cp176
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Everything posted by cp176
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I'm not sure I like the concept of the labelling. How about someone who has has strong values? traditionalist? I do not believe that people's lives as well as beliefs can or should be categorized? My first question when I am hit with a label is who is doing the labelling? It's ok if you do not believe that there are such things as clutch hitters or that there are teams in all athletic realms that win so much that it becomes habit forming. If you believe you can do something strongly enough, I might take a chance on you regardless of what the stats say. You present some great arguments many of which I already agree with. Regardless of luck, when you take the intangibles out of the game that sometimes go against what you call the stats, the game is missing something. There are elements at play in the hearts and minds of athletes that you cannot measure.
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What do you consider a traditionalist to be? There may be some who are more traditional than you might be but I can't see any posters dispelling the use of available data to some extent.
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I am reinvented. Imagine the big boss using everything he can to improve and still recognizing that the proverbial coin has two sides. I bet he is very happy to have a guy like Bill James around. Keeps him from having to obsess over the data.
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I'm sure that someone can offer up an explanation for the improbable happening. Thing is, sometimes things just happen. Obviously, I would think that as you move up in any line of work, as the expectations get greater and the job gets tougher, there will always be people who have earned the right to be there who just seem to reach the end of the line. I think that it would be fair to say that a major league baseball player at some point in their travels performed in the clutch. As the talent pool gets smaller and tougher all of sudden the concept of performing in the clutch gets different. Some can't some can. It's a gift that some have. The ability to narrow your focus and stay in the moment when the game is on the line.
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It is the human element that that attracts me to the game. The unpredictability of the human being. There have always been athletes in all sports who have been able to respond better in "clutch" situations at very special times. It occurs at all levels. It is impossible to determine what makes these special people able to accomplish extraordinary accomplishments at special times. It isn't luck and it is not necessarily a reflection of past performance. They don't always succeed but normally we will bet that they will. They have intangible qualities that you cannot measure. For some of us, it is what makes the games worth watching and worth playing.
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Add the Giants to that list with the Dodgers. Boston's annual experience drove me into the arms of both the Dodgers and the Giants back in the early 60's. gave me something to cheer for. Anybody who could beat the Yankees. I was 9 when Mazeroski hit the homer for the Pirates in 1960.
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I don't know what he is talking about. He is older than I am and I remember the Cuban Comet just fine. I'm just a youngster.
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It certainly isn't unfortunate. You don't think that he is right and that's ok.
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I would guess that it might depend upon the statistics you choose to look at.
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Minnie Minoso was a fine player. One of the great baseball names.
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You are absolutely right here. It is the same in every game. A player can look very, very good statistically and not be able to do the job in the clutch. Serves as great separator - the good from the very good and the very good from the truly great ones.
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Kimmi - Give me some credit here. I always bring up the significance of using available data on this site. It is simple suicide not to. Just trying once again with I small touch of futility to point out that there are other issues in play. It isn't just an either or situation. I am sure that the Yankees based their decision on very good data but the story could have gone the other way just as easily. You get to call it what you like. An educated hunch maybe a data backed hope possibly even a little luck. I think they made a very good decision. I give the analytic guys all kinds of credit just not all of it. If it was that easy, no mistakes would ever be made.
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Note - I did not condescend- I did not suggest that anything you have said is ridiculous - nor did I imply that maybe you were not intelligent enough to understand what was being discussed. You can even have the last word.
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Oh I think that I understand the conversation just fine. I will let it drop. I certainly don't want to argue with you over anything. The use of data or whatever you would like to refer to it as is there for all and should be considered. It certainly doesn't tell the whole story. The Yankees used the data and got lucky. They didn't simply get lucky but I don't think that it would have been a big surprise to anyone if that scenario had not worked out the way that it did.
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Just trying to clarify - Swisher looked done but the Yankees felt it was due to bad luck, so they used available data that indicated that he might not be done. Is that what prompted them to sign him?
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He sure did. I wish that he had been a member of the Red Sox at that time. Did the Yankees roll the dice on him in hopes that he would produce again?
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I agree with you here. Napoli wasn't signed to play small ball. He's not that kind of hitter. If he is healthy, he could have a very productive season. With more power bats in the lineup, pitchers shouldn't have the comfort of being too careful with him when he comes to the plate.
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Don't get defensive on me. I am just trying to understand your post. Are you saying that the metrics were trending down on Swisher and that the Yankees felt that it was simply a case of bad luck that had caused the slide. Did they kind of bet against the metric here based on something they felt that they saw or knew that no one else did?
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ty for your previous comments . You are right - in a clear majority of the time, playing for run is not the way to go. Who does that? It worked for the 1959 White Sox - I don't know about anyone since. Once again, I like Napoli. He wasn't signed to help anybody play small ball. the fact remains though, at this level when the situation dictates, once again a clear majority of players should be able to move runners along. I understand that all need to play to their strengths, but most major leaguers at one time or another could drop down a bunt when needed or hit behind a runner to advance them. It's a strategy that still has its place in the game.
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I love to study the game but it has to be fun for me. I pay my accountant to do my taxes as well. I would never have wanted his job and I'm sure he would not have wanted mine. I really am glad that there are those who love the stat work and put so much faith in them. I truly do not know nor do I care what most of the acronyms thrown around even mean. I know one thing 700, I was finally having a decent round of golf down here and got rained out after 13 holes. Where is that Florida sunshine? Better here than up north though.
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Oh - also, if stats should trump my opinions, I am ok with that as well.
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For the record, I am a Napoli fan. I already had the part about the power hitters striking out a lot figured out.. Thankfully there is a need for both. Not everyone was made to swing for the fences. I like the statistics and can see the value in them. I am not in love with them. I'm not a casual fan but I have little interest in a total immersion of statistical data. I know that you can live with that. Even though I might be uninformed, you never know when I might come up with something worthwhile. Most of what I say or predict might be refutable or even proveable by using statistics. I think that you can have an opinion and talk intelligently about the game without being in one camp or the other.
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That is very true. Personal preference as opposed to defendable data I guess. I like the big armed power pitcher with the low ERA and the high strikeout ratio. Without too much study, I hope that others do as well. With respect to hitting, I lean toward the contact side of things but in reality like a blend of both. My positions are opinions not defendable by anything other than what I like. Adam Dunn would never get a HOF vote from me although I will admit that there was a time where I thought he might look good in a Sox uniform.
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Your English is fine. Based on some of the comeback comments you field, I think that that everyone understands you perfectly.