2009 World Series: Phillies @ Yankees

[yankees228]

PLZ READ ABOVE.

 

I don't think you can get on Optimist for this. TK didn't say what you're saying he said. All he said was "homegrown talent". What he meant by that was another matter, but, by definition, Optimist is correct. Jeter, Rivera, Pettitte, and Posada are all homegrown.

 

Now, I understand that I'm talking about a technicality, but, considering Optimist is far from being blatantly wrong on the issue, I don't think you should really be talking down to her.

[Optimist]

PLZ READ ABOVE.

 

No. Homegrown is homegrown...whether the player started playing in 1995 or 2009. I'd say the former is actually more impressive, developing a player that has been productive for over a decade and been retained by the team for that entire time (minus Pettitte) is no easy task.

[bsox0407]

I don't think you can get on Optimist for this. TK didn't say what you're saying he said. All he said was "homegrown talent". What he meant by that was another matter, but, by definition, Optimist is correct. Jeter, Rivera, Pettitte, and Posada are all homegrown.

 

Now, I understand that I'm talking about a technicality, but, considering Optimist is far from being blatantly wrong on the issue, I don't think you should really be talking down to her.

 

i never said he blatantly wrong but he was reading to far into the subject of being a homegrown player. i agree they are homegrown but jeez 1990s and early 2000s. we knew what he meant.

[yankees228]

i never said he blatantly wrong but he was reading to far into the subject of being a homegrown player. i agree they are homegrown but jeez 1990s and early 2000s. we knew what he meant.

 

The "*******" and "PLZ READ" comments are a little much when you're talking to someone that isn't incorrect on the matter.

[bsox0407]

The "*******" and "PLZ READ" comments are a little much when you're talking to someone that isn't incorrect on the matter.

 

he did make a sweeping generalization like an ******* would. i am just saying. not that he is an *******. i don't know that. And the Plz read was a bring to you attention to show what someone else was really referring to.

[yankees228]

he did make a sweeping generalization like an ******* would. i am just saying. not that he is an *******. i don't know that. And the Plz read was a bring to you attention to show what someone else was really referring to.

 

Whatever, if you can't see how that comes off, then I don't really have anything more to say.

 

Anyway, Optimist is more than capable of speaking for herself. I just found that to be a bit ridiculous.

[bsox0407]

Whatever, if you can't see how that comes off, then I don't really have anything more to say.

 

Anyway, Optimist is more than capable of speaking for herself. I just found that to be a bit ridiculous.

 

it may come off as i was saying optimist was an ******* but in fact i was not. If i was going to call her that hen i would have said YOU ARE AN *******. not the way i did which was like an ******* would. but not calling her one.

[Dipre]

The "they make the more money, so they should spend the most money" argument is ridiculous.

 

Nobody cares about that.

 

The advantage is unfair, and that's that.

 

It's like trying to defend a multiple-killer with a "he did it for his family" argument. Jesus Christ.

[ORS]

Well, that's not necessarily true. For the most part, you're right, but if it wasn't a deterrent, Carlos Beltran would be playing center field for the Yankees right now.

 

However, it is designed to help make other teams competitive. You can't blame the Yankees if those teams pocket the money.

It is not designed to make other teams competitive, that is what revenue sharing is for. The LT money goes to an initiative to develop baseball in countries where it is in its infancy. In fact, the Yankees will likely benefit more than other teams from this initiative because they flex their financial muscle in the IFA market as well. The LT is a joke, IMO, and the Yankees regularly regard it as such.

[yankees228]

It is not designed to make other teams competitive' date=' that is what revenue sharing is for. The LT money goes to an initiative to develop baseball in countries where it is in its infancy. In fact, the Yankees will likely benefit more than other teams from this initiative because they flex their financial muscle in the IFA market as well. The LT is a joke, IMO, and the Yankees regularly regard it as such.[/quote']

 

OK, then I used the wrong term. My bad. Regardless, as you pointed out, due to revenue sharing, the Yankees are forced to share their wealth with smaller market teams.

[yankees228]

The "they make the more money, so they should spend the most money" argument is ridiculous.

 

Nobody cares about that.

 

The advantage is unfair, and that's that.

 

It's like trying to defend a multiple-killer with a "he did it for his family" argument. Jesus Christ.

 

That is a ridiculous analogy. For the most part, baseball operates under capitalist principles. If you look at it that way, it isn't necessary unfair.

[yankees228]

Kilo, also, I don't understand how can you can that the Yankees financial advantage renders the Red Sox financial advantage irrelevant. The goal, in terms of how you create your team, is to make the playoffs. You build your team to perform over a 162 game sample size, and then you take your chances in the playoffs.

 

Boston Red Sox payroll: $121,745,999

Toronto Blue Jays payroll: $80,538,300

Baltimore Orioles payroll: $67,101,666

Tampa Bay Rays payroll: $63,313,034

 

Source: http://www.getlisty.com/preview/2009-mlb-team-payrolls/

 

While the Yankees are best equipped to win the AL East, and have the best record in baseball. The Red Sox are best equipped to win the Wild Card.

