Official Red Sox offseason thread

[Cocos Disciples]

He's got Mark Prior written all over him.

 

How?

[Dipre]

How?

 

That's who scouts compare his mechanics to.

[Cocos Disciples]

That's who scouts compare his mechanics to.

 

Prior's early mechanics or later mechanics?

[Dipre]

Prior's early mechanics or later mechanics?

 

Injury-prone time.

[Cocos Disciples]

Gotcha. That would be a colossal disappointment.

[Dipre]

Gotcha. That would be a colossal disappointment.

 

It's just early takes from scouts though.

 

Pitching's a funny activity. What won't work for one pitcher will work wonders for another.

[Spudboy]

Well my intent was to make an enormous post saying that you were stating the obvious. Then again I think it was obvious that you were stating the obvious' date=' so technically by saying that you were stating the obvious, I was in fact, stating the obvious myself.[/quote']

 

Sig worthy.

[WhiskeyBreath]

Oh god. An off season thread in August:thumbdown

[Gosawks]

I made this thread just to post serious ideas about this offseason. Im not giving up on the season here.. Please post serious ideas about this offseason in here.

[a700hitter]

Here's an article comparing the past off season for the Yankees and the Red Sox. The Sox off season was an ill-conceived joke that will hurt the organization for years to come.

 

http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/9926004/Red-Sox-have-to-admit-Yankees-got-it-right

[Dipre]

Here's an article comparing the past off season for the Yankees and the Red Sox. The Sox off season was an ill-conceived joke that will hurt the organization for years to come.

 

http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/9926004/Red-Sox-have-to-admit-Yankees-got-it-right

 

No it won't.

 

None of the FA's cost draft picks.

 

Sure, they lost out on Tex, but there're plenty of opportunities for upgrading both the rotation and offense this off-season.

 

The effects of the past off-season aren't gonna trigger a catastrophic chain of events.

 

Stop it.

[Dojji]

As I've been saying for nearly a year now, the offseason FA acquisitions aren't how we build the team anymore. Of course our offseasons will pale in comparison with those who DO build that way.

[a700hitter]

No it won't.

 

None of the FA's cost draft picks.

 

Sure, they lost out on Tex, but there're plenty of opportunities for upgrading both the rotation and offense this off-season.

 

The effects of the past off-season aren't gonna trigger a catastrophic chain of events.

 

Stop it.

I am not predicting catastrophe, but the fact is that the Yankees have locked up CC, AJ and Tex for several years. That will hurt us beyond this season. In addition they have ARod locked up. These are 4 mega stars. The only mega star that the Sox have is Beckett, and he is not signed long term. They can't afford to have the same approach this season or the chasm between the Sox and Yanks will open wider.

[a700hitter]

As I've been saying for nearly a year now' date=' the offseason FA acquisitions aren't how we build the team anymore. Of course our offseasons will pale in comparison with those who DO build that way.[/quote']So adding a top 5 pitcher, Cy Young Award winner at age 28 and a 29 year old offensive Superstar doesn't help you build a winning team? I think the results are speaking for themselves.

[italstallianion]

So adding a top 5 pitcher' date=' Cy Young Award winner at age 28 and a 29 year old offensive Superstar doesn't help you build a winning team? I think the results are speaking for themselves.[/quote']

 

 

It does help build a winning team, but that doesn't allow one to exaggerate and make wild claims that this off season hurt our club in the long run or that this off season was a catastrophe for us or anything like that. The Yanks got lightning in a bottle by throwing money out of everywhere like a European whore and thus far it's paid off. The Sox took the risk averse (safe) option and thus far, most of the investments haven't worked out.

 

But some of them have, and none of them were long term deals. So if anything it hurts 2009 and 2009 only. And I'd say the Sox have a lot more problems than their offseason moves. The offseason can't be blamed for most of our troubles. Even Johnny Cochran wouldn't be able to find a connection there.

[Dojji]

Indeed. Most of our real troubles this year have come from players who were here in 2008 -- Daisuke, Lowrie, Lugo, Ortiz, and to a lesser extent Lowell and Bay. The exception was probably our biggest gamble -- John Smoltz.

[BoSox21]

The only mega star that the Sox have is Beckett' date=' and he is not signed long term. They can't afford to have the same approach this season or the chasm between the Sox and Yanks will open wider.[/quote']

 

If you're gonna consider AJ Burnett a megastar, how do you not consider Papelbon, Pedroia and Youkilis megastars?

[a700hitter]

It does help build a winning team, but that doesn't allow one to exaggerate and make wild claims that this off season hurt our club in the long run or that this off season was a catastrophe for us or anything like that. The Yanks got lightning in a bottle by throwing money out of everywhere like a European whore and thus far it's paid off. The Sox took the risk averse (safe) option and thus far, most of the investments haven't worked out.

