Maxbialystock

He got $365M, and I'm reasonably sure the Dodgers were prepared to go higher if JH decided to compete. Any discussion of $300M is just silly, and I say that while being fairly sure that, all things being equal, Mookie wanted to stay in Boston. But things weren't equal, not by a long shot.

Lead by example, you say? Let's see, now. Rafael Devers this year led the Sox in Wins Above Replacement, games played, runs scored, rbi's, dingers, and total bases. He was second in OPS, walks, and doubles. Do you ever read what you write, or do you simply have a problem with the English language?

Lead by example, you say? Let's see, now. Rafael Devers this year led the Sox in games played, runs scored, rbi's, dingers, and total bases. He was second in OPS, walks, and doubles. Do you ever read what you write, or do you simply have a problem with the English language?

2023 had bad bats, bat pitching, and bad defense. Specifically, for the Sox bats to be good--good enough to make the postseason--the Sox need to rank in the top 5 in MLB in runs scored. This year they were 11th. In the 21 seasons of the JH era, the Sox have never been to the postseason ranked 11th in runs scored. Cut off for pitching is easier--16th in team ERA--but this year the Sox were 21st in team ERA. 2021 Sox were 14th; 2018 Sox were 8th; 2017 Sox were 4th; 2016, 9th; 2013, 14th; 2009, 16th; 2008, 9th; 2007, 2d; 2004, 11th. One glaring exception was the 2005 Sox, whose team ERA was 25th in MLB. They won 95 games, went to the postseason, and were swept in the ALDS in 3 games by the White Sox: 14-2, 5-4, and 5-3. I can find no correlation between the Sox defense and getting to the postseason. For example, the 2021 Sox made it to the ALCS and were 29th in fielding percentage. In 2017 they were 26th.

So true. You can look it up: the Sox never went anywhere with a team full of good bats. Good hit, no field is a recipe for disaster.

For once I'm going to defend this very excellent point. People forget that the Sox got to the WS exactly one time, 1946, with Ted Williams whose career spanned 1939-1960. What a loser!!!! He too was piss-poor on defense, so bad that Jimmy Piersall asked for a salary increase because he had to cover LF as well as CF.

For once, I'm going to try to keep this simple. 1. Current situation is not hopeless. 2012 team was hopeless (69-93), and the 2013 team won the WS. 2. Get 1-2 starters with real promise and/or track records. Spend the money and/or prospects. Given the current Sox glut of lefty bats, trade one or more away. 3. Improve the hitting, especially the righty bats. This year the Sox had one righty bat, Turner. Duvall missed too many games, Story stunk, Ref can't hit righties, etc. 4. Don't trade to improve the defense. Devers and Casas are our two best hitters and adequate at 3b and 1b. Story is excellent at SS, but killed us with his rotten hitting. Sox won with Kike, errors and and all, at SS and lost with Story at SS. Dodgers got better with Kike.

I agree the defense sucks, but I also think the game threads tend to overlook errors and costly non-errors by opposing teams. When the Sox misplay a ball, it's the end of life as we know it. When the opposing team does the same thing, it's just part of the game. No one on talksox has actually identified specific games in which errors or non-error misplays cost a win. But it's dead easy to identify games won or lost because of hitting and/or pitching. In fact, if you look at the MLB team stats in the John Henry era, you will see that this 2023 Sox team is one of the worst hitting teams, which I determine quite simply by looking at the Sox ranking in total runs scored in the season. Right now they are 11th. To get into the postseason, the Sox need to be on the top 5. A similar calculus applies to the pitching--the ranking of the Sox team ERA, which right now is 21st. Sox pitching (team ERA) doesn't need to be in the top 5, however: the 2018 Sox team ERA was 8th best; 2013 was 14th best; 2004 was 11th best; and 2007 was 2d best. The 2021 Sox made it to the ALCS with the 15th best team ERA.

