Stanton or Votto

[OH FOY]

Here's Hosmer's numbers, I don't see one year wonder here. You decide. 3 Gold Gloves, even though many don't go by that.

https://www.baseball-reference.com/players/h/hosmeer01.shtml

 

Also I like BA, its simple way of telling someone that you put the bat on the ball, and hit it fair to get on base.

Edited October 24, 2017 by OH FOY!

[Jack Flap]

I'm not necessarily anti-Hosmer, but I think there are better options. I don't think the difference between him and, say, Moreland is as great as the difference in the contracts they'll get will be.

[Dojji]

I very strongly disagree about you in regards to Hosmer and Moreland. The only category in which the two compare is the HR category.

 

IMHO the difference between Hosmer and Moreland is the difference between an average to above average starting 1B, and a backup with some good bench power. Moreland is not a starting 1B, Hosmer is a decent-not-great starting 1B, to me that's all the difference in the world. Also, the age comparison works in Hosmer's favor.

[OH FOY]

I agree with that, Hosmer is going to cost a lot. I'd rather look into Abreu for 1st, leave a 20 year old kid at his natural position, since he has been playing organize baseball, give him a chance. And go from there. Like to add Martinez too.

You could have something like this.

Martinez

Abreu

Hanley

Devers.

That's 4 potential 30+HRS guys. With good average too. That's what I would like to see, providing we keep Benni.

[moonslav59]

Here's Hosmer's numbers, I don't see one year wonder here. You decide. 3 Gold Gloves, even though many don't go by that.

https://www.baseball-reference.com/players/h/hosmeer01.shtml

 

Also I like BA, its simple way of telling someone that you put the bat on the ball, and hit it fair to get on base.

 

Gold Gloves are a joke.

 

I gave up paying attention to that award when they gave one to a guy who DH'd all year. I forget who he was.

[OH FOY]

You got to find something, right? Totally disagree with you that Hosmer is just a 1 year wonder. Anyway KC sees him as more an important piece in their line-up than Moustakas, they will resign him, and let Moustakas walk. At least that's what their GM is saying. Dayton Moore.

Hosmer will probably be an over-pay. That's the problem, because you will be in a bidding war with KC.

Edited October 24, 2017 by OH FOY!

[moonslav59]

I'm not necessarily anti-Hosmer, but I think there are better options. I don't think the difference between him and, say, Moreland is as great as the difference in the contracts they'll get will be.

 

He's not a guy you sign for 4-5, despite the fact that he's 28 (today is his birthday).

 

We need a bat, and Hosmer's glove is not something that changes any decision.

 

2014-2017 thirty -one 1Bmen with 1500+ PAs;

 

SLG

.480 Duda (8th)

.449 Hosmer (18th)

 

ISO

.242 Duda (4th)

.160 Hosmer (29th)

 

Yes, Hosmer is better in BA and OBP, but we need power.

 

OBP

.350 Hosmer (12th) still not worth a 4 year deal being 12th in your best stat

.338 Duda (14th)

 

[moonslav59]

You got to find something, right? Totally disagree with you that Hosmer is just a 1 year wonder.

 

I said he "could be" a one year wonder.

 

Duda has been more consistent with his OPS and power.

 

HRs

Duda: 30, 27, 7 (in 172 PAs), 30

Hoze: 17, 9, 25, 25

 

SLG

Duda 481>486>412>496

Hoze 398>459>433>498

 

[moonslav59]

I very strongly disagree about you in regards to Hosmer and Moreland. The only category in which the two compare is the HR category.

 

IMHO the difference between Hosmer and Moreland is the difference between an average to above average starting 1B, and a backup with some good bench power. Moreland is not a starting 1B, Hosmer is a decent-not-great starting 1B, to me that's all the difference in the world. Also, the age comparison works in Hosmer's favor.

 

Moreland is a much better fielder, but Hosmer is better than Moreland by a lot.

