7/18 @ Toronto

[Cocos Disciples]

Except when we talk about trading Penny we're talking about the next two months, not five years. Unless Penny nets us something significant (which I doubt he will), I keep him and save Clay for injuries and some September spots until next year.

[Dutchy]

Trade him for a bag of balls then, I just want to make room for Buchholz.

[TedWilliams101]

What is wrong with having Masterson as the injury insurance pitcher? In his first 2 season so far has started 15 games. He has a 4.03ERA with 67K in 89.1 innings, a WHIP of 1.332, and has averaged 6IP per start. The only concern are the walks (44), but that should improve with experience (and has, 4.1 BB/9 in 08 down to 3.2 BB/9 this season).

 

That is BETTER than what Penny has given us this year (and as good as he has been since May). Sooo, whats the problem? How can you argue with having Masterson as the backup?

[Cocos Disciples]

What do you honestly expect to get for Penny? Are we just dumping him for the sake of dumping him?

[Rdsxmbnt]

What do you honestly expect to get for Penny? Are we just dumping him for the sake of dumping him?

 

Some team out there needs pitching. I don't think he'll fetch much and honestly don't really care. We're trying to put out the best team out there.

[Cocos Disciples]

If he won't fetch much, why not keep him and give Clay starts anyway?

[TedWilliams101]

I'm assuming they can't option him down the Pawtucket. If they can a good bench player, a mid-level prospect, etc, I'd trade him. If not, send him down to Pawtucket if possible.

[Dutchy]

I'm assuming they can't option him down the Pawtucket. If they can a good bench player' date=' a mid-level prospect, etc, I'd trade him. If not, send him down to Pawtucket if possible.[/quote']

 

They can't send him to Pawtucket, but they could put him in the bullpen and send someone else down to Pawtucket (Masterson).

[a700hitter]

A700, I think you are missing the point with starting Buchholz over Penny. It's all in the upside. Buchholz's worst case scenario is basically the same as Penny. The difference is upside. Buchholz has the potential to dominate in the majors (as he did in 07 and has all season in AAA). Penny really doesn't have that upside right now. His best starts have been 6IP, 2-3ER. On the flip side, Penny has had a bunch of awful outings (including this one today). I mean, Clay, in his one start this season, performed as good as Penny's best start this season.

 

It's a complete risk/reward. I think Clay is at no worse a risk as Penny, but he has a much greater reward.

There is also the possibility that Buchholz forgets how to locate his fastball like last year and puts up much worse numbers than Penny would.

 

Also' date=' I'm not so sure I'd want to trade or Halladay. If it was Buchholz straight up, than, yeah, I'd take it. However, it will likely take a lot more than just Buchholz and I'm not sure it would be worth it. Halladay is 32. We would likely have about 4 (+/-) more dominant season from him. With Buchholz, we could have yet another future Ace for the next 10 years, plus the other prospects we'd still have that would have been included in the trade.[/quote']...and if the Yankees scoop up Halladay, they will surely win the Championship in '09 and '10.

[VA Sox Fan]

There is also the possibility that Buchholz forgets how to locate his fastball like last year and puts up much worse numbers than Penny would.

 

...and if the Yankees scoop up Halladay, they will surely win the Championship in '09 and '10.

 

Oh please...it's not like he's Curt Schilling or Josh Beckett.

 

What's he done in the post season? I have forgotten.

[a700hitter]

Oh please...it's not like he's Curt Schilling or Josh Beckett.

 

What's he done in the post season? I have forgotten.

He's pretty darn good. If the Yankees get him, we will be in for a world of frustration.

[VA Sox Fan]

He's pretty darn good. If the Yankees get him' date=' we will be in for a world of frustration.[/quote']

 

Well, now, I'm convinced.

[yankees228]

Well' date=' now, I'm convinced. [/quote']

 

a700 is clearly exaggerating. I would be the first one to tell you that, right now, the Red Sox are a better team than the Yankees. However, if the Yankees were to acquire Halladay, in my opinion, that would change. Do you disagree with this?

[a700hitter]

Well' date=' now, I'm convinced. [/quote']When one of the top 2 or 3 pitchers in the game moves to a really good team, it has been known to result in a World Championship. Schilling coming to the Sox was a perfect example. Another example was Randy Johnson and Curt Schilling on the DBacks. The DBacks were not even that good, but those two studs brought them the championship. Pitching wins, and Halladay is one of the two or three best in the game.

[VA Sox Fan]

a700 is clearly exaggerating. I would be the first one to tell you that' date=' right now, the Red Sox are a better team than the Yankees. However, if the Yankees were to acquire Halladay, in my opinion, that would change. Do you disagree with this?[/quote']

 

Not at all. But he's talking/predicting World Series championships based on one pitcher. Ridiculous.

[Dutchy]

There is also the possibility that Buchholz forgets how to locate his fastball like last year and puts up much worse numbers than Penny would.

 

While it's unlikely that Buchholz won't be able to do better than Penny's 5+ ERA, if Buch sucks we still have Bowden, Masterson and Matsuzaka.

[VA Sox Fan]

When one of the top 2 or 3 pitchers in the game moves to a really good team' date=' it has been known to result in a World Championship. Schilling coming to the Sox was a perfect example. Another example was Randy Johnson and Curt Schilling on the DBacks. The DBacks were not even that good, but those two studs brought them the championship. Pitching wins, and Halladay is one of the two or three best in the game.[/quote']

 

But Schillng and Johnson had success in the post season. Johnson didn't help the Yankees. Schilling did help us. What has Halladay done in the post season?

