GOM's Plan to Fix the Yankees: 2009 Edition

[TheKilo]

Joba will follow the same plan this season as last.

[26 to 6]

...... Not if they signed the players I mentioned' date=' Dunn/Abreu,Baldelli, Nady, Melky as the 4the and Dunn can play 1B some days if they chose him over Abreu.[/quote']

The last person i would ever want to see in pinstripes is Adam Dunn. I don't mind an outfield consisting of Damon (if he isn't moved, which I dont think he would be. but if we could move him for some good parts I'd be all for it), Melky/Gardner, and Nady. As much as i like abreu there just isn't room for him, might as well get those picks. We have internal options for first base, no need to go out and overspend on someone. Damon/Matsui (if either of them are still here) have stated their willingness to play first, which would actually make some room in the outfield (perhaps allowing us to keep Abreu). The only addition I would make in the outfield is if the Yankees were somehow able to pry Matt Kemp away from the dodgers in a Cano deal. I know it's a longshot, but there have been rumors out there, particularily around the trade deadline. I think we're in good shape for next year. Improve the pitching staff, and I think we'll be good.

[jacksonianmarch]

The recent developments are interesting. Abreu's .932 post AS break OPS moved his stats into a solid to all star caliber level. near .300AVG, .371OBP, 20HR 100RBI 22SBs. And he will be 35 when the season starts next yr. I have said before that one of the 4 of Nady, Matsui, Damon and Abreu needs to go. And Abreu is probably the easiest to let go since he's a FA. Plus, now that he has shown a resurgence, he will likely get some more attention from us, but also a LOT more attention from other teams in desperate need for a right now corner OFer (Hello Mets). I think we might have kept him with an incentive laden deal if he continued down the .280AVG .780-.800OPS range he was in pre ASB. But as a .300AVG and mid .800s OPS guy with speed and a high OBP, he'll get a 3-5 yr deal easy.

 

Another development out of the yankee camp is Giambi essentially saying that he will come back for a severe pay cut. Even though he has taken some hits in the media, he says he came to NY a boy and left a man. He also said he'd stay on a short term deal. Dont look a gift horse in the mouth if you have the opportunity to hang onto him. If Tex spurns us and goes to Anaheim, I wouldnt mind Giambi on a short term, cheap deal. He did hit 32HR have nearly 100RBI, have a .375OBP and a .500+SLG.

 

I think we have seen the last of Andy Pettitte. The overall numbers were respectable for a back end starter. 14 wins, 4.51ERA, 204IP. But if you look inside the numbers, Pettitte has a very alarming trend. He has always been one of the best closers in history. Not end of game pitcher mind you, but a closer in the sense that he finishes very well. This yr was not the case. 10-7 4.03ERA preASB. 4-7 5.35ERA post ASB with a 1.53WHIP and a BAA of over .300. Plus, he said his shoulder was barking and he had an MRI prior to the end of the season, whose results were not publicized. I think the yankee stadium closing is the last time we see Andy Pettitte. And what a career it was. He'll be one of the guys who will get some votes for the HOF, but doesnt belong there. Then again, I do think his number should be retired though. 200+ victories, 4 titles, was a consistent force in our staff throughout the entire championship run. Now if he insists on playing again, I'd have to pass. No arbitration offered here IMO cause I think he'll accept it if he truly wants to come back.

 

As for Mussina, he really learned how to pitch this season. He went inside and outside with all of his pitches and became a pest. He has said he will contemplate retirement and has said before that he's okay going yr to yr. If that is truly the case, then I would pony up the greenbacks for a one yr deal. If he decides to see what the market can offer him and asks for more than a 1 yr or a 1yr with vesting option, then I'd offer the arb and see him later.

 

On to Mariano. People are saying he is gonna have shoulder surgery and whatnot. This is not the type of surgery that is concerning as they wouldnt even be operating on the shoulder per se. This is the AC joint, or right where your clavicle (collarbone) end and joins the acromion. This is not something that will affect the structural integrity of the shoulder, so if he does have surgery, then it shouldnt hinder him one bit as they arent actually entering the shoulder.

