Hitch

This, I absolutely did not see coming.

Is there much talk about Lodolo being traded? I haven't been following him at all to be honest. I don't know a great deal about him in general outside of his stats I just looked up.

No, I mean Alonso and Marte would be my ideal, but I'd be okay with Alonso and either one of Bregman or Bo as well. Basically Alonso and another or I'm very worried about our power.

I think it goes back further than Price. You had Sandoval and Ramirez - both of which were disastrous contracts. Add in Castillo and even Pedey's to a degree at the end there, and you've got a poor track record before you get to Price. Then you've got Sale's extension, and Story's and Masa's deals that really hurt this club in terms of building a contender with what we got from them. It just took too much out of the payroll with too little coming back. They're almost out of that hole now with a much stronger farm system and money to spend, so hopefully we're on the uptick, it certainly feels that way. But I do think they will be cautious about adding long term and big deals again because they've ben routinely burned by them. They'll do one, but two is feeling more and more unlikely. Unless they target Marte, who while on a longish deal, is very reasonable LT wise, especially in comparison to his production. I think the one thing they will want is to avoid being a team that has too many DH's. And these long terms deals for multiple players usually ends up right at that point.

I'd recycle them through the DH role to keep them fresh. Not ideal with Masa there, but it's hardly some massive issue. And it guards us against inevitable injury. Campbell and Masa are not good enough back ups that we should even consider them, and Garcia can start in AAA and get more seasoning. That said, again, I think trading one of them for our other needs is more optimal and likely. I just don't subscribe to it being the crime you do if we keep them all (as long as we've filled our other holes).

Absolutely. We're there now so time to put the foot down again.

Alonso with Marte (and a Ryan type) would be my ideal winter. Bregman or Bo would be great, too, but I don't see it as likely with Alonso.

Thank God someone else is seeing it this way. I was beginning to question my sanity.

Absolutely agree. And then they've improved, otherwise we've stood still. I am slowly giving up on the idea of two big bats, however. Most reports don't seem to indicate much chance of it. More likely Alonso and a second tier player.

I mean, has there been a single report to counteract the claim that we lowballed Bogaerts and Lester in particular? I've never seen one, and I believe it is now roundly accepted as fact. A GM or team can rubbish reports, it happens all the time, and they can certainly set the record straight after the conflict has been removed - the player has moved on for instance. I understand your point about ownership being vilified and I've found myself arguing quite a bit the past week that it is getting to almost absurd terms when it comes to Henry, but they are all businessmen too, and looking to strike the best possible deal. No MLB owner is going to go in with an acceptable offer straight off the bat, or they've gone in too high. That can mean some absurd offers of course, and if this report is true the Tigers offer was an absurd one. And here's the thing, if as an agent you're going to lie (which they all do of course), why on earth would you pick the figure $320m apart? That's huge and quite specific. And it really does the agent no good if he's lying to that level when trying to get his client extended. Especially as they can just come out and say - yeah that report is a nonsense. And even more so because it will make the journalist look a fool, and so the pressure will return on the agent as the journalist could defend it by saying sources close to the player told me this. Owners lie, agents lie, players lie, the media lies. We all know this, so I don't completely disagree with you, but that number was so big and so specific that it makes me think this is likely quite close to the truth.

Several other people have responded to the nonsensical Devers point so I won't add to it, other than to say I know you're smart enough to understand that argument has no basis and is not in good faith. We want to replace Devers power. Because we are a team lacking in power. It's not that complicated. And we're just going of Breslow's words - HR power isn't everything but we see in the playoffs especially that it can carry a team, so we do need to add that element (paraphrasing). Alonso will supply a lot of that you'd think and hope. I'd just like another masher in there like a Marte if possible. If it's Bo (I think we have next to no chance personally) then I'll live with that just fine, too.

Depends if it is for a number 2, or prospects. We're using Ryan here, but we could just as easily trade for Peralta, or another, in which Abreu and Duran become much more interesting. If we trade one of them in a deal for Marte, then things would look very different obviously, but that wasn't the parameters of the discussion.

No, sorry, I meant with Bregman. I didn't include him as he was there last year, too. You're adding Ryan and taking away Devers and Gio. That isn't moving forward at all to me, especially if we are trading Duran or Abreu for a number 2. I don't like hoping that players will take leaps forwards or show health they haven't before for us to be okay. Instead we should be, all things being equal, looking to start the season much improved and if we get positive progression as well, all the better. If we don't or get regression it will at least counteract that somewhat. I'll happy to be on Lou Merloni's side on this who is very much of the same mindset.

Adding Ryan only to the roster that we had last year (while losing Devers, Gio and likely Duran/Abreu) is very much a step backwards. I can't even bring myself to say standing still again. I'm amazed this is up for debate, and I too believe Roman will take a decent step forward this year.

