Showalter Takes a Shot at Theo

[a700hitter]

This just reinforces my opinion that Buck is the second biggest idiot in sports. This dope walked/got himself fired from the Yankees after he helped build that team into a budding dynasty and Joe Torre got to reap all of the benefits.

 

http://www.boston.com/sports/baseball/redsox/extras/extra_bases/2011/03/orioles_manager.html

 

"I’d like to see how smart Theo Epstein is with the Tampa Bay payroll. You got Carl Crawford ’cause you paid more than anyone else, and that’s what makes you smarter? That’s why I like whipping their butt. It’s great, knowing those guys with the $205 million payroll are saying, ‘How the hell are they beating us?’ ”

[SoxFanForsyth]

Hey Buck. Wake me up when you win 90 games. Otherwise shut the hell up. You've been successful 1 time, and you've managed the Yankees, so get bent.

[Bredsox]

So, because we have money, we shouldnt use it to our benefit?

[Dipre]

Lol says a guy who used to manage the Yankees. Lol.

[a700hitter]

get bent.

:lol: I haven't heard that expression in years. That brings me back. How old are you?

[RedSoxfanforlife305]

Lol says a guy who used to manage the Yankees. Lol.

 

That's what I'm saying lol? I didn't know this until I read the article and when I saw that I was like how can you possibly complain about payroll?

 

@a700 if Buck is the second biggest idiot in sports who is the first? :dunno:

 

Sorry for being offtopic just kind of curious.

[italstallianion]

That's what I'm saying lol? I didn't know this until I read the article and when I saw that I was like how can you possibly complain about payroll?

 

@a700 if Buck is the second biggest idiot in sports who is the first? :dunno:

 

Sorry for being offtopic just kind of curious.

 

 

I doubt that a700 and I are going to agree as to who is first, but my vote goes for Al Davis.

[a700hitter]

That's what I'm saying lol? I didn't know this until I read the article and when I saw that I was like how can you possibly complain about payroll?

 

@a700 if Buck is the second biggest idiot in sports who is the first? :dunno:

 

Sorry for being offtopic just kind of curious.

Ryne Sandberg: for walking away from the last 2 years of the biggest contract in his career to spend more time with his family. When he did that, I thought he was a fool and I predicted that he would come back begging for his job the following Spring. Well, two maybe three weeks later, his wife filed for divorce after her fool of a husband retired to spend time with his family and work on his marriage. He came back to the Cubs begging for his job the following spring. Of course, instead of letting him have the 2 year/ $14 million that he walked away from, they gave him $1 million. A fool and his money are soon parted.

[yankees228]

How did Buck walk away/get himself fired from the Yankees? By all accounts he was forced out by ownership.

[a700hitter]

How did Buck walk away/get himself fired from the Yankees? By all accounts he was forced out by ownership.

Buck forced their hand by being a jackass.

[Wasatch]

Lol says a guy who used to manage the Yankees. Lol.

 

I'm telling ya those Yankmees are idiots. Go Redsox!

[Palodios]

Ryne Sandberg: for walking away from the last 2 years of the biggest contract in his career to spend more time with his family. When he did that' date=' I thought he was a fool and I predicted that he would come back begging for his job the following Spring. Well, two maybe three weeks later, his wife filed for divorce after her fool of a husband retired to spend time with his family and work on his marriage. He came back to the Cubs begging for his job the following spring. Of course, instead of letting him have the 2 year/ $14 million that he walked away from, they gave him $1 million. A fool and his money are soon parted.[/quote']

 

In a divorce settlement, is a wife entitled to half of the money a player is going to make in the future based on a contract he earned when with her?

[a700hitter]

In a divorce settlement' date=' is a wife entitled to half of the money a player is going to make in the future based on a contract he earned when with her?[/quote']

No, she is entitled to half of marital property. Future wages are not marital property. She was probably entitled to alimony. Even if Sandberg had to pay her half, he'd be left with $7 million instead of $500k.

[Northern Star]

I doubt that a700 and I are going to agree as to who is first' date=' but my vote goes for Al Davis.[/quote']

 

Al is an idiot, but I'd argue Dan Snyder is more of one.

[Emmz]

The former GM of the Lions trumps them all. Millen I think his name was, yeah, that guy was a dumbass.

[italstallianion]

If being a jackass counts too then Al Davis has to be top 5.

[a700hitter]

The former GM of the Lions trumps them all. Millen I think his name was' date=' yeah, that guy was a dumbass.[/quote']Millen was a total incompetent, but he managed to keep his job much longer than he deserved. In that respect, he was not an idiot. Incompetency is not idiocy. Showalter is a good manager, but he is an idiot.

[BigPapiEnFuego]

Wow I see everyone getting real defensive over this, but really, think about it. What would he do with Tampa Bay level money? He's drafted good players, but take away that and you got someone making moves anyone with a large amount of money could make.