Let me see now, I think 12 years includes two WS's--2013 and 2018. Plus 2018 was only the best season in Sox history and one of the best MLB seasons ever because the Sox went 11-3 in the postseason against 3 pretty good teams--the Yankees, the Astros, and the Dodgers. In the now 21 years of the John Henry era the Sox ended the 86 year "curse" and won three more WS. That total of 4 WS is more than any other MLB team during those 21 seasons and 3 more than the Yankees have won. I'm not saying we should be happy with this season or last season, but am saying your moaning and groaning is excessive.

Oh, yeah, defense is what this game is all about. What a crock! Hitting and pitching are the sine qua non for any MLB team. You guys all bought into the thesis that Kike at SS was just killing the Sox, but the Sox had a winning record with Kike in the lineup. Now we have a good defensive SS in Story and a losing record with him in the lineup. The Sox are losing this season because the hitting and pitching are both subpar.

Which of course is typical of me--and for which I do apologize. That said, however, I don't like that deal. Why get an older third baseman who can't hit as well as Devers so you can move Devers to a new freaking position and then make Casas the freaking DH when Yoshida is clearly the guy who needs to be the DH? Right now and until someone else comes up with something really smart, I look forward to Devers and Casas, the two best freaking bats in the Sox lineup and both adequate fielders, back at 3b and 1b next season. I love that Story will provide solid defense at SS and hope his OPS is close to his career .832. And I think the Sox will have enough options to provide a good field, semi-decent hitting 2d baseman. With Yoshida as the likely DH, I think at least two good righty bats would be nice in the outfield. Like Duvall and Rafaela--provided Rafaela can hit MLB pitching. Refsnyder is not a good righty bat because he can't hit righty pitchers. I wouldn't mind Duran in LF, Rafaela in CF, and Duvall in RF, but it would be nice if Duran had instructions not to run into walls in futile attempts to catch dingers. Wong and McGuire are a good tandem behind the plate. So that leaves the pitching, which is the biggest problem. In other words, to heck with Chapman, and let's get a one or two good starters if they can be found for less than $35M/year for 10 years--each.

You always make sense, but I have to disagree on Mookie because I think the Dodgers were willing to go to at least $400M to get him. The year was 2019, and the Sox pricey pitching had collapsed. When the Sox cut the deal with the Dodgers, their record was 59-51 and they were in the middle of a freaking 8 game losing streak. Since then, as we now know, the Sox pitching has continued to struggle because JH was tired of paying big bucks--long-term--for starters like Price and Sale. And the great irony is that that's exactly what he was going to have to do--spend even bigger sums for more starters--while also continuing to pay Price and Sale. Thus the hiring of Bloom and the effort to rebuild the farm system, etc. Do I think Mookie would have made a difference if he had stayed with the Sox? Absolutely. But the pitching would still stink unless, of course, the Sox payroll went north of $350M to bring in some more gold standard starters like Price and Sale. With Mookie and Bogey on the current Sox team, I believe the 2023 Sox would make it to the postseason, but no way, no how would they win the AL East unless, as I say, JH also spent major dollars to fix the rotation.

I'm not sure that's the case. I agree with Cora's philosophy because I agree that 162 games--6 games a week for 6 months--are bound to have an effect on position players ability to stay focused. He believes in that approach, and I think it has worked for him. But I would be remiss if I didn't repeat what someone else said. The Atlanta Braves are having another excellent season and have three players--Acuna, Riley, and Olson--who have played in 157, 157, and 160 games. Their respective OPS's and WAR's are 1.009/8.2, .859/5.7, and .994/7.2. So it is unarguable that their approach definitely works for them.