[Gom]

The recent developments are interesting. Abreu's .932 post AS break OPS moved his stats into a solid to all star caliber level. near .300AVG' date=' .371OBP, 20HR 100RBI 22SBs. And he will be 35 when the season starts next yr. I have said before that one of the 4 of Nady, Matsui, Damon and Abreu needs to go. And Abreu is probably the easiest to let go since he's a FA. Plus, now that he has shown a resurgence, he will likely get some more attention from us, but also a LOT more attention from other teams in desperate need for a right now corner OFer (Hello Mets). I think we might have kept him with an incentive laden deal if he continued down the .280AVG .780-.800OPS range he was in pre ASB. But as a .300AVG and mid .800s OPS guy with speed and a high OBP, he'll get a 3-5 yr deal easy.[/quote']

The Yankees will offer Abreu arbitration to get the picks. I think it's a mistake, a 2 year deal with the second year being a club option is the way to go.

Another development out of the yankee camp is Giambi essentially saying that he will come back for a severe pay cut. Even though he has taken some hits in the media, he says he came to NY a boy and left a man. He also said he'd stay on a short term deal. Dont look a gift horse in the mouth if you have the opportunity to hang onto him. If Tex spurns us and goes to Anaheim, I wouldnt mind Giambi on a short term, cheap deal. He did hit 32HR have nearly 100RBI, have a .375OBP and a .500+SLG.

Although I think that there really isn't room for him, the Yankees probably will find a way for him to remain.

I think we have seen the last of Andy Pettitte. The overall numbers were respectable for a back end starter. 14 wins, 4.51ERA, 204IP. But if you look inside the numbers, Pettitte has a very alarming trend. He has always been one of the best closers in history. Not end of game pitcher mind you, but a closer in the sense that he finishes very well. This yr was not the case. 10-7 4.03ERA preASB. 4-7 5.35ERA post ASB with a 1.53WHIP and a BAA of over .300. Plus, he said his shoulder was barking and he had an MRI prior to the end of the season, whose results were not publicized. I think the yankee stadium closing is the last time we see Andy Pettitte. And what a career it was. He'll be one of the guys who will get some votes for the HOF, but doesnt belong there. Then again, I do think his number should be retired though. 200+ victories, 4 titles, was a consistent force in our staff throughout the entire championship run. Now if he insists on playing again, I'd have to pass. No arbitration offered here IMO cause I think he'll accept it if he truly wants to come back.

I see the Yankees offering a one year deal to him, which I think is a mistake.

As for Mussina, he really learned how to pitch this season. He went inside and outside with all of his pitches and became a pest. He has said he will contemplate retirement and has said before that he's okay going yr to yr. If that is truly the case, then I would pony up the greenbacks for a one yr deal. If he decides to see what the market can offer him and asks for more than a 1 yr or a 1yr with vesting option, then I'd offer the arb and see him later.

Moose will come back.

On to Mariano. People are saying he is gonna have shoulder surgery and whatnot. This is not the type of surgery that is concerning as they wouldnt even be operating on the shoulder per se. This is the AC joint, or right where your clavicle (collarbone) end and joins the acromion. This is not something that will affect the structural integrity of the shoulder, so if he does have surgery, then it shouldnt hinder him one bit as they arent actually entering the shoulder.

Maybe you did go to med school after all.

I defer to you on this one. I don't question your medical knowledge, just your baseball knowledge. I figure since you don't know much about baseball, you probably know a shitload about medicine. :harhar:

[Gom]

Update:

 

I have some brainstorms. I will revamp my 2009 blueprint. More to follow, after I fix my Big Mac attack.

[Gom]

I've done some analyzing, and have come up with a revised plan for the 2009 Offseason. Without further ado, here you go. The moves that have been changed have had an asterisk assigned to them.

1. Convince CC to come to NY. I'm not so sure that he's so in love with the West Coast as the media makes him out to be. I think it's part of the gamesmanship to maximize the biggest payday for a pitcher in baseball history. Sadly, it works. He's going to top what Johan made, and he isn't worth it, but that's the price you pay for mismanagement. My call: 7 years, 140 million. [+20 million]

 

*2. Blow out the competition immediately for AJ Burnett [i had previously advocated Ben Sheets]. The truth is, the Yankees really need two starting pitchers. My change of heart is due to the fact that pitchers who switch leagues to the AL East tend to bottom out, and vice-versa. Look at Beckett his first year, and how well Pedro did when he went to the Mets, and Derek Lowe when he went to the Dodgers. Let someone else take a shot at Sheets and Lowe. Give me AJ, and pass on Sheets. Brian Bruney met with AJ, they went to dinner during the last series. Rest assured, he let AJ know what management wants.[+16 million].