 

It's the 4 years plus that kills any idea of signing him.

 

(No Moreland either!)

[jacksonianmarch]

Hosmer fans beware! Yes his power has improved the last 2 years with him hitting 25 HR's a season, but there are worrying marks on him all around. In 2016, he was replacement level as a 1b. In 2017, his BABIP shot up to .351 and magically his WAR jumped to 4.1. His BABIP drove up his BA to .318. Anyone think he is repeating that? Also, a move to Fenway will make his power output drop a bit as RCF is a monster there. Hosmer is a pretty bad glove guy as well. I think anyone getting him is going to be disappointed in the end.

[moonslav59]

I agree with that, Hosmer is going to cost a lot. I'd rather look into Abreu for 1st, leave a 20 year old kid at his natural position, since he has been playing organize baseball, give him a chance. And go from there. Like to add Martinez too.

You could have something like this.

Martinez

Abreu

Hanley

Devers.

That's 4 potential 30+HRS guys. With good average too. That's what I would like to see, providing we keep Benni.

 

Abreu will cost top prospects.

 

Just sign someone to a 1 year deal and see if Devers needs to be moved to 1B.

 

Don't logjam 1B with an iffy player and 4-5 years.

[jacksonianmarch]

Abreu will cost a TON to get and I don't think you can get him without damaging your big league club

[sk7326]

Duda makes more sense on a short deal - if the bidding gets to 4 years or something ... Hosmer is more attractive (the 3 year age advantage kicks in). Although for my money "none of the above" becomes the answer ... or "give Jose Bautista a first baseman's mitt and a 1-year deal" or "bring back Moreland"

[moonslav59]

Duda makes more sense on a short deal - if the bidding gets to 4 years or something ... Hosmer is more attractive (the 3 year age advantage kicks in). Although for my money "none of the above" becomes the answer ... or "give Jose Bautista a first baseman's mitt and a 1-year deal" or "bring back Moreland"

 

Maybe try JD Martinez at 1B. We still have HRam and Travis as back-ups.

 

The Devers move to 1B could be a reality sooner than we want. That's one major reason to look for a 1 year signing, even if it's a massive overpay.

[sk7326]

Maybe try JD Martinez at 1B. We still have HRam and Travis as back-ups.

 

The Devers move to 1B could be a reality sooner than we want. That's one major reason to look for a 1 year signing, even if it's a massive overpay.

 

It's 1B ... you give someone a glove and hope for the best. Having 1984 Keith Hernandez would be awesome - but a luxury.

 

Carlos Santana I'd list as the high probability answer - which is actually pretty good. Some power, good on-base skills ... can catch if our catchers get hit by a meteor.

[OH FOY]

Abreu will cost a TON to get and I don't think you can get him without damaging your big league club

 

I don't know, he going to get a huge raise this season. WS want to cut costs, and get Younger. Maybe 1 Major Leaguer maybe 2, Relief Pitcher with Control, and a decent Prospect, might get it done.

E-Rod, Barnes, and someone, is a good proposal. Cost control with potential.

Edited October 24, 2017 by OH FOY!

[moonslav59]

It's 1B ... you give someone a glove and hope for the best. Having 1984 Keith Hernandez would be awesome - but a luxury.

 

Carlos Santana I'd list as the high probability answer - which is actually pretty good. Some power, good on-base skills ... can catch if our catchers get hit by a meteor.

 

Santana is maybe my third FA choice, if we miss out on JD Martinez and Moustakas.

[Spudboy]

I'm not necessarily anti-Hosmer, but I think there are better options. I don't think the difference between him and, say, Moreland is as great as the difference in the contracts they'll get will be.

 

This is almost exactly as I feel.

[OH FOY]

Rather wait a year see how Devers does and go hard after Machado, then invest in Moustakas. Just read Yanks might go after him.

[Jack Flap]

I very strongly disagree about you in regards to Hosmer and Moreland. The only category in which the two compare is the HR category.

