Lowell's Hip "Isn't Any Better"

[Dipre]

You're right' date=' but who else do you think the Pirates would ask for?[/quote']

 

If that's your argument, let's give them Bucholz+Anderson...........

[Dojji]

It's feast or famine with you, isn't it? Personally I think Bowden is a fair price if the Pirates are looking for a pitching prospect. Your claim that it would somehow be robbery is as ridiculous as going the other way and offering Buchholz and Anderson.

 

Of course, knowing the Pirates you could probably offer them Bubba Bell, Hunter Jones and a used cigar stub and get LaRoche off them.

[Dipre]

It's feast or famine with you, isn't it? Personally I think Bowden is a fair price if the Pirates are looking for a pitching prospect. Your claim that it would somehow be robbery is as ridiculous as going the other way and offering Buchholz and Anderson.

 

Of course, knowing the Pirates you could probably offer them Bubba Bell, Hunter Jones and a used cigar stub and get LaRoche off them.

 

That's the point, sir.

 

You're catching on.

 

See: Xavier Nady and Damaso Marte.

 

See: Nate Mclouth.

[Dojji]

Yeah, see: Jason Bay for three bust prospects and Brandon Moss.

 

But if the Pirates weren't a team you could rob blind, Bowden would be a fair price for a player of LaRoche's caliber.

[Dipre]

I avoided that one because every time i think about that one i burst into uncontrollable laughter.

[Dojji]

I avoided that one because every time i think about that one i burst into uncontrollable laughter.

 

I'm sure Theo does too, especially while moving in the direction of his preferred financial institution.

[jacksonianmarch]

we're really getting the better end of the stick out of the Nady deal, now arent we? Marte is out till the ASB and Nady is out for the yr. Solid moves I tell ya

[Jacoby_Ellsbury]

Injured Marte/Nady > Jeff Karstens and Ross Ohlendorf.

[jacksonianmarch]

but the key to that trade was Tabata, who hit well last yr but has been hurt this yr. If he makes it as a COF next to McCutchen, then the yankees will rue the day they made that deal.

[CrespoBlows]

No.

 

Why is everyone obsessed with keeping the 6th man out of our bullpen? Especially the one with the WHIP of over 1.44?

 

Is the 6th man in our bullpen really worth more than the possible second, or sixth batter in our lineup?

[Dipre]

Why is everyone obsessed with keeping the 6th man out of our bullpen? Especially the one with the WHIP of over 1.44?

 

Is the 6th man in our bullpen really worth more than the possible second, or sixth batter in our lineup?

 

The problem is that that possible 2nd or 6th batter is Nick f***ing Johnsonn.

 

Don't get me wrong, his skillset must be loved, but seriously, how long 'till he sneezes and goes to the 60-day DL with 4 broken ribs and a strained neck.

[a700hitter]

Why is everyone obsessed with keeping the 6th man out of our bullpen? Especially the one with the WHIP of over 1.44?

 

Is the 6th man in our bullpen really worth more than the possible second, or sixth batter in our lineup?

I don't think the Sox have a sixth man per se out of the bullpen. Because all of the arms are of comparable high quality, the way Tito seems to rotate the bullpen is more like two sets of 6th, 7th and 8th inning guys that he uses on alternate days to avoid overusing anyone.

[Dojji]

Why is everyone obsessed with keeping the 6th man out of our bullpen? Especially the one with the WHIP of over 1.44?

 

Is the 6th man in our bullpen really worth more than the possible second, or sixth batter in our lineup?

 

it is if that sixth man has a proven track record of second half awesomeness and is doing a good enough job this year to be a setup man on some teams.

 

Also, Delcarmen is our 4th man at worst, Masterson, Bard and IMHO Saito are behind him.

[CrespoBlows]

Do you guys really believe that Hunter Jones, or Clay Buchholz pitching out the bullpen, would cost us more wins than Mark Kotsay at 1B?

 

Buchholz + Johnson

[Spudboy]

Do you guys really believe that Hunter Jones, or Clay Buchholz pitching out the bullpen, would cost us more wins than Mark Kotsay at 1B?

 

Buchholz + Johnson

 

No.

[Dipre]

Do you guys really believe that Hunter Jones, or Clay Buchholz pitching out the bullpen, would cost us more wins than Mark Kotsay at 1B?

 

Buchholz + Johnson

 

You're missing the point.

 

The point is Nick Johnson's health, at least IMO.

[a700hitter]

I'm not thrilled about putting the ball in Bucholz's hand in the late innings of a big game. I trust Delcarmen in those situations.

[Cocos Disciples]

I'm not thrilled about putting the ball in Bucholz's hand in the late innings of a big game. I trust Delcarmen in those situations.

 

Buchholz wouldn't be the setup man in this situation, that would be Okajima, Ramirez and Saito. Buchholz would be more of a long man.

[Dojji]

I'd rather deal a prospect to pick up our injury insurance if possible.

 

Of course, in the offseason I was all for getting Nick Swisher instead of Kotsay, but Boston was too slow on that one. He'd be a big help right now.

 

Right now, I think that the best value is Adam LaRoche, especially if you can find a way to get him for prospects we weren't going to use.

[Dipre]

I'd rather deal a prospect to pick up our injury insurance if possible.