Agree and would add these three points-- 1) Ted Williams' claim that most difficult skill in all of sports is hitting a round ball with a round bat squarely, which becomes even harder when the pitching is good. Thus has Story (age 30, lifetime OPS .836) struggled since he returned from the IL. 2) Command of the strike zone, which means being good at both pitch recognition (especially if it's a ball or strike), but also being ready to swing at hittable pitches. Ted Williams, with his great reflexes and eyesight, was consummate at commanding the strike zone. I think these Sox hitters overall struggle with both pitch recognition and with being ready to swing at hittable pitches. Like the A's players in the movie Moneyball, they have been lectured endlessly on the value of a base on balls--which to me means being passive at the plate. The Rays hitters seem to me to be better at pitch recognition, but also better at attacking hittable pitches. 3) The schedule--which you cite--and especially the 48 games with just 3 days off (Aug 4-Sep 20), but also the injuries to Duran and Casas plus the need to look at Rafaela, Dalbec (yet again), et al. And let's not forget the pressure on the lineup/hitting when the Sox emerged from the ASG break with just 3 starters. Sale, Houck, and Whitlock were on the IL, and Pivetta was in the bullpen. Bello, Paxton (now on the IL), and Crawford were the starters.

I like Casas at 1b because I like his length on those errant throws to 1b. He's so-so on grounders, but that's OK with me. His throws to 2b have been good. And this. His freaking OPS this year was .856!!!!! If you make him DH, that makes Yoshida our full-time leftfielder, where this year his DWAR in just 86 games was -1.1. I would much rather have good bats at 3b and 1b than good gloves/arms. The Sox do not win games with their gloves anywhere near as much as they do with their bats and pitching arms. That said, however, it bothers me that both are lefty bats on a team that needs good righty bats to win. This year the lineup was filled with the likes of Duran, Dugo, Devers, Casas, Yoshida, and McGuire.

I don't question Jim Rice's claim that Mookie said Boston was where he wanted to be. However, Mookie also had an agent who must have told him how freaking valuable he was and is and that the Dodgers were a pretty good landing place with the largest attendance in MLB, etc. Plus which team has made it to the playoffs every season, 2019 to the present? I do not believe Mookie would have signed with the Sox for $300M in lieu of the Dodgers for $365M. In John Henry's defense, I believe he recognized that, to retain Mookie, he was going to have to get in an unwinnable bidding war with the Dodgers. As for Bogey, I frankly didn't think he was worth as much as he got from the Padres. As things turned out, however, Bogey at SS this year would have been huge for the Sox and probably enough to get them into the postseason. Lester, I agree, was a bad decision by the Sox.

Also, who's going to play 3b when Devers moves to 1b?

I think it's just stupid. Where do the Sox find as good a bat as Devers' to play 3b? Also, when you move him to 1b, it's a whole new position and one he will not play as well as Casas has played it. Devers should field grounders better than Casas, but grabbing throws to 1b? Nowhere near as good. Knowing where to move/go in particular situations? Also not as good. Also, with Casas going to DH, that puts Yoshida in LF full time. To be honest, that's probably the best position for him, but this year, despite Turner being called the DH, Yoshida was DH for a lot of games. And the reason for that is that Yoshida's DWAR in LF this year (83 games) was -1.1. Devers' DWAR at 3b in 150 games was -0.5. So moving Devers to 1b, Casas to DH, and Yoshida to LF significantly degrades the defense and leaves 3d base uncovered. Anybody remember who played 3b for the 2018 Sox, their best team ever? Devers, DWAR -0.9 in 116 games. How about WS winners in 2013? Middlebrooks (DWAR -0.4) and Holt (DWAR -0.5). So, by moving Devers to 1b, Casas to DH, and Yoshida to LF, you have made the Sox defense worse and you still have to find someone to play 3B.

True dat.

Once again I'm guilty of writing way too long. The season to look at is 2021 when Cora absolutely did not have the talent he had in 2018 or that Farrell had in 2013, 2016, and 2017. But the Sox still won 93 games and made it to the ALCS.

