Adrian Beltre Performance thread.

[SCM33]

Ive been hesitant to post about Beltre. With his early defensive woes, I was tempted to post a "I told you so" response. I kept waiting.....I kept waiting for him to falter offensively. He wasnt hitting for power, and again I was tempted to post "I told you so". He then started hitting for EXB power. I was then tempted to post about his HR numbers......There is nothing more that needs to be proven.

 

Dipre, even though I have not said it on the forums, I am admitting my personal flawed secretive Beltre thoughts.

 

With 2 big flys today, a .341 AVG, team leading RBI numbers and much improved defense....I think he has proven a lot of us wrong.

[jdr0317]

If this wasn't just my third post on this forum, I would definitely be linking up the article I wrote about how Adrian Beltre would play well in 2010.

 

Though I will be posting it on facebook for all my fellow Sox fans who profess more to the b***h and moan party in the nation.

[Jasonbay44]

I'm glad to hear this, just a few weeks ago numerous people (not directed at you) wanted Lowell to start over him

 

With 2 big flys today, a .341 AVG, team leading RBI numbers and much improved defense....I think he has proven a lot of us wrong.

And he's proven some people right.

[jdr0317]

I'm glad to hear this, just a few weeks ago numerous people (not directed at you) wanted Lowell to start over him

 

 

And he's proven some people right.

 

I would laugh, but I was admittedly in the view of DHing Lowell over Ortiz

 

It was hard to imagine for awhile a surge like he's had given how feeble he looked in trying to recreate 2004-07 and pull everything.

[TedWilliams101]

I don't get why some of you guys feel he had to PROVE anything? When a guy who is a career .289, .339, .826 hitter is having some HR outages (he had plenty of XBH) and is having defensive problems, despite winning back to back Gold Gloves just 2 years ago, for the first month playing for a new team, would you think it's a slump or a crappy player?

 

That's the problem. If it was Youk, we just say he was in a slump, but bring in a new guy who some just don't like, he just sucks and is a bad move...

[jdr0317]

I don't get why some of you guys feel he had to PROVE anything? When a guy who is a career .289, .339, .826 hitter is having some HR outages (he had plenty of XBH) and is having defensive problems, despite winning back to back Gold Gloves just 2 years ago, for the first month playing for a new team, would you think it's a slump or a crappy player?

 

That's the problem. If it was Youk, we just say he was in a slump, but bring in a new guy who some just don't like, he just sucks and is a bad move...

 

J.D. Drew totally took Trot's number and he isn't gritty and doesn't drive in enough runs.

HE SUCKS.

 

/is thrilled our GM in the winter of 2007 was Theo Epstein and not Ed Wade

[Dipre]

Ah yes, this is now my favorite thread. Now all i need is for Drew to go on one of his patented "Carry the team on my back" stretches and all will be good in the world.

[Dipre]

J.D. Drew totally took Trot's number and he isn't gritty and doesn't drive in enough runs.

HE SUCKS.

 

/is thrilled our GM in the winter of 2007 was Theo Epstein and not Ed Wade

 

I like you.

[Dipre]

 

With 2 big flys today, a .341 AVG, team leading RBI numbers and much improved defense....I think he has proven a lot of us wrong.

 

Not me, my good sir, not me. /endbackpatting.

[a700hitter]

LOL@ all the Beltre threads. At the beginning of the season, he played a few games with his head up his ass at 3rd base. I don't think anyone questioned his ability to play good defense, except maybe for Jacko who was clearly breaking balls. After last night's game, he is on pace to hit 20-25 HRs, which is about his career norm. Hitting behind a hot Ortiz all year could move that number up closer to 30.

 

The abuse Beltre took was nowhere near what Ortiz experienced. So, many people buried had buried Ortiz when he had far less than 100 ABs. He was about 70 ABs into the season and people wanted to release him. That ******* Rosenthal even floated the unsubstantiated and probably completely fabricated rumor that the Sox were going to cut him. The piece of s*** Rosenthal was probably trolling TalkSox for the rumor. No one was talking about DFA'ing Beltre- no one. The fact is that Beltre had. Uncharacteristically made too many errors early in the season (most of the mental variety) some of which cost games and he was justifiably criticized for it.

 

Now that he is performing as expected, the Sox FO is still presented with a conundrum for 2011. If he continues to perform, he probably opts out of his 2011 contract and walks. Would the consequence of that be that the Sox sign VMart to play first base while moving Youk across the diamond to third? If Beltre doesn't perform and he exercises his 2011 option to stay with the Sox, do the Sox let Vmart walk, because he is not a good full time catcher? There would only be room for him if the FO let's Ortiz walk, and I don't see that happening if he hits 30 HR s and 100+ RBI. The FO options are better and more clear cut if Beltre performs and walks IMO. What do you think?