[ORS]

I actually think it is more difficult for large market GMs. What hard decisions does a small market GM have to make? They are out of the market for big FA talent, so they aren't really exposed to the risk of big flops jamming up their resources. They have little to no resources. The expectations are lower, so if the minor FAs they commit to do flop, well, it's not like anyone expected grand results. They need to focus on pretty much one thing. Scouting, both make sure they draft well, and to make sure that when they do trade their pre-FA stars away they are getting good players in return. And, with those young players, they don't have to have the same level of concern about enduring rookie stuggles while trying to contend.

 

EDIT: It's not more difficult for the big market GMs to be successful, ie win more games. The job itself, is more difficult though, IMO.

[italstallianion]

I'd imagine that there's much more pressure to be a large market GM since you'll be on the receiving end of a larger number of angry sports fans if you fail, whereas most KC fans are probably unaware that the Royals are still a team.

[yankees228]

Buck forced their hand by being a jackass.

 

To the best of my knowledge (reports from the time), this is misrepresenting what happened. Sure Buck can be overbearing, but that's his style and George and Stick Michael knew that going in. He was forced out because George was an idiot, and based his decisions on small samplings (1995 ALDS).

 

EDIT: Buster Olney (Last Night Of The Yankees' Dynasty) and Joel Sherman (Birth Of A Dynasty) give a lot of details supporting this as well.

[Dipre]

Wow I see everyone getting real defensive over this' date=' but really, think about it. What would he do with Tampa Bay level money? He's drafted good players, but take away that and you got someone making moves anyone with a large amount of money could make.[/quote']

 

That's exactly the point. If he can draft well here, imagine what he would do with a team that amassed as many top-echelon draft picks in the last decade and a half as TB.

 

Besides, there's simply not as much pressure for a small-market GM, and you can still fail miserably with large quantities of resources as well (Omar Minaya comes to mind). It's not that people are getting defensive, it's that it was a stupid statement. Money does not guarantee success. Ask the pre-2009 Yankees. They didn't win a WS since 2000 precisely because of incorrect use of resources.

[BigPapiEnFuego]

True, true. Points taken

[BOSOX11]

I've had repect for Buck until now. Talk about a sour grapes attitude.

 

And if you want to know who would make the top five idiot list, try the Boston parking lot attendant that owns the Dodgers.

[Dojji]

Attention recieved, mission accomplished.

[a700hitter]

To the best of my knowledge (reports from the time), this is misrepresenting what happened. Sure Buck can be overbearing, but that's his style and George and Stick Michael knew that going in. He was forced out because George was an idiot, and based his decisions on small samplings (1995 ALDS).

 

EDIT: Buster Olney (Last Night Of The Yankees' Dynasty) and Joel Sherman (Birth Of A Dynasty) give a lot of details supporting this as well.

There were an equal number of reports that Buck wanted out and walked. The Boss clearlty wanted him gone, but he was a popular manager who had taken the team to its first post season in 14 years, so it was going to be difficult to fire him. They needed it to look like it was a mutual parting of the ways. Buck cooperated, because he wanted out due to the fact that he is a huge idiot. Anyone who has a great job and who is successful at that job, but nevertheless manages to irritate the boss to the point of getting discharged is a fool. Buck was his own undoing with the Yankees, not the Boss.

[FredLynn]

I am not sure what Showalter said that wasn't true. Epstein acknowledged as much-that is much tougher to manage when you have a lot less money to work with. Showalter also said that Jeter "ticks him off" by jumping back from so many pitches to try to influence the balls and strikes calls by the umpires. While Jeter does irritate some with the way he plays, he plays the game right- to win, and I respect that. IMO Showalter was just stating the truth, as much as some of us would not like to hear it. It is the fact of his saying these things out loud that are usually just understood that is putting him under fire.

Here is what Theo said:

 

“It’s easy to get defensive when people attribute a lot of our success to our payroll,’’ Epstein told Borges. “To a degree they’re right, but it’s still a challenge. It’s definitely easier the more money you have

[Dipre]

That's called being diplomatic.

 

If it's so much easier to manage a team when you have money, why does Omar Minaya not have a job?

 

The "win-now" mentality of teams that spend more money is a definite pressure point of why handling a city with high expectations for a team is not easy.

 

It is what it is.

[DirtDog]

I think people are being WAAAAY to hard on this guy. The Orioles have a little buzz this year and they played really decent ball down the stretch last year under Showalter. I think whether his comments are the truth or not it doesn't matter. In my opinion he's trying to fire his squad up, get a little swagger for them and build an identity. They've been a doormat for too long.

 

This year their lineup is nothing groundbreaking, but it's pretty formidable. They have some young pitching and if it develops they could make a little noise. I still stand by my prediction that they could win 80 games and even contend with the Rays this year for 3rd place. Good for Showalter, deep down I think I'm rooting for his team a bit.

[Divinity]

Lol says a guy who used to manage the Yankees. Lol.

 

Yankees weren't always miles ahead of everyone else in salary, when Showalter started managing Yankees in 1992 the team had a payroll of 34,902,292.00