Bello is the iron man with more IP, more starts, and more quality starts than Pivetta. However, I do think that Bello, Pivetta, and Sale are a decent start on a rotation next year. Pivetta pitched in 5 games in September for a total of 26.1 innings and an ERA of 3.08. Not too shabby. I think his curve (or whatever it's called) has a sharper break and that his fastball is a little faster. I do think a starter needs a changeup, which Pivetta either doesn't have or doesn't throw very often.

I had the wrong Raffi. That said, however, where do you get this whole leadership thing from? You think Mike Trout is a rotten leader because the Angels stink? How about Bogey--or Machado--and the Padres? Aaron Judge and the Yankees? MLB is far and away the most individualistic team sport on the planet because the center of every game is the battle between pitcher and hitter.

I know, I know. He was just freaking brilliant. Or was he? He took over the 2013 Sox, which led MLB in runs scored and won the WS. The very next season, 2014, the Sox hitting plummeted to 18th in runs scored and they finished the season at 71-91. In 2015, the Sox hitting improved significantly to 4th, but the pitching stunk (ERA 4.31, 25th in MLB), and they finished 78-84. In 2016 the Sox pitching improved to 9th in MLB in team ERA, and they were also #1 in MLb in runs scored. They were a juggernaut, but only won 93 games and lost all three ALDS games. In 2017 the Sox improved again to 4th in MLB in team ERA but the hitting slipped to 10th in runs scored. They again won 93 games and this time lost 3 of 4 ALDS games. Exit Farrell. Enter Cora for the 2018 season, in which the Sox again led in MLB in runs scored, but whose ERA was 8th in MLB. That Sox team won 108 games and 11 of 14 games in the postseason--easily the best season in Sox history and I'd argue the best MLB team/season in the last 40 years. In Cora's 2d season, 2019, the pitching nosedived to 19th in team ERA, but the hitting was still pretty good at 4th in MLB in runs scored. Sox went 84-78 and missed the postseason. 2020 was a nonseason. In 2021 the Sox hitting was still good at 5th in runs scored, and the Sox pitching was OK at 15th in team ERA. Compare that to the 2016 Sox which was 1st in team scoring and whose ERA was 9th best. Both teams, 2016 and 2021, won 93 regular season games. But the 2021 Sox beat the Yankees in the wild card and then the 100 win Rays in the ALDS before losing to the Astros in the ALCS. Do I need to add that the 2016 Sox lineup had Betts (OPS .897), Bogey (OPS .802), Pedey (OPS .835), JBJ (OPS .835), HanRam (OPS .866), and Ortiz (OPS 1.021)? How about David Price with 35 starts (22 quality starts), and 230 innings? Porcello won the Cy Young that year with 33 starts, 26 quality starts, 233 innings, and an ERA of 3.15. Knuckleballer Wright had 24 starts, 15 quality starts, and an ERA 3.33. And Kimbrel had 31 saves with an ERA of 3.40. Gimme Alex Cora over Farrell any day of the week and twice on Sunday.

Sox weak hitting this year was just as culpable as the pitching. Call it RISP disease or whatever you want, but the Sox rank 9th in MLB in runs scored and they need to be 5th or better to be competitive. Part of it is too many lefty bats in a lineup that plays half their games at Fenway. Another part is other teams' hitters seem to me to have better command of the strike zone. To top things off, Bloom spent big on Yoshida and Story with piss poor results.

Big deal. Playing 2 games in Texas is a smart way to help adjust to the time zone difference. Also, if memory serves, Pedroia and other Sox players used to begin their season prep in January by going to I think Arizona. These are professional athletes being paid a king's ransom when/if they make it to MLB. In Ken Burns series on Baseball, someone comments that before Curt Flood attacked the reserve clause, the average MLB player made 7 times as much money as the average fan. After Curt Flood, it was 7 x 7 as much money. I just checked a chart from "Statista" which says the average MLB salary is $4.9M. If the average fan today is making $100K/year, that 7 x 7 is still holding up.