 

I just can't believe your blind faith in this guy.

[Dutchy]

a700 is clearly exaggerating. I would be the first one to tell you that' date=' right now, the Red Sox are a better team than the Yankees. However, if the Yankees were to acquire Halladay, in my opinion, that would change. Do you disagree with this?[/quote']

 

I definitely agree. The Yankees weakness is pitching, so if they acquire one of the best starters in the league, they'd be the better team. The Red Sox on the other hand are stacked with pitching. If they acquired Holliday, he'd be there 3rd/4th best playoff pitcher. Beckett and Smoltz are the best active playoff pitchers of the last 2-3 decades. And Lester pitches really well in big games.

 

The Red Sox need a hitter, not a belly itcher.

[a700hitter]

Not at all. But he's talking/predicting World Series championships based on one pitcher. Ridiculous.

Ridiculous? The Red Sox are a serious contender for the World Championship. I don't think you would dispute that. The odds makers in Vegas certainly think the Red Sox are serious contenders for the Championship. The Yankees getting Halladay would shift the balance of power back to the Yankees without question. Would they be guaranteed a World Championship? Of course not, but they would be in a better position to win than any other team. I don't see how that is ridiculous.

[Dutchy]

Ridiculous? The Red Sox are a serious contender for the World Championship. I don't think you would dispute that. The odds makers in Vegas certainly think the Red Sox are serious contenders for the Championship. The Yankees getting Halladay would shift the balance of power back to the Yankees without question. Would they be guaranteed a World Championship? Of course not' date=' but they would be in a better position to win than any other team. I don't see how that is ridiculous.[/quote']

 

You didn't predict, you said the Red Sox would get 2 World Series if they acquired Halladay, which is ridiculous. It just is.

[Cocos Disciples]

If he's a good pitcher (like Schill and RJ were), chances are he'll be good in the playoff. I don't see lack of playoff experiences as a negative.

[Spudboy]

Not at all. But he's talking/predicting World Series championships based on one pitcher. Ridiculous.

 

The Yankees won't get him. Even if they did, they still have to beat out the Rays and Sox within the division. Then they have to get by everyone else in the playoffs.

 

While it could happen, to say it will is a leap of faith, at best.

 

He is not the end all of baseball players. He's just one pitcher playing every five days.

[a700hitter]

But Schillng and Johnson had success in the post season. Johnson didn't help the Yankees. Schilling did help us. What has Halladay done in the post season?

 

I just can't believe your blind faith in this guy.

He hasn't been to the post season. It's not like he is Wang who has been to the post season and spit the bit.

[VA Sox Fan]

Ridiculous? The Red Sox are a serious contender for the World Championship. I don't think you would dispute that. The odds makers in Vegas certainly think the Red Sox are serious contenders for the Championship. The Yankees getting Halladay would shift the balance of power back to the Yankees without question. Would they be guaranteed a World Championship? Of course not' date=' but they would be in a better position to win than any other team. I don't see how that is ridiculous.[/quote']

 

Well, let's just agree to disagree.

 

I'm just extremely surprised at your deep want for this guy.

 

Our pitching staff is fine as well as deep.

 

I'm all for getting another bat or a SS.

[Dutchy]

Well, let's just agree to disagree.

I'm just extremely surprised at your deep want for this guy.

 

Our pitching staff is fine as well as deep.

 

I'm all for getting another bat or a SS.

 

Don't sweat it, probably 3/4ths of this site agrees with you on that.

[a700hitter]

You didn't predict' date=' you said the Red Sox would get 2 World Series if they acquired Halladay, which is ridiculous. It just is.[/quote']The Red Sox are already one of the best teams in the game... maybe the best. Add Halladay to what they have and I believe they would be a complete powerhouse. Does this guarantee them two championships? There are no guarantees, but I certainly would not bet against them winning, especially this season. I don't see what team could compete with Beckett, Lester and Halladay in a short series with Smoltz as the 4th guy. The Sox have plenty of offense if backed by that piching.

[Dutchy]

The Red Sox are already one of the best teams in the game... maybe the best. Add Halladay to what they have and I believe they would be a complete powerhouse. Does this guarantee them two championships? There are no guarantees' date=' but I certainly would not bet against them winning, especially this season. I don't see what team could compete with Beckett, Lester and Halladay in a short series with Smoltz as the 4th guy. The Sox have plenty of offense if backed by that piching.[/quote']

 

I'm glad you're coming to your senses. If we sign Halladay, who would be the odd man out? Usually only 3 starters get the playoff starts. Smoltz? The best active playoff starter of the last 20 years?

 

And having watched the team play the last month, I think it's pretty obvious that our need is hitting, not pitching.

[yankees228]

If he's a good pitcher (like Schill and RJ were)' date=' chances are he'll be good in the playoff. I don't see lack of playoff experiences as a negative.[/quote']

 

Bingo!

[yankees228]

If the Red Sox had a top three of Halladay, Beckett, and Lester there would be no words to describe how dominant that would be.

[VA Sox Fan]

The Red Sox are already one of the best teams in the game... maybe the best. Add Halladay to what they have and I believe they would be a complete powerhouse. Does this guarantee them two championships? There are no guarantees' date=' but I certainly would not bet against them winning, especially this season. I don't see what team could compete with Beckett, Lester and Halladay in a short series with Smoltz as the 4th guy. The Sox have plenty of offense if backed by that piching.[/quote']

 

Offense is great. But pitching and defense are what get you there.

 

Good night all of you kooky arm chair GM's...love ya...mean it.

 

Excuse my faith in the FO to do their jobs as they know the in's and out's of their organization.