Unofficial Adrian Gonzalez thread.

[I sexed Ortiz]

Lineup has little to know effect on how you hit. if they pitched around him why are you using stats from IBB which have no meaning.

 

A lineup has no effect? Really

 

So if Pujols hit in this lineup

1. Lugo

2. Loretta

3. Pujols

4. Reed Johnson.

5. Tek

6. Melvin Mora

7. Coco Crisp

8. Rocco Baldelli

9 pitcher

 

He'll hit the same in this lineup?

1. Hanley

2. Pedroia

3. Pujols

4. Mauer

5. Holliday

6. Braun

7. A-rod

8. Sizemore

pitcher spot

 

OH REALLY?

[I sexed Ortiz]

You've changed your argument so many times it's confusing where you stand.

 

I'm going to ask you this: What is your point, exactly, and stick to it. I came in here to see you stating that OBP is not effected by the ballpark, and you've changed to "It does, but so does lineup". Well no s***, we always knew that.

 

my point

 

Youk and Gonzalez would both produce in 3rd spot, yes their stats would be different but YES they would BOTH PRODUCE.

[Emmz]

Did you see the spray chart that showed that about 15 fly outs as Petco would have been homers in Fenway? Not to mention, more at Yankee Stadium?

[Emmz]

A lineup has no effect? Really

 

So if Pujols hit in this lineup

1. Lugo

2. Loretta

3. Pujols

4. Reed Johnson.

5. Tek

6. Melvin Mora

7. Coco Crisp

8. Rocco Baldelli

9 pitcher

 

He'll hit the same in this lineup?

1. Hanley

2. Pedroia

3. Pujols

4. Mauer

5. Holliday

6. Braun

7. A-rod

8. Sizemore

pitcher spot

 

OH REALLY?

 

I've always stated that a lineup has an effect, but you've stated, if I can find the quote in a sec I will, that park has no effect on that whatsoever.

 

Make your points more clearly.

[I sexed Ortiz]

Did you see the spray chart that showed that about 15 fly outs as Petco would have been homers in Fenway? Not to mention' date=' more at Yankee Stadium?[/quote']

 

So he'll see those exact same pitches and hit them in that exact same spot this year? WOW, YOU KNOW DA FUTURE. Do saints win super bowl?

[I sexed Ortiz]

I've always stated that a lineup has an effect, but you've stated, if I can find the quote in a sec I will, that park has no effect on that whatsoever.

 

Make your points more clearly.

 

the other guy said "LINEUP HAS LITTLE TO NO EFFECT"

[bsox0407]

A lineup has no effect? Really

 

So if Pujols hit in this lineup

1. Lugo

2. Loretta

3. Pujols

4. Reed Johnson.

5. Tek

6. Melvin Mora

7. Coco Crisp

8. Rocco Baldelli

9 pitcher

 

He'll hit the same in this lineup?

1. Hanley

2. Pedroia

3. Pujols

4. Mauer

5. Holliday

6. Braun

7. A-rod

8. Sizemore

pitcher spot

 

OH REALLY?

 

The park matters they hit in. Fenway. he will hit better no matter what. Petco. Safeco. Not the same story. Pujols can be had. If he was a perfect hitter his BA would be 1.000 not .300 see people do take risks at them.

[bsox0407]

So he'll see those exact same pitches and hit them in that exact same spot this year? WOW' date=' YOU KNOW DA FUTURE. Do saints win super bowl?[/quote']

 

Do you see the now. Do you have a brain? Plz you say he will. but when we say he won't we are automatically wrong.

[I sexed Ortiz]

The park matters they hit in. Fenway. he will hit better no matter what. Petco. Safeco. Not the same story. Pujols can be had. If he was a perfect hitter his BA would be 1.000 not .300 see people do take risks at them.

 

if that lineup hit in Petco or safeco, they'd still produce.

 

Okay, yes, the park matters, but so does lineup.

 

Padres lineup would still suck in fenway aside from Agon, Red Sox lineup could still be "impressive at petco". Based on splits and career games at national league west parks.