Really? We already had Bregman, so we will have lost Devers' bat and Gio, and replaced them with Ryan. And that's not at the very least, standing still? It's going backwards in a hurry for me. You can say Bregman might be a win extra, but you can also say that he's a year older and maybe his body is at the beginning of the breaking down cycle and he loses more time (and range). You can say Mayer is going to be better, but you can also say his performance (the little we've seen of it so far) might trend downwards (ala Adley Rutschman or Gunnar Henderson), not to mention he has been injury prone for three years. You can say Story doesn't repeat last year. There's also the chance that we trade Duran or Abreu for a No2 (or just for prospects), so not only have we not replaced Devers bat we've lost one of our better outfield attacking weapons, too. Every team will be hoping for progressions from their younger players, and less injuries to their stars. If you plan for the future by hoping that everything/most things trend in your favour, you're setting yourself up for failure.

This doesn't really need stating. We know. The industry knows. Now we find out if the more conspiracy minded fans are right about this ownership.

This is a fair point, but what the agent would get out of this particular lie is hard to discern. His client is still at the organisation, why make something up, when the GM can come out and say this report is absolutely false? It hardly shows his client in a good light. FA quotes are a lot easier to take with a pinch of salt. When the client is still at a club - less so.

I don't think it's that much a waste of value. His value is on the offensive side not the defensive side. And he is earning a small salary so it really isn't an issue. But we need to plug those holes somehow, and we aren't getting rid of Masa...

Again, there were costly and consistent mistakes made by DD and Bloom that put a huge financial burned on us (not to mention dud trades). At no point, short of spending an absolute fortune, did it look to me like the Red Sox were in a position to start winning consistently. I imagine it looked the same to Henry. So he likely did the smart, if not painful thing and waited. At least that's how I see it. You see it as a sham and some conspiracy against e fans. I know which seems most likely to me. If he doesn't spend now, he will rightly be hammered. Let's see.

Alonso obviously adds power and the vast majority of your fictional 65 home runs, but the conversation was about Bo and isn't in a vacuum, it has the context of all that's come before it, as I suspect you know. Bo has averaged 14 Hrs the past 3 seasons. This team is lacking in HR power. We have Roman who we're hoping can hit 20. Story may or may not hit 20 again. Abreu has averaged 18.5 a season (and will he still be here?) Apart from that we're not very threatening. We need that HR threat (which Breslow alluded to himself). Alonso will provide a large part of that (hopefully), but Bo and Alonso just gives us what Devers and Bregman were giving us and that wasn't enough. If we didn't sign Alonso but got Bregman and Bo we certainty wouldn't be thinking we'd solved our power issue. I'd much prefer we brought in Marte. I'd probably even prefer Bregman back. But all that said, I would not turn my nose up at Bo. As I've previously stated, this team also needs players that puts the ball in play - another thing we're lacking. But if that's the only moves on the offence, I don't know if it's enough considering where we're starting from, and likely to lose one of our best offensive players in a trade of Duran/Abreu. Don't take this the wrong way, but your analogy is a nonsense.

Oh, you've got me by 5 years you young scoundrel.

I would like to see us act with haste and get things locked down, but that often isn't in the hands of a single GM.

I sometimes wonder if the age of our posters is significant in this mindset. I'm pretty sure I'm one of the youngest on the site outside of Thunder (and I'm still middle aged) and so I'm always thinking 5/6 years in advance. But I get it if some of the older guys are life F- that, I want success now when I can enjoy it.

All fair questions and I don't know the answer because if someone is willing to go 7 at $210m for Bregman and Alonso (or anything approaching that), I don't want any part of it. But, we also badly need bats and they need to make it happen one way or another. Maybe then we look at your Marte's and do it that way. My dream is that they go and get Bregman, Alonso and trade for Marte and a #2. I'm also keenly aware that's got next to no chance of happening. I'd be very happy with Alonso and Bregamn/Bo and a #2 with some bullpen help. My guess is it'll be Alonso, plus another slightly lesser player and a trade for a #2 and some bullpen help. That's isn't hugely impressive, but it's definitely a step in the right direction with them being able to add in season. But yeah, if things get crazy price wise then it will really get hot in JH's and Bres' kitchens.

2015 - 3rd highest payroll 2016 - 3rd 2017 - 3rd 2018 - 1st 2019 - 1st 2020 - 3rd 2021 - 3rd 2022 - 6th 2023 - 13th 2024 - 12th 2025 - 11th So I'll ask the question again, do you think it's more likely that an ownership group that was routinely in the top 3 payroll (and sometimes the highest spender), that brought unprecedented success to this fanbase, decided 3 years ago that they no longer wish to compete and instead want to sit around trying to swindle its fanbase with shams, or, that they believed the roster was in bad shape, with contracts that were hurting them, and needed to get itself back on track before they outlaid big sums again? Because I know which seems most likely to me. If they don't go big this summer, they will deserve a hammering. Other than making stupid mistakes and comments/promises, I don't think they deserve all the ire they get on times.