Ortiz not sure if he took steroids

[Jacoby_Ellsbury]

Peculiar career path? Part-time player in his early 20's who came into his own in in his late 20's as a full time player and suffered an injury in his early to mid-30's causing a decrease in his performance. Why is that so peculiar?

 

His last three years as a Twin, he played in 130, 89, and 125 games. I'd say that constitutes 'full time player', and yet he only hit 20 homers once, and didn't come close in the other two seasons. He comes to Boston and out of nowhere becomes a middle of the lineup crusher. When you factor that in, and then consider baseball players really don't start to break down in their early thirties (unlike all other major sports)... I definitely have my suspicions.

 

 

 

Look, I think we can all agree that out of all MLB players from the early-mid 90s to around a couple of seasons ago (if not now), any of those guys could and probably were juicing. All of baseball has a cloud over it. You guys act like Ortiz is exempt from this cloud, despite the fact there is some things about him and his career that should cause at least a little suspicion (should you choose to acknowledge them).

 

 

But who gives a f***, it was obviously a mistake for me to post this thread, given how many talksox members clearly have a giant log up their ass right now (hi bosox21).

[Jacoby_Ellsbury]

That's throwing out the possibility he juiced?

 

Yes.

 

That sounds like you accusing him of juicing.

 

Yeah... it does looking back. Oh well, reactionary posts happen.

 

Don't back down now, "f***tard"

 

Sigh...

[Jacoby_Ellsbury]

Spoken like a true steroid-user

LOL

 

 

 

Angwy??? Calm down, go to the market and get some bagged milk. That'll ease your nerves.

[kreinbihl34]

HARDCor3 4 postz ina row to show my intelligence!!!!SHIFT+1!

[Jacoby_Ellsbury]

HARDCor3 4 postz ina row to show my intelligence!!!!SHIFT+1!

 

Interesting stuff from this guy...

 

Seriously just take of the middle school girl panties and man up. There's no sense in acting like a punk' date=' kid.[/quote']

 

LOL @ the hypocrite f*** who starts s*** with me after having zero previous interaction with me.

 

 

 

D00d, NO!!!

[a700hitter]

His last three years as a Twin' date=' he played in 130, 89, and 125 games. I'd say that constitutes 'full time player', and yet he only hit 20 homers once, and didn't come close in the other two seasons. He comes to Boston and out of nowhere becomes a middle of the lineup crusher. When you factor that in, and then consider baseball players really don't start to break down in their early thirties (unlike all other major sports)... I definitely have my suspicions.[/quote']He had 400 ABs in 2 of his 3 last years with the Twins and only 300 ABs in the other year. This indicates that he was not a full time player and that he was being platooned with a RH hitter who was taking the other 200- 300 ABs. Many hitters have their biggest power production years from age 27-31/32. It's not that eye-opening for a hitter to hit more during those years than at other times in his career. It's quite common throughout the history of the game. As for breaking down, it is very common for large guys like Ortiz to break down in their early 30's, e.g Boog Powell, Mo Vaughn, Frank Howard.

 

Look' date=' I think we can all agree that out of all MLB players from the early-mid 90s to around a couple of seasons ago (if not now), any of those guys could and probably were juicing. All of baseball has a cloud over it. You guys act like Ortiz is exempt from this cloud, despite the fact there is some things about him and his career that should cause at least a little suspicion (should you choose to acknowledge them).[/quote']Everybody is under a cloud of suspicion, but you are pointing to a very normal career path and aging process as some sort of evidence of juicing. There is no evidence that would raise the suspicion with regard to Ortiz. Big power from a big man in his late 20's and early 30's is not an indicator of Roids.

 

But who gives a f***' date=' it was obviously a mistake for me to post this thread, given how many talksox members clearly have a giant log up their ass right now (hi bosox21).[/quote']Your mistake was that the support for your argument was very flimsy resulting in challenges from other posters.

[BoSox21]

And that everytime his argument becomes overmatched, he replies with a stupid insult

[Jacoby_Ellsbury]

He had 400 ABs in 2 of his 3 last years with the Twins and only 300 ABs in the other year. This indicates that he was not a full time player and that he was being platooned with a RH hitter who was taking the other 200- 300 ABs. Many hitters have their biggest power production years from age 27-31/32. It's not that eye-opening for a hitter to hit more during those years than at other times in his career. It's quite common throughout the history of the game. As for breaking down' date=' it is very common for large guys like Ortiz to break down in their early 30's, e.g Boog Powell, Mo Vaughn, Frank Howard.[/quote']

 

Well yeah, but we're talking 20 HR/year to 50 HR/year.

 

Everybody is under a cloud of suspicion, but you are pointing to a very normal career path and aging process as some sort of evidence of juicing. There is no evidence that would raise the suspicion with regard to Ortiz. Big power from a big man in his late 20's and early 30's is not an indicator of Roids.

 

Sigh... there's no point in saying it again, I've already said it enough times.

 

Your mistake was that the support for your argument was very flimsy resulting in challenges from other posters.

 

 

 

 

The evidence (not that he did juice, but that he might have) is there, if you choose to acknowledge it.

[Jacoby_Ellsbury]

And that everytime his argument becomes overmatched' date=' he replies with a stupid insult[/quote']

 

Since I have better things to bother myself with than your retarded 'hee akyoosed papi!' rantings, I'll just throw you on ignore.

 

 

I suggest you do the same, if you're having that much trouble getting off my dick.

[Dojji]

You realize that you just proved him right.

[BoSox21]

You realize that you just proved him right.

 

Spot on.

[Jacoby_Ellsbury]

You realize that you just proved him right.

How so? By deciding to just put his bitchy ass on ignore and not have to read his s***?

 

Or because I'm tired of beating the dead horse?

[ORS]

Well yeah' date=' but we're talking 20 HR/year to 50 HR/year.[/quote']

Not really. Going by just the counting stat, you lose the perspective of playing time that a700 is trying to draw attention to.

 

It's 20HR/350AB to 50HR/600AB. See how the denominators aren't the same? A common measure is to flip that and measure AB per HR. Here's Ortiz in that measure for his career with corresponding age, team, and year.

 

[table]Age|Team|Year|AB|HR|AB/HR

24|MIN|2000|415|10|41.50

25|MIN|2001|303|18|16.83

26|MIN|2002|412|20|20.60

27|BOS|2003|448|31|14.45

28|BOS|2004|582|41|14.19

29|BOS|2005|601|47|12.79

30|BOS|2006|558|54|10.33

31|BOS|2007|549|35|15.69

32|BOS|2008|416|23|18.08[/table]

 

Steady improvement through his physical peak (27-31), with an outlier to the good (2006) and to the bad (2002) and regression due to injury at the tail end of it. This is a perfectly normal progression.