[Emmz]

my point

 

Youk and Gonzalez would both produce in 3rd spot, yes their stats would be different but YES they would BOTH PRODUCE.

 

Of course they would. Just as Gonzalez would product at any park, as would Albert Pujols. I'm a firm believer that Youkilis is 3rd hole worthy, and if we land Gonzalez, he should be our primary 3rd hitter. However, Gonzalez is the more productive hitter overall, and in Boston, I could see him hitting closer to 50 home runs, and of course, his OBP would also go up.

 

People forget that Youkilis actually had a higher OPS than Tex did in New York (He's always considered VASTLY superior to Youk, but he sure as s*** isn't). Youk is a very productive hitter, there's no question to that.

[bsox0407]

if that lineup hit in Petco or safeco, they'd still produce.

 

Okay, yes, the park matters, but so does lineup.

 

Padres lineup would still suck in fenway aside from Agon, Red Sox lineup could still be "impressive at petco". Based on splits and career games at national league west parks.

 

You are the kind of pitcher that says because he looks like a power hitter ill walk him. How many times did they go after him. Do you just give any old power hitter a walk.

 

And please answer. Do you watch the Padres games to know he gets pitched around.

[Emmz]

the other guy said "LINEUP HAS LITTLE TO NO EFFECT"

 

It definitely does have a tremendous effect, but bsox actually said it in another thread, that if Albert Pujols and Ryan Howard switched places (teams), that Pujols' numbers would skyrocket, while Howard's while sink tremendously. I think you must be misinterpreting what he's said.

[I sexed Ortiz]

Of course they would. Just as Gonzalez would product at any park, as would Albert Pujols. I'm a firm believer that Youkilis is 3rd hole worthy, and if we land Gonzalez, he should be our primary 3rd hitter. However, Gonzalez is the more productive hitter overall, and in Boston, I could see him hitting closer to 50 home runs, and of course, his OBP would also go up.

 

People forget that Youkilis actually had a higher OPS than Tex did in New York (He's always considered VASTLY superior to Youk, but he sure as s*** isn't). Youk is a very productive hitter, there's no question to that.

Exactly, It doesn't matter too me where Gonzalez or Youk hits, they'll both produce regardless of spot in order. This has been my point, I wasn't trying to get into a Gonzalez/Youk debate, I should of made my point more clearer, all I was trying to state is that Youk is clearly as capable as hitting 3rd as Gonzalez.

[Emmz]

if that lineup hit in Petco or safeco, they'd still produce.

 

Okay, yes, the park matters, but so does lineup.

 

Padres lineup would still suck in fenway aside from Agon, Red Sox lineup could still be "impressive at petco". Based on splits and career games at national league west parks.

 

You're absolutely right, but acknowledging that is very key. It leads to misinterpretations.

[I sexed Ortiz]

You are the kind of pitcher that says because he looks like a power hitter ill walk him. How many times did they go after him. Do you just give any old power hitter a walk.

 

And please answer. Do you watch the Padres games to know he gets pitched around.

Any power hitter? NO. If its 10-0 and Gonzalez is up with bases loaded do I give a f*** if he homers? NO.

 

And YES, I actually do. I have MLB extra innings and often watch Padre games as I am interested in the NL west due to the Giants and Dodgers.

[Emmz]

Exactly' date=' It doesn't matter too me where Gonzalez or Youk hits, they'll both produce regardless of spot in order. This has been my point, I wasn't trying to get into a Gonzalez/Youk debate, I should of made my point more clearer, all I was trying to state is that Youk is clearly as capable as hitting 3rd as Gonzalez.[/quote']

 

They're both capable of middle-of-the-order hitting, as they are both made to be run-producers.

[bsox0407]

It definitely does have a tremendous effect' date=' but bsox actually said it in another thread, that if Albert Pujols and Ryan Howard switched places (teams), that Pujols' numbers would skyrocket, while Howard's while sink tremendously. I think you must be misinterpreting what he's said.[/quote']

 

in this situation Emmz. it has less effect because as he previously stated that it couldn't happen because of the park.

