?

I get why the pen runs are more memorable, but Hill and Wacha let up more and more per IP.

Sorry. My post was not clearly stated. My bad. Diekman had trade value, yes. We got the CWS to pay his full 2022-2023 contract while giving us our starting catcher for the next 2 years. If he had value, maybe Barnes (with some cash) might, too. (I went back and edited my previous post.)

Game 1 3 ER in 6 IP Wacha 1 ER in 3+ IP Pen 1-12 RISP Pen blamed for loss. Game 2 4 ER in 5 IP Hill 1 ER in 3 IP pen 1-5 RISP Pen blamed for loss. This has been going on all year. Sure, the pen did not help us win, but these are team losses, and many times, the pen was not the most responsible- only the most memorable, to many. I didn't even mention the defense and base-running blunders- all year.

I don't expect anything either, but you seemed to be surprised I had any hopes at all. I'd start by pencilling him in as our 7th or 8th RP'er, due to no options and his salary, but ST'ing may move him up. I doubt we DFA him, even if he has a s***** spring. They may try to IL him, if that happens. I also wonder, if Diekman had trade value, we might end up trading him (Barnes), with some cash, if we feel he will b e no help going forward. I don't think a 30 IP bad stretch by a pretty reliable RP over 5-6 years should be enough to lose all hope. As of now, he has to prove he does not belong on the 26- not the other way around.

At one point, Betts, Bogey, Devers, Beni, and others were on the farm. No Sox team has ever won without major contributions from the farm that was built up 3-6b years prior to their accomplishments and success. There is always a lag between building up a farm and seeing the results in the "here and now." Patiences is needed. If you jump the gun and trade them most away for the "here and now," and you end up with the 2020-2022 Sox, 3-6 years from now.

So, you have no hope for Barnes going forward?

Well, when you think about 2023, it's hard to use the here and now philosophy, especially with so many players from the now becoming FAs. Next year's team will be very different from this year's team. It kinda has to be. Again, I understand your point of view and that many feel like you do. I'm not sure why you keep having to say it, but I do appreciate your change in tone towards me. I'm trying hard to keep my tone more civil, too, towards you and others. Thanks.

Yes, Barnes is not on DD. Bloom extended him, so subtract his $9M, and we still have about $90M of 1.7 WAR production from a few of DD's carry-overs..

How about looking at 2022? Since August 11th, Barnes has pitched in 17 games (16.1 IP) 15 Hits 4 BB 18 Ks 1.65 ERA 2.01 FIP .558 OPS Against I'm not expecting this for 2023, but it does provide some hopes. You, apaprently have no hopes, at all. Forget the first half of 2021. He will not return to that, either, but he has a long history of being pretty good. He had 11 bad innings in 2021 and 20 IP to start 2022, and that's enough for you to lose every ounce of hope. Many very good RP'ers have bad 30 inning stretches in their careers and then go on to be very effective, afterwards. Do you doubt this? Do you really have no hopes for Barnes?

Read my words: "I don't think either Barnes or Bard are "reliable" I'd like both as my 7th or 8th RP'er- maybe 5th or 6th, if the top 4 are solid, but I have slight hopes for both in 2023.