 

IMHO the difference between Hosmer and Moreland is the difference between an average to above average starting 1B, and a backup with some good bench power. Moreland is not a starting 1B, Hosmer is a decent-not-great starting 1B, to me that's all the difference in the world. Also, the age comparison works in Hosmer's favor.

 

If you're just looking at Hosmer's 2017 season and believe that's who he is going forward, then sure (though even then, the difference was a significant but not earth-shattering 4.0 vs 2.0 in bWAR)...but year-to-year consistency has not been his strong suit. In 2016, Hosmer was worth 1.0 bWAR and Moreland 0.7.

 

Again, not saying Hosmer isn't better, but if it's a choice between spending $5-10 million on Moreland and committing probably ten times that to Hosmer, I'd pick the former (ideally in conjunction with signing another bat like Martinez) and use the difference in other areas.

Edited October 24, 2017 by Jack Flap

[harmony]

I don't know, he going to get a huge raise this season. WS want to cut costs, and get Younger. Maybe 1 Major Leaguer maybe 2, Relief Pitcher with Control, and a decent Prospect, might get it done.

E-Rod, Barnes, and someone, is a good proposal. Cost control with potential.

The trade value of Eduardo Rodriguez is limited by his chronic knee problems that have resulted in a significant surgery this month. Matt Barnes is a mediocre 27-year-old reliever. Each comes with four years of team control.

 

The White Sox, with only $15 million committed to 2018 salaries, are among many clubs that can afford Jose Abreu's projected 2018 salary of $17.9 million. With two years of team control, Abreu offers substantial surplus value after posting 4.1 fWAR, valued at $33.1 million, this year.

 

In a trade of Abreu, I suspect the White Sox will receive far better offers than Rodriguez, Barnes and a prospect.

[moonslav59]

Rather wait a year see how Devers does and go hard after Machado, then invest in Moustakas. Just read Yanks might go after him.

 

Moustakas is a similar gamble to Hosmer. He's only 28 and 2017 looks like it COULD be a fluke.

 

34 HRs is a lot more than Hosmer's 25.

 

Moose also has 3 straight years over .800, but his pre-2015 numbers are very low.

 

He's barely a plus UZR/150 over the last 3 years combined (+0.2), but that's way better than Devers. One has to then consider the poor defense at 1B with Devers for a while anyways.

 

Moose is not my favorite guy, but this year's free agent class only has one big slugger: JD Martinez. Moustakas looks like the safest 2nd choice, if power is what you are looking for.

 

The .305 career OBP is scary, although it's been .329 over the last 4 years.

[oldtimer]

Moustakas is a similar gamble to Hosmer. He's only 28 and 2017 looks like it COULD be a fluke.

 

34 HRs is a lot more than Hosmer's 25.

 

Moose also has 3 straight years over .800, but his pre-2015 numbers are very low.

 

He's barely a plus UZR/150 over the last 3 years combined (+0.2), but that's way better than Devers. One has to then consider the poor defense at 1B with Devers for a while anyways.

 

Moose is not my favorite guy, but this year's free agent class only has one big slugger: JD Martinez. Moustakas looks like the safest 2nd choice, if power is what you are looking for.

 

The .305 career OBP is scary, although it's been .329 over the last 4 years.

 

I see Goldschmidt's name mentioned as a possible trade for some of our Minor leaguers. Could that even be a possabilit. If so, there is your very solid 1st base candidate.

[S5Dewey]

Moustakas is a similar gamble to Hosmer. He's only 28 and 2017 looks like it COULD be a fluke.

 

34 HRs is a lot more than Hosmer's 25.

 

Moose also has 3 straight years over .800, but his pre-2015 numbers are very low.

 

He's barely a plus UZR/150 over the last 3 years combined (+0.2), but that's way better than Devers. One has to then consider the poor defense at 1B with Devers for a while anyways.