 

Emmz. Ill ask you this. Bases empty two out in Petco. Gonzalez up do you pitch around him and walk him and go after the next guy. Same situation in Fenway with the same lineup.

[I sexed Ortiz]

They're both capable of middle-of-the-order hitting' date=' as they are both made to be run-producers.[/quote']

 

I agree. I just hope this is a situation that Francona actually does have to make a decision about.

[bsox0407]

Any power hitter? NO. If its 10-0 and Gonzalez is up with bases loaded do I give a f*** if he homers? NO.

 

And YES, I actually do. I have MLB extra innings and often watch Padre games as I am interested in the NL west due to the Giants and Dodgers.

 

You care that he hits a HR if you are up 10-0. give the guy in the On deck circle a chance to keep the rally alive after walking him. What if he hits one out. what if he doubles now the train keeps moving along. momentum.

[bsox0407]

I agree. I just hope this is a situation that Francona actually does have to make a decision about.

 

Youk is not gonna hit third if we have Gonzo and Holliday.

[I sexed Ortiz]

in this situation Emmz. it has less effect because as he previously stated that it couldn't happen because of the park.

 

Emmz. Ill ask you this. Bases empty two out in Petco. Gonzalez up do you pitch around him and walk him and go after the next guy. Same situation in Fenway with the same lineup.

 

Depends what the score is. if its close Id pitch around him, see if he fishes at any bad pitches, if not, he can take his base and ill gladly have my pitch go after Blanks or Kouzmanoff instead. You don't let gonzalez beat you.

[I sexed Ortiz]

Youk is not gonna hit third if we have Gonzo and Holliday.

 

You never know, Julio Lugo led off a few times last year.

[Emmz]

in this situation Emmz. it has less effect because as he previously stated that it couldn't happen because of the park.

 

Emmz. Ill ask you this. Bases empty two out in Petco. Gonzalez up do you pitch around him and walk him and go after the next guy. Same situation in Fenway with the same lineup.

 

Depends on inning and score, too.

[bsox0407]

Depends what the score is. if its close Id pitch around him' date=' see if he fishes at any bad pitches, if not, he can take his base and ill gladly have my pitch go after Blanks or Kouzmanoff instead. You don't let gonzalez beat you.[/quote']

 

Let him beat me if its a tie score. you are not gonna pitch to his hot zones. Now what if Blanks hits a HR. down one run or Two.

[bsox0407]

Depends on inning and score' date=' too.[/quote']

 

7th your leading 3-2. its Daniel Bard pitching.

[bsox0407]

You never know' date=' Julio Lugo led off a few times last year.[/quote']

 

On a consistent basis. If its not Gonzo Or Holliday there is Always V-mart.

[I sexed Ortiz]

Let him beat me if its a tie score. you are not gonna pitch to his hot zones. Now what if Blanks hits a HR. down one run or Two.

 

Id be okay with Blanks beating me. Its just like Barry Bonds a few years ago, make Benito Santiago beat you, if he does you tip your cap. However, it also all depends on score and inning, if its 2nd inning, runners on 2nd with no one out, id pitch to him, if its 9th inning, tied score, im up by 1 with a runner on, I walk him for the simple fact that he is a chance to go yard every time, Blanks is not.

[I sexed Ortiz]

7th your leading 3-2. its Daniel Bard pitching.

 

Regardless of stadium, if Gonzalez catches up to a bard fastball and hits it on the good part of the bat, its probably gone.

[bsox0407]

Id be okay with Blanks beating me. Its just like Barry Bonds a few years ago' date=' make Benito Santiago beat you, if he does you tip your cap. However, it also all depends on score and inning, if its 2nd inning, runners on 2nd with no one out, id pitch to him, if its 9th inning, tied score, im up by 1 with a runner on, I walk him for the simple fact that he is a chance to go yard every time, Blanks is not.[/quote']

 

In Petco Park. I take my chances with Bonds. 9th inning with a runner on first. up one. ill take my chances. No way i put a runner in scoring position where a single ties the score.

[I sexed Ortiz]

When Bonds was in his prime, it didn't matter stadium, pitcher or whatever, you don't pitch to that man in a key situation.