 

Of course, in the offseason I was all for getting Nick Swisher instead of Kotsay, but Boston was too slow on that one. He'd be a big help right now.

 

Right now, I think that the best value is Adam LaRoche, especially if you can find a way to get him for prospects we weren't going to use.

 

Sweet Lord, Doiji, there're a thousand better options out there than LaRoche even if they come at a bigger price.

 

I'd rather they get Nick Johnson, Aubrey Huff or Garret Atkins (who surely could benefit from a change of scenery) than LaRoche.

[Dojji]

Johnson I can see, but I thought you were worried about his health. Huff is in-division, I doubt the O's make a deal with us, and besides, the guy's fatally inconsistent and isn't as good a hitter as Adam LaRoche.

 

I don't get what you have against LaRoche. He compares to the rest of these guys as a hitter as well as a fielder. Look at the guy's numbers over the last 4 years and tell me what's wrong with the guy. Unless you managed to completely job the Nationals he's probably the best 1B you could get for a reasonable price.

[Dipre]

Johnson I can see, but I thought you were worried about his health. Huff is in-division, I doubt the O's make a deal with us, and besides, the guy's fatally inconsistent and isn't as good a hitter as Adam LaRoche.

 

I don't get what you have against LaRoche. He compares to the rest of these guys as a hitter as well as a fielder. Look at the guy's numbers over the last 4 years and tell me what's wrong with the guy. Unless you managed to completely job the Nationals he's probably the best 1B you could get for a reasonable price.

 

I'm real worried about Johnson's health.

 

But i'm twice as worried about LaRoche's SUCK.

 

His swing is picture-perfect, but his approach and pitch selection are flawed, add to that the fact that he's defensively challenged and you have a recipe for suck.

 

The problem with him is that there are better, more versatile options out there, remember, LaRoche can only play 1st, and he's not a glove the caliber of Johnson, doesn't have the multiple position flexibility of Atkins or Huff, and he doesn't have an impact skill, such as Johnsonn's OBP, or Huff's or Atkins' power.

 

Sure, he can put up 20 homers, but what else?

 

I mean, there's gotta be a reason why Atlanta was so eager to dump him after his breakthrough 32-homer season.

[Dojji]

Glove the caliber of Johnson? News for you, Mr. Stuck-In-2005, Johnson is a below average fielder since he came back from major leg surgery last year. LaRoche is slightly below average, but that's about the same level Johnson has been at since he came back. He's still got a great on base approach, when he's on the field anyway, but I don't see a big difference between what's left of Johnson and LaRoche.

 

As for laRoche's SUCK, you might tell that to his OPS+, which has literally never been below 100. *coughunlikeJohnsoncough*

[Cocos Disciples]

As for laRoche's SUCK, you might tell that to his OPS+, which has literally never been below 100. *coughunlikeJohnsoncough*

 

Still, Johnson's career OPS+ is 9 points higher than LaRoche's.

[Dipre]

Glove the caliber of Johnson? News for you, Mr. Stuck-In-2005, Johnson is a below average fielder since he came back from major leg surgery last year. LaRoche is slightly below average, but that's about the same level Johnson has been at since he came back. He's still got a great on base approach, when he's on the field anyway, but I don't see a big difference between what's left of Johnson and LaRoche.

 

As for laRoche's SUCK, you might tell that to his OPS+, which has literally never been below 100. *coughunlikeJohnsoncough*

 

Johnnson's defense compares very favorably to Laroche's.

 

Also, LaRoche has never had an OBP above .360 *coughunlikeLaRochecough*

 

Mr. LaRoche still hits like he did in that one career year in Atlanta.

[Spudboy]

Not that it would happen. But I'd like Huff. Particularly because he can play OF, 3B, and 1st.

[Dojji]

Still' date=' Johnson's career OPS+ is 9 points higher than LaRoche's.[/quote']

 

Not precisely an earth-shattering difference.

 

My point is that LaRoche is the better value, not necessarily the better player (although he's not as bad as DipreG pretends). Basically, I think it costs less in franchise assets to pick him up, and he'll do an adequate job based on his career numbers.

 

I think you can get LaRoche from the Pirates more cheaply than we can get Johnson from the Nats or Huff from the O's or whoever else from whevever else.

[Dojji]

 

Mr. LaRoche still hits like he did in that one career year in Atlanta.

 

He's good for a pretty consistent .260/.340/.480 baseline and would basically replace Lowell's numbers in the lineup. We take a hit defensively, but we're still better off than we are with Kotsay, and who maybe even than we are with an injury-plagued Lowell.

[Dipre]

Not precisely an earth-shattering difference.

 

My point is that LaRoche is the better value, not necessarily the better player (although he's not as bad as DipreG pretends). Basically, I think it costs less in franchise assets to pick him up, and he'll do an adequate job based on his career numbers.

 

I think you can get LaRoche from the Pirates more cheaply than we can get Johnson from the Nats or Huff from the O's or whoever else from whevever else.

 

I never said he's bad.

 

Don't put words in my mouth, sir.

 

I said he's a lower tier first baseman, and what SUCKS is his defense, he's good for 20 HRs, 80 RBIs, but we can get someone better for not much more.

[a700hitter]

IMO neither Johnson nor LaRoche is worth much. I'd rather the pursue someone else.