7/17 v White Sox

[a700hitter]

Lester has averaged 203 IP over the past 4 seasons. He threw 191.2 IP last year, missing 200 IP for the first time since he had a full time SP job.

 

Beckett threw 193 IP. He missed it by a start.

 

You're splitting hairs.

SFF, Every season one of these guys goes down and misses significant starts. The big 3 have never each taken 30 starts in a single season. You have to have more than them and 2 rookies in the rotation. It wasn't going to be enough. We have been luck that Doubront has pitched well enough and didn't blow up like Bard. But even Doubs will be hitting an innings limit. There just wasn't enough pitching when the season started. I was worried about one of the big 3 going down with an injury. Instead the have essentially gone down with under performance. The whole starting staff has been terrible. I'll give Doubs a bye, because he has been okay. The rest has been garbage. I felt strongly that they should have added another pitcher. Would one pitcher have made the difference? Not if the top 3 keep pitching like this. However, if they do turn it around, the additional acquisition that was never made might have made a difference.

[Bellhorn04]

Would you have kept him? We weren't getting a significant return regardless of who we traded him to.

 

It's like this, really...I've been a fan of this team way too long. When 700 Hitter said Youkilis was going to pull a Fisk on us, I thought, s***, he's right. And so far he is.

[a700hitter]

What does it matter?? It doesn't matter. You don't forego making a trade because you're scared about playing them in a week. That's ridiculous.

He's the first player to hit a HR for the Sox and then hit one against the Sox since Hawk Harrelson did it in 1969.

 

You are missing the point. It wasn't a trade. They gave him away. If you are going to give the guy away, send him far away.

[2004 ALCS]

It's like this' date=' really...I've been a fan of this team way too long. When 700 Hitter said Youkilis was going to pull a Fisk on us, I thought, s***, he's right. And so far he is.[/quote']

 

I think the general consensus among fans is that Youkilis would probably play much better once he was traded. But the alternative was to keep him around, have him continue to upset the clubhouse and get paid an additional couple of million to sit on the bench.

[2004 ALCS]

He's the first player to hit a HR for the Sox and then hit one against the Sox since Hawk Harrelson did it in 1969.

 

You are missing the point. It wasn't a trade. They gave him away. If you are going to give the guy away, send him far away.

 

Further away than a team we play four more times this year? If we traded him to an NL team, we could have theoretically faced him in the World Series for seven games.

[a700hitter]

One player does not win or lose a game. Period.

 

You have to have faith that your club can beat any other team at any time. You want a GM who is going to manage scared? Fine. Not me. I want a GM who isn't afraid to send an aging player to another team as long as you get maximum return. Give me the GM who isn't scared that Youkilis is going to come back and have a big knock against us sometime.

SFF, we got no return. They got 2 names to save face. Lillishit was going to get cut by the ChiSox once they activated Youkilis. The prospect was a junk prospect. He was afraid to say he got nothing. giving the guy the chance and motivation to beat us was just stupid. Take nothing and send him to the other league. Here's the fact:

 

He beat us tonight, not someone else. Youkilis beat us. Yes Lester pitched like s***, but Youkilis is the guy who beat him. Youk was smiling when Lester threw the 3-1 fastball. He was licking his chops.

[a700hitter]

Further away than a team we play four more times this year? If we traded him to an NL team' date=' we could have theoretically faced him in the World Series for seven games.[/quote']These 4 games were not theoretical. We need to play more than .500 ball in the second half. Every game is big from here on out, especially home games.

[jung]

Dumping Youk into the AL or nothing in return was a mistake. No reason to beat the issue around....it was a mistake....will it be the critical mistake of the season? I doubt it but it was a mistake. We got nothing for him....this is why so many of us were wavering over this whole damn thing and asking if it really had to be done. I came down on had to be done finally...regrettably but doing it this way was nuts.

 

Look you dump a player for nothing...in such a way that you will face him...even if he wants to go, you are waving a red flag in his face. You are saying to that player....we don't fear you at all....Youk already left with a chip on his shoulder.

 

If you are going to get nothing and lets face it...the Sox got nothing....send the guy far far away. There is no reason to risk anything when you are getting nothing in return.

[a700hitter]

I think the general consensus among fans is that Youkilis would probably play much better once he was traded. But the alternative was to keep him around' date=' have him continue to upset the clubhouse and get paid an additional couple of million to sit on the bench.[/quote']And if he had to go somewhere else to play better and they felt compelled to get rid of him, I guess you think it was a good idea to give him to a team where he could play much better against us.

[2004 ALCS]

These 4 games were not theoretical. We need to play more than .500 ball in the second half. Every game is big from here on out' date=' especially home games.[/quote']

 

So if Youkilis played poorly in these four games, it would have made the trade better?

[2004 ALCS]

And if he had to go somewhere else to play better and they felt compelled to get rid of him' date=' I guess you think it was a good idea to give him to a team where he could play much better against us.[/quote']

 

As I've already pointed out, regardless of where he went he could play well against us.

[a700hitter]

Getting off Youkilis, has anyone noticed the last 2 years that Lester has a klot of problems whenever it is really hot and humid. He always seems to have really s***** command on those nights. He seems to be gassed on those nights. Is this guy out of condition?

[a700hitter]

As I've already pointed out' date=' regardless of where he went he could play well against us.[/quote']Really? Are the Reds on our second half schedule?

[a700hitter]

So if Youkilis played poorly in these four games' date=' it would have made the trade better? [/quote']Stop being a jackass.

 

Edit: For the last time, it wasn't a trade. We got nothing.