[Dipre]

1) This is not about Ortiz, this is about the awesomeness that is Beltre.

 

2) The reason why Ortiz took so much more abuse than Beltre (when people were pining for Lowell to start at third and Beltre be benched or cut, let it be known) is that even when he was sucking it up with the mental errors, he was still displaying great range, and "hitting with the banjo", when Ortiz was slumping, he was providing nothing to the club. I'm one of the biggest Ortiz supporters, even keeping him in my avatar through his struggles, but he looked toast. The bat speed was there, but he seemed to be pressing, and losing playing time to Lowell wasn't helping, i'm actually surprised he broke out in such a grand way.

 

3) Let Beltre play his season out, then see what happens.

 

4) Beltre is still out-performing Bay, and i shall enjoy it while it lasts. :thumbsup:

[a700hitter]

As with the myth of Drew hate which was thoroughly debunked in a recent poll, I think you have over-dramatized the Beltre hate. No one with any credibility suggested cutting him. I only brought up Ortiz to put the Beltre hate in context. Less than 100 ABs and people wanted to send him to the glue farm. I still can't believe it. Beltre had several f*** ups early on and deserved criticism, but no one knowledgeable or responsible and certainly no one in the press suggested cutting him.

 

As for outperforming Bay, you might get to enjoy that for longer than you think. It was a hot night at Citifield last night and the ball was carrying, but that ballpark still played big. Several balls were caught for outs to left and right fields that would have been out of Citizens Bank Field. The outfield is just so massive there.

 

I know that you are basking in the glow of last night, but what possibilities do you see with regard to the personnel moves after this season with Beltre and VMart?

[Dipre]

As with the myth of Drew hate which was thoroughly debunked in a recent poll' date=' I think you have over-dramatized the Beltre hate. No one with any credibility suggested cutting him. I only brought up Ortiz to put the Beltre hate in context. Less than 100 ABs and people wanted to send him to the glue farm. I still can't believe it. Beltre had several f*** ups early on and deserved criticism, but no one knowledgeable or responsible and certainly no one in the press suggested cutting him.[/quote']

 

Coincidentially, just like the Drew hate, the Beltre hate was propagated by the "Watch the gamezzzz!!!111!!!" syndicate, which you are a proud member of.

 

As for outperforming Bay, you might get to enjoy that for longer than you think. It was a hot night at Citifield last night and the ball was carrying, but that ballpark still played big. Several balls were caught for outs to left and right fields that would have been out of Citizens Bank Field. The outfield is just so massive there.

 

What about his road suckage? As soon as that turns around, the OPS will hit .900 soon after.

 

I know that you are basking in the glow of last night, but what possibilities do you see with regard to the personnel moves after this season with Beltre and VMart?

 

Beltre has a decent season and moves on, the V-Mart/V-Tek tandem stays, with the Sox adding another bat in the offseason.

[rhet]

I picked up Beltre off the waiver wire in my other league. I'm a believer, until he hits the skids.

[Dipre]

I picked up Beltre off the waiver wire in my other league. I'm a believer' date=' until he hits the skids.[/quote']

 

Same here in the TS league.

[a700hitter]

Coincidentially' date=' just like the Drew hate, the Beltre hate was propagated by the "Watch the gamezzzz!!!111!!!" syndicate, which you are a proud member of.[/quote']This is a baseless paranoid accusation. I have seen Beltre play several times in person in ST and the regular season, and I have formed no negative opinion of his skills. He still could be a little more patient at the plate, but his skills are there. Beltre's issues had to do with dumb plays. That criticism came from everyone, not just the "Watch the gamezzz!!!" syndicate. lol!!

[Dipre]

This is a baseless paranoid accusation. I have seen Beltre play several times in person in ST and the regular season' date=' and I have formed no negative opinion of his skills. He still could be a little more patient at the plate, but his skills are there. Beltre's issues had to do with dumb plays. That criticism came from everyone, not just the "Watch the gamezzz!!!" syndicate. lol!![/quote']

 

Hey, but you know the "WATCH THE GAMEZZZZ!!!!!111!!" syndicate spearheaded the offensive. Don't defend your fellow members, kind sir.

[TheMino007]

Its May, relax, he still has bad form at 3rd base, still doesn't get his body in front of balls, still backs up on balls and still short hopps them to first. With the exception of a couple of defensive plays this year I haven't been thrilled with him. As for his offense, people are saying he is finally playing like they expected him to? Who the hell expected him to be hitting .341 right now? No one. Beltre is one hell of a hot streak, don't get me wrong I love it, but the parade won't last forever. His BA, OBP, Slugg, OPS are all above his career norms in Seattle, and even with all the park adjustment from moving over from Safeco to Fenway for 81 games a year, his production is still due to drop off. Did I expect him to have a 800 ish OPS, sure; did expect him to hit 20-25ish home runs, sure, but the average won't be this high all year. He can have a great year this year but after this year is walking away for the $, so no sense in getting attached to him.