 

But some of them have, and none of them were long term deals. So if anything it hurts 2009 and 2009 only. And I'd say the Sox have a lot more problems than their off season moves. The off season can't be blamed for most of our troubles. Even Johnny Cochran wouldn't be able to find a connection there.

Again, who said anything about a catastrophe. The Red Sox will pay beyond 2009 for letting the Yankees eat their lunch this off season, because CC, AJ and Tex will not be with the Yankees only for 2009 but for several years beyond that. The Red Sox will be facing those same guys in 2010, 2011 and beyond.

 

As for taking the "risk averse (safe) option", let's call it what it is: the cheap option. There was nothing risk averse about it. There was no value involved in their acquisitions. They paid cheap for a bunch of lame horses and they got even less than what they paid for. They got poor value in return for their investment.

 

The off season can't be blamed for our troubles? There was a deep pool of solid performing FA pitchers and we passed on all of it. Pitching wins. They failed to upgrade, and now they are rolling garbage to the mound. Injuries are not an excuse, because the Yankees lost Wang for the season, but they had sufficiently bolstered their rotation with AJ and CC so that it didn't hurt them much.

[Dojji]

If you're gonna consider AJ Burnett a megastar' date=' how do you not consider Papelbon, Pedroia and Youkilis megastars?[/quote']

 

Or Lester.

[a700hitter]

If you're gonna consider AJ Burnett a megastar' date=' how do you not consider Papelbon, Pedroia and Youkilis megastars?[/quote']I don't consider Youkilis and Pedroia to be in the same class as Texeira when it comes to offensive performance. Youk is very close, but I wouldn't consider him a megastar. Papelbon is a megastar, but he's not signed long term either.

[TheKilo]

While I don't disagree with a lot of what a700 says, counting the arbitrary number of megastars on a team is no way to measure success of the roster construction.

 

Give me a talented team that works well together. Of course, talent ultimately wins over chemistry, and the FO settled on a lot of lottery tickets this past offseason whereas the Yanks grabbed the sure things.

 

That's the difference.

[BoSox21]

It's not but there's no way in hell you consider Burnett a megastar

[a700hitter]

While I don't disagree with a lot of what a700 says, counting the arbitrary number of megastars on a team is no way to measure success of the roster construction.

 

Give me a talented team that works well together. Of course, talent ultimately wins over chemistry, and the FO settled on a lot of lottery tickets this past offseason whereas the Yanks grabbed the sure things.

 

That's the difference.

If you plug a pitcher like Sabbathia into a rotation on a good team, they become a very good if not an elite team. I remember what Pedro did for us. We had garbage on the staff, but getting him made the Sox a playoff contender. Manny elevated the team to an even higher level. It doesn't matter if your team works together or not. If you plug in a couple of guys like that, your team moves to a different level.

[a700hitter]

It's not but there's no way in hell you consider Burnett a megastar

You are right. He is a top pitcher, who can be dominant. Injury and lack of consistency have kept him from being a big star.

[CrespoBlows]

Mark Prior actually had flawless mechanics. Dusty Baker ruined him.

[Dojji]

He's still at it too, just ask Edinson Vonquez.

 

Why DO they keep giving Dusty Baker young pitchers to destroy? I mean where did his reputation as a good manager come from? Has he even won anything?

[CrespoBlows]

I have heard 21 and 26. He was listed at 26 in the WBC' date=' so that sounds about right[/quote']

 

26? I think it is safe to pass on this kid. If he's 21, he still might turn into an effective relief arm, but at 26, there's no chance.

[example1]

I am not predicting catastrophe' date=' but the fact is that the Yankees have locked up CC, AJ and Tex for several years. That will hurt us beyond this season. In addition they have ARod locked up. These are 4 mega stars. The only mega star that the Sox have is Beckett, and he is not signed long term. They can't afford to have the same approach this season or the chasm between the Sox and Yanks will open wider.[/quote']

 

Were you under the illusion that the Yankees would just sit by while contracts come off their books? The signings of CC and AJ were no shock and seemed like overreactions to me. The signing of Teixeira hurts more, but what are you gonna do now that it's over? Keep bitching and moaning about it for years and years?

 

Now it is the Sox turn to make a big move.

 

To me, the type of move that would provide a big-time equalizer would include only a few names acquired via-trade. I'm thinking that acquiring guys like Hanley Ramirez, Felix Hernandez or maybe Adrian Gonzalez would quickly equalize the trajectory of these teams.

 

I watched Felix duel against Buerhle the other night. It was very impressive and he's well-within the equation for the cy young this year.

[Dojji]

If he's 21 he's a legit prospect, if he's 26 he's a minor league filler who's got an outside shot at big league time in 3 years because he's lefthanded but probably not with the Sox.

[Dojji]

The guy I think we could have gone harder after was not necessarily Teixeira, but Swisher. He's the guy who losing out on him hurt the most. Swisher was the medicine to most of our in-season lineup problems IMHO. I still don't understand why we let him go to the Yankees so easily.