 

You make a lot of good points. However, to say the Red Sox advantage is irrelevant, is flat out incorrect.

[Dipre]

That is a ridiculous analogy. For the most part' date=' baseball operates under capitalist principles. If you look at it that way, it isn't necessary unfair.[/quote']

 

Baseball.Is.Not.A.Capitalist.Society.It.Is.A.Sport.

[yankees228]

Baseball.Is.Not.A.Capitalist.Society.It.Is.A.Sport.

 

It's also a business.

[Dipre]

It's also a business.

 

But it's a sport first and foremost.

 

Football, basketball and hockey are also businesses.

[26 to 6]

It is not designed to make other teams competitive, that is what revenue sharing is for. The LT money goes to an initiative to develop baseball in countries where it is in its infancy. In fact, the Yankees will likely benefit more than other teams from this initiative because they flex their financial muscle in the IFA market as well. The LT is a joke, IMO, and the Yankees regularly regard it as such.

Would you prefer there was no luxury tax? Before LT was implemented everyone was crying for it, now that it's in place it's a "joke."

 

What do you think is the best solution?

 

The "they make the more money, so they should spend the most money" argument is ridiculous.

 

Nobody cares about that.

 

The advantage is unfair, and that's that.

 

It's like trying to defend a multiple-killer with a "he did it for his family" argument. Jesus Christ.

Forgive me, I'm sitting here scratching my head because that made NO SENSE, especially the last part. NONE. Idk how you could compare the two, and I'm not talking about the nature of the comparisons, which is ridiculous enough as it is (how could you compare a murderer to the Yankees?), but the hypothetical arguments used to defend both makes no sense either.

 

As for the rest of your post, uhhh....yeah, the Yankees making more money means they SHOULD spend more money. Isn't that better than them pocketing all of that money? If the Yankees, with their revenue, didn't spend the most money you guys would vilify them for not spending and simply pocketing it. Face it, no matter what the Yankees do, people; Red Sox fans in particular, will still find an issue to blow out of proportion.

[Dipre]

Would you prefer there was no luxury tax? Before LT was implemented everyone was crying for it, now that it's in place it's a "joke."

 

What do you think is the best solution?

 

Luxury tax needss reforming. It's a joke as it stands.

 

 

Forgive me, I'm sitting here scratching my head because that made NO SENSE, especially the last part. NONE. Idk how you could compare the two, and I'm not talking about the nature of the comparisons, which is ridiculous enough as it is (how could you compare a murderer to the Yankees?), but the hypothetical arguments used to defend both makes no sense either.

 

As for the rest of your post, uhhh....yeah, the Yankees making more money means they SHOULD spend more money. Isn't that better than them pocketing all of that money? If the Yankees, with their revenue, didn't spend the most money you guys would vilify them for not spending and simply pocketing it. Face it, no matter what the Yankees do, people; Red Sox fans in particular, will still find an issue to blow out of proportion.

 

Scratch your sense some more, because that was the desired effect. It makes no sense.

 

And of course it's "blown out of proportion". If you were a Colorado fan it would be an enormous issue. This is why the term "hypocrite" was born.

[26 to 6]

Read my post a few pages back (Post# 1892), I agree that if I was a fan of a small market team the Yankees would annoy me too. And if I heard complaining from Rockies, Pirates, Nats, Padres, Mariners, D-backs, or A's fans I would have no problem with it. But hearing it from Sox fans is a bit annoying. You don't think Rockies fans have a similar disdain for the Red Sox as they do for the Yankees?

[Dipre]

Read my post a few pages back' date=' I agree that if I was a fan of a small market team the Yankees would annoy me too. And if I heard complaining from Rockies, Pirates, Nats, Padres, Mariners, D-backs, or A's fans I would have no problem with it. But hearing it from Sox fans is a bit annoying.[/quote']

 

I didn't mean you were a hypocrite. You guys have defended your stance while acknowledging that the system is broken and it gives the Yankees an enormous advantage.

But what about the Yankee fans who say the system is fantastic and other teams should just "Spend more". You know they exist. By the thousands.

[26 to 6]

I didn't mean you were a hypocrite. You guys have defended your stance while acknowledging that the system is broken and it gives the Yankees an enormous advantage.

But what about the Yankee fans who say the system is fantastic and other teams should just "Spend more". You know they exist. By the thousands.

Sure, but I pay very little attention to the Yankee fans like that who talk s*** but only watch like 12 games a year (11 being postseason games, the other being opening day ). Those aren't real fans. The Yankee fans that piss most people off the most aren't real fans in my eyes. There's no logical way to deny that the Yanks have an advantage, and we as fans can't ignore that. And with those advantages comes the pressure and expectations of winning a World Series every year, with anything short being a failure.

[a700hitter]

I have disdain for everything to do with the Yankees, but I'll never be caught whining about their finances. I root for a big market team that for decades tried to convince its fans that it was a small market team, but after 5+ years of sell outs at the highest ticket prices in baseball plus countless other new income streams and the current ownership can't sell that one with a straight face, nor do they try to their credit. Those of you who make the argument seem like a bunch of sour grapes whiners. You have no reason to whine. The FO didn't put out a good enough team to compete with the Yankees, and that was obvious before the teams started ST.