[2004 ALCS]

Really? Are the red on our second half schedule?

 

They could be if we went to the World Series. And if we don't make it to the World Series then it doesn't matter who we traded Youkilis to anyways.

[2004 ALCS]

Stop being a jackass.

 

Edit: For the last time, it wasn't a trade. We got nothing.

 

OK Bill Clinton. Are you going to argue over the meaning of the word "is" next?

[jung]

I don't know if he is out of condition or not. He was way open as in not squared up anytime he tried to put the ball on the outside edge to a RH hitter....just could not square up at all. I doubt that was fatigue because it was happening pretty early in the game.

 

Every time Salty called for something on the outer half to a RH hitter, Lester simply could not get the ball there. Worse than that he did the same thing every time...he never squared up and left his shoulders open every time...so much so that it almost looked like he was throwing to 1st base.

[a700hitter]

They could be if we went to the World Series. And if we don't make it to the World Series then it doesn't matter who we traded Youkilis to anyways.

You really are dense aren't you. We gave him the opportunity to help keep us from the World Series, and if we miss the playoffs by one game, like we did last year, we can point to tonight. Enough of this already. You are just trying to be annoying. Ignore for you Dutchy, Imperial69.

[2004 ALCS]

You really are dense aren't you. We gave him the opportunity to help keep us from the World Series' date=' and if we miss the playoffs by one game, like we did last year, we can point to tonight. Enough of this already. You are just trying to be annoying. Ignore for you Dutchy, Imperial69.[/quote']

 

You really think the difference between whether we make the World Series or not is going to be whether we played Kevin Youkilis for four games? You just want to bitch.

[redsoxbeatz]

This blows. God damnit. Youk or not, w/o Youk we win, w/o everyone but Youk we win... Team defeated us. WMB & Salty really dropped the ball (of course Salty did but I expected better from WMB.)

 

Shoppach should be our starting guy right now. Bring up Lavs. Trade one of them!

[SemperFi Sox]

Thanks Cherington! I'm sure the dodgers were willing to give up a bag of balls for Youk.

[a700hitter]

Thanks Cherington! I'm sure the dodgers were willing to give up a bag of balls for Youk.

At least we would have gotten some use from a bag of balls. But what are you talking about. Youkilis didn't beat us yesterday. That was just some player with a big ugly ole bald head that hit that 3 run HR and scored another run. It wasn't Youkilis who accounted for 4 of the teams 7 runs.

[SemperFi Sox]

At least we would have gotten some use from a bag of balls. But what are you talking about. Youkilis didn't beat us yesterday. That was just some player with a big ugly ole bald head that hit that 3 run HR and scored another run. It wasn't Youkilis who accounted for 4 of the teams 7 runs.

 

This FO just makes me want to RAGE, everything they do pisses me off.

[MANNYHOF24]

You really think the difference between whether we make the World Series or not is going to be whether we played Kevin Youkilis for four games? You just want to bitch.

 

One game could be the difference. See 2011.

[SoxFanForsyth]

One game could be the difference. See 2011.

 

I'm sorry man.

 

Kevin Youkilis is not going to be the difference between whether we make the PS or not. Not by a long shot.

 

By this logic, the remaining losses attributed to the other 158 games hold no water on our final record. We won't make or miss a PS because of 1 player on a team that we played 4 games. I'm not saying thats what you're arguing, I think that's what a700 is arguing.

[MANNYHOF24]

I was just reading old postseason GT from 2007 and 2008 and it really made me sad about how long it's been since the Red Sox have really had a meaningful team.

[a700hitter]

I'm sorry man.

 

Kevin Youkilis is not going to be the difference between whether we make the PS or not. Not by a long shot.

 

By this logic, the remaining losses attributed to the other 158 games hold no water on our final record. We won't make or miss a PS because of 1 player on a team that we played 4 games. I'm not saying thats what you're arguing, I think that's what a700 is arguing.

I am arguing that if you are going to give away a player who can still perform at a high level, you send him to the NL where he can't hurt you. It is pretty simple. He hurt us last night-- big time. It didn't have to happen, and we will give him two more shots at us tonight and tomorrow. We are still paying the guy. We got nothing for him, and he is motivated to beat us. It's just stupid. SFF, I understand that you are always optimistic about the team's chances, but rooting for the team doesn't mean that you have to support every decision of the FO and management. I don't think this game will end up meaning anything in the end. At least, I hope not. However, we did lose by a single game last year. They never should have sent him to a situation where he could beat us or impact our post-season chances. If he beats us the next two nights, you won't have to worry about arguing with me, because my head will have exploded.

[Divinity]

I am arguing that if you are going to give away a player who can still perform at a high level' date=' you send him to the NL where he can't hurt you. It is pretty simple. He hurt us last night-- big time. It didn't have to happen, and we will give him two more shots at us tonight and tomorrow. We are still paying the guy. We got nothing for him, and he is motivated to beat us. It's just stupid. SFF, I understand that you are always optimistic about the team's chances, but rooting for the team doesn't mean that you have to support every decision of the FO and management. I don't think this game will end up meaning anything in the end. At least, I hope not. However, we did lose by a single game last year. They never should have sent him to a situation where he could beat us or impact our post-season chances. If he beats us the next two nights, you won't have to worry about arguing with me, because my head will have exploded.[/quote']

 

If you're that worried about him beating you why don't you just walk him?

[a700hitter]

If you're that worried about him beating you why don't you just walk him?

Remy thought he was working around him. he should have been walked in that situation.

[2004 ALCS]

If you're that worried about him beating you why don't you just walk him?

 

Because then he couldn't bitch as much.