 

Moose is not my favorite guy, but this year's free agent class only has one big slugger: JD Martinez. Moustakas looks like the safest 2nd choice, if power is what you are looking for.

 

The .305 career OBP is scary, although it's been .329 over the last 4 years.

 

I've always thought that if a player can play 3B then he can play 1B. The ball comes off the plate at the same angle, the distance is about the same, the biggest difference that I see is that the footwork is different. Since Butterfield made Hanley into a 1B-man I can see him doing the same with either Moustakous or Devers.

 

What about signing Moose to play 1B, leaving Devers @ 3B, and then swapping them if things don't work out at 3B? We get their power and the best of the two defenses.

[sk7326]

I've always thought that if a player can play 3B then he can play 1B. The ball comes off the plate at the same angle, the distance is about the same, the biggest difference that I see is that the footwork is different. Since Butterfield made Hanley into a 1B-man I can see him doing the same with either Moustakous or Devers.

 

What about signing Moose to play 1B, leaving Devers @ 3B, and then swapping them if things don't work out at 3B? We get their power and the best of the two defenses.

 

Defensively the reverse alignment is probably better ... what IS funny about Moustakas is favoring him over Hosmer despite a lot of the same red flags ... checkered performance, inconsistency ... meh defense. The homeruns are a key difference - but how much of that is offset by a significant difference in OBP.

[Carpin]

I see Goldschmidt's name mentioned as a possible trade for some of our Minor leaguers. Could that even be a possabilit. If so, there is your very solid 1st base candidate.

 

Any team willing to land Goldsmith will have to give the farm to get him, he's one of the players with the most trade value in MLB. A deal for him will have to start with Benintendi, Devers plus others to have the Dbacks attention, from the Yanks they might ask for Judge, Sanchez + others, I know is crazy but is the type of package it might take to land a player like him,

 

I don't see Arizona trading this guy, I think they will try to extend him.

[harmony]

I see Goldschmidt's name mentioned as a possible trade for some of our Minor leaguers. Could that even be a possabilit. If so, there is your very solid 1st base candidate.

I doubt the Arizona Diamondbacks, who won as many games as the Red Sox this year, are willing to part with their best hitter who remains under team control for two seasons at a bargain $25.5 million ($11 million in 2018 and $14.5 million in 2019).

[moonslav59]

I've always thought that if a player can play 3B then he can play 1B. The ball comes off the plate at the same angle, the distance is about the same, the biggest difference that I see is that the footwork is different. Since Butterfield made Hanley into a 1B-man I can see him doing the same with either Moustakous or Devers.

 

What about signing Moose to play 1B, leaving Devers @ 3B, and then swapping them if things don't work out at 3B? We get their power and the best of the two defenses.

 

I'd start with Moose at 3B and Devers at 1B, but let Devers take reps at 3B and play some games when Moose rests.

 

I wouldn't risk games lost with an obvious and significantly worse defender at 3B everyday. Don't wait to lose two games and then make the move.

[sk7326]

I doubt the Arizona Diamondbacks, who won as many games as the Red Sox this year, are willing to part with their best hitter who remains under team control for two seasons at a bargain $25.5 million ($11 million in 2018 and $14.5 million in 2019).

 

I think they absolutely shop Goldschmidt - or at least let everybody know they will take a phone call ... this season was amazing for them, but if Goldschmidt can net a king's fortune Abington, MA Mike Hazen has to take a look.

[moonslav59]

Defensively the reverse alignment is probably better ... what IS funny about Moustakas is favoring him over Hosmer despite a lot of the same red flags ... checkered performance, inconsistency ... meh defense. The homeruns are a key difference - but how much of that is offset by a significant difference in OBP.

 

Moose is a risk. I've said that. I'm not drooling over him, but he addresses our power issue better than Hosmer, and he also solves our 3B defense issue, though not to a great level. Devers and HRam could share 1B and DH.