[Dipre]

I have disdain for everything to do with the Yankees' date=' but I'll never be caught whining about their finances. I root for a big market team that for decades tried to convince its fans that it was a small market team, but after 5+ years of sell outs at the highest ticket prices in baseball plus countless other new income streams and the current ownership can't sell that one with a straight face, nor do they try to their credit. Those of you who make the argument seem like a bunch of sour grapes whiners. You have no reason to whine. The FO didn't put out a good enough team to compete with the Yankees, and that was obvious before the teams started ST.[/quote']

 

I'm telling you.

 

You are a closet Yankee fan.

 

Come out of the closet, Clint..

[a700hitter]

I'm telling you.

 

You are a closet Yankee fan.

 

Come out of the closet, Clint..

The Red Sox are a top 5 franchise at worst. I think they are #2 as a money making entity. Who are we to complain when there are 25 teams that are worse off. This is like two rich guys arguing over who is richest. I remember Barbara Walters did separate interviews with Bob Hope and Bing Crosby. She asked Hope if he was the richest man in Hollywood. He adamantly answered "no" and he identified Bing Crosby as the richest star in Hollywood. When Crosby was interviewed, he said that Hope had more money and that Fred MacMurray probably had the most of anyone in Hollywood. Who cares!

 

We are in no position to cry poverty. It's a cop out.

[Dipre]

The Red Sox are a top 5 franchise at worst. I think they are #2 as a money making entity. Who are we to complain when there are 25 teams that are worse off. This is like two rich guys arguing over who is richest. I remember Barbara Walters did separate interviews with Bob Hope and Bing Crosby. She asked Hope if he was the richest man in Hollywood. He adamantly answered "no" and he identified Bing Crosby as the richest star in Hollywood. When Crosby was interviewed, he said that Hope had more money and that Fred MacMurray probably had the most of anyone in Hollywood. Who cares!

 

We are in no position to cry poverty. It's a cop out.

 

We would be in no position to complain if the difference between payrolls wasn't nearly 100 million dollars.

 

And no, the Sox were not top 5 in payroll last year. They were number 6.

 

Just sayin'.

[a700hitter]

We would be in no position to complain if the difference between payrolls wasn't nearly 100 million dollars.

 

And no, the Sox were not top 5 in payroll last year. They were number 6.

 

Just sayin'.

We were not #6 in revenue, which is what I was referreing to, not the payroll.

[Dipre]

We were not #6 in revenue' date=' which is what I was referreing to, not the payroll.[/quote']

 

Still a flawed argument.

 

You honestly think the Sox can compete with the Yankees in the FA market?

 

If you do, you're absolutely and positively wrong.

[a700hitter]

Still a flawed argument.

 

You honestly think the Sox can compete with the Yankees in the FA market?

 

If you do, you're absolutely and positively wrong.

Sure the Sox can compete with the Yankees in the FA market. Maybe they can't get into a bidding war with them, but they can certainly compete with them in building a team from Free Agency. The Yanks are locked into an IF of Tex, Cano, Jeter and ARod. If a big name IF were to hit the market, I couldn't see the Yankees competing with us. There are always plenty of good OFers to go around. Look at the steal the Angels got with Abreu. The Yankees can only have one big name at each position. There are plenty of other players to go around.

 

Edit: So stop whining. It is unseemly for you big guy.

[Dipre]

Sure the Sox can compete with the Yankees in the FA market. Maybe they can't get into a bidding war with them, but they can certainly compete with them in building a team from Free Agency. The Yanks are locked into an IF of Tex, Cano, Jeter and ARod. If a big name IF were to hit the market, I couldn't see the Yankees competing with us. There are always plenty of good OFers to go around. Look at the steal the Angels got with Abreu. The Yankees can only have one big name at each position. There are plenty of other players to go around.

 

Edit: So stop whining. It is unseemly for you big guy.

 

You took it out of context, stop it, it's unseemly for an old tough guy such as you.

[26 to 6]

Still a flawed argument.

 

You honestly think the Sox can compete with the Yankees in the FA market?

 

If you do, you're absolutely and positively wrong.

Really dude? The Sox are in a better position to compete with the Yankees for Free Agents than anyone, including the Mets. They have done so in the past and continue to do so. The reason the Yankees seemingly win most of the bidding wars is because the Sox know when to stop, which is smart. The Yankees overpay ridiculously for certain players, who most of the time don't live up to their expectations and fizzle out, or can't live up to the pressures of playing in New York and soon find themselves elsewhere with the Yankees eating a big chunk of the contract. The Sox can absolutely compete with the Yankees, they just don't always go to the lengths that the Yankees do out of smart, strategic thinking. But you really need to give up this argument, the Red Sox are in no worse a position than the Yankees to spend money; they're just Jewish about it and spend wisely (no offense to any jews on the board ).

[a700hitter]

You took it out of context' date=' stop it, it's unseemly for an old tough guy such as you.[/quote']Okay.