[Dipre]

Its May' date=' relax, he still has bad form at 3rd base, still doesn't get his body in front of balls, still backs up on balls and still short hopps them to first. With the exception of a couple of defensive plays this year I haven't been thrilled with him. As for his offense, people are saying he is finally playing like they expected him to? Who the hell expected him to be hitting .341 right now? No one. Beltre is one hell of a hot streak, don't get me wrong I love it, but the parade won't last forever. His BA, OBP, Slugg, OPS are all above his career norms in Seattle, and even with all the park adjustment from moving over from Safeco to Fenway for 81 games a year, his production is still due to drop off. Did I expect him to have a 800 ish OPS, sure; did expect him to hit 20-25ish home runs, sure, but the average won't be this high all year. He can have a great year this year but after this year is walking away for the $, so no sense in getting attached to him.[/quote']

 

Wait, aren't you the guy who's always telling others to watch the games? If you do, you'd have noticed that he always gets into position to field balls well and he usually makes good throws to first. Don't make stuff up to suit your argument.

 

Also, what does the fact of him going after the year have to do with "getting attached"? He's a Red Sox now, and it's now when his production matters.

 

Oh, and i find the "It's still May" part of this post both hilarious and ridiculous.

[TheMino007]

I find it hilarious that you no longer bring up the Its still early card b/c the Sox are streaking.

[Dipre]

I find it hilarious that you no longer bring up the Its still early card b/c the Sox are streaking.

 

Oh it's obviously still early, but this is what the team is supposed to be doing, at least pitching wise, or am i incorrect?

 

Besides, disagreeing with the premise initially, then trying to use it (at a much later date mind you, when what is and isn't in the season is much more defined) is hypocritical.

[VA Sox Fan]

Beltre has been a beast for the Sox

 

Posted by Peter Abraham, Globe Staff June 29, 2010 02:27 PM

 

Be honest. You were down on Adrian Beltre after spring training and the first two weeks of the season.

 

He wasn't hitting home runs. He was making silly errors. You wondered what the heck Theo Epstein was thinking, even if it was a one-year deal.

 

Now be honest again. Aren't you thinking about getting a Beltre jersey the next time you're at the park? The guy has been carrying the team.

 

Check out these numbers from his last 59 games:

 

.359 batting average

.404 on-base percentage

.602 slugging percentage

12 home runs

46 RBIs

 

Outside of maybe Scott Rolen, who's having an under-the-radar monster season for the Reds, Beltre is the best third baseman in baseball at the moment. Evan Longoria, in town with the Rays tonight, has an .890 OPS. Beltre is at .926.

 

Defensively, Beltre has the best UZR/150 in the American League and it's not even close. He has 13 errors, but focus on the ground that he covers. The guy has more range than Robert DeNiro and makes throws that are ridiculous.

 

Scott Boras will take his client into the market after the season. But at this point, wouldn't the Sox be crazy not to try and keep him?

[Palodios]

Beltre is good and all, but remember who his agent is. Beltre will be 32 and expensive next year. If Youk was playing 3rd right now, he'd be the best offensive 3rd basemen in the MLB, opening up 1B for an offensive powerhouse.

[Dipre]

The man shouldn't be touched with a ten-foot pole in the offseason. Most people don't believe in it but i do: Dude's in contract mode.

[msubulldogs21]

Most people don't believe in it but i do: Dude's in contract mode.

 

Entirely believable. He's 31 and pushing for one last big contract. If he keeps up this pace, someone will no doubt overpay for him big time.

[Dojji]

I'd sign him to a Wakefield style perpetual option year set at ~$9-12M. Contract years every year, and plenty of moola to tempt Boras.

[WhiskeyBreath]

That would never happen.

[jacksonianmarch]

Beltre is gonna try and get another 5 yr deal for Beltre, I guarantee it

[Palodios]

In this market, Beltre just hasnt shown the consistency of a guy who is getting a 5 year contract. Only one position player got a contract longer than 4 years after the 2009 season, and Beltre is no Holliday.

[jsc1973]

Beltre is doing what a player does when he spends his entire career in horrible hitter's parks and then suddenly goes somewhere and finds out his foul balls don't all get caught and his fly balls don't go to die. I remember another defense-first third baseman named Terry Pendleton doing the same thing when he went from St. Louis to the Launching Pad. He went from .250 to a batting champ and MVP overnight.

 

I would have been surprised if Beltre hadn't busted loose. And you'd better believe Boras knew what was going to happen, too. That's why he encouraged Beltre to sign.

 

I wish we could keep him for another couple of years, but Boras is going to try to get Beltre one more big contract. And he might just get someone to bite.