 

3a. Kick the tires on Teixeira. What's not to like about a young, switch-hitting Gold Glove firstbaseman who hits for power and average? Nothing. However, I can't see the Angels letting him go. I'd offer him 17 million a year for 6 years, but my guess is he'll stay in Anaheim. Of course if he takes it, I'd have to revamp some of the thinking. I'm assuming he stays out in the sun in Cali. If you can't, and you probably won't be able to sign Texeira, then that leads to 3B.[break even with Giambi's 2008 salary]

 

*3b. Bring back Giambi. On second thought, we would be better off bringing back the Big Sexy. Looking at his final numbers, and realizing that what's out there would cost a lot more than what we could bring back, Giambi as the full time 1B is the best option. One year deal, mutual option at 10 million is a good call. Factoring in the $5 million payout, it's a net of [- 3 million].

 

*4. The shocker of the off-season. Get ready for this. Sign Manny Ramirez. 4 years $70 million. The market is really reduced to three teams. Dodgers, Yankees, Mets. That's it. The Mets have bullpen and rotation issues. The Dodgers are forced to make a run at him. Manny should be Bronx-bound. Don't buy this "Manny will be Manny" crap. He was a happy and productive player in Cleveland. In recent years, you have had a slew of "bad" people leave the Red Sox and join the Yankees. Boggs, Clemens, Damon. Don't lose sight of the fact that Manny is from Jackson Heights, and nothing would make him happier than to beat the pants off of Boston. Signing one of the best hitters in the game that's got a personal vendetta against your hated rivals would be a coup we haven't seen since Ruth joined the Yankees. If you give 4 years, you get three productive ones from Manny. This move alone will give the Yankees one ring in the next three years. Maybe more. Just ask the Red Sox if he was worth the money. They are still without a championship since 1918 if not for this guy. [+18 million]

 

5. Resign Abreu for 2 years, 11 million a season, club option in second year. He claims to want to come back. Let's see if he does. Abreu is one of those players whose value is greater than the first look. He can run, he takes pitches, and can succeed in the pressure cooker of New York. Plus, the Yankees, being an older team, will have injuries. They need to rotate their players to keep them fresh. This will be one of Cashman's big mistakes this off-season. Letting Abreu go. I say keep him. [+11 million, net -6 million]

 

6. Trade Nady. There is no place for him. With Giambi at 1B, Manny at DH, and re-signing Abreu, you have one too many OFs. Which Yankee OF has the greatest trade value? Nady, who ironically, is their worst hitting starting OF. Nady came back to earth with the Yankees. He's a career .794 OPS hitter. For the Yankees, he had a .793 OPS. Expect a full-season of about .280 BA and .330 OBP and a .450 SLG. Not what you'd really want, but as far as value goes, he gives a lot of bang for your buck. Trading Nady for some prospects will offset one set of prospects lost in signing CC or Manny [and Tex if they can lure him]. -3.3 million

 

7. Bring back Moose. He also is used to New York, and likes it here. A good guy to have around, and a nice change of pace in the rotation. 2 year contract at 11 million, with the second being a club or mutual option, is the way to go. [Wash].

 

8. Do not trade Cano. If anything, Cano's struggles this year will probably be a bit of a wakeup call. Will he get back to the .330 BA he once had? Doubtful. However, look for him to generate more power next year as he has closed up his stance a bit. Giving up on him at this point is a mistake. This will be Cashman's biggest mistake this off-season if he get's rid of him.

 

9. Trade or release Marte. $6 million for a wild lefty reliever in the pen? I'll take my chances with Coke. Better mechanics, better speed. A bullpen of Mariano, Bruney, Coke, Veras, and Robertson should be sufficient. I see the Yankees cutting costs here and going with their youth in the pen, which is actually starting to look like a strength in the Cashman Era. [-5.75 million]

 

10. Say goodbye to Pettitte [-16 million], Ivan Rodriguez [-using Farnswoth's salary of 6 million], Pavano [-9 mill [11 million-2mil buy out]. If Pettitte wants to come back, that would be fine to bring him back at no more than 8 million a season. I don't see him taking a 50% paycut, so it may be fitting that he started the last game at the old stadium. Total saving from this trio: [35 million]

 

So there you have it. The new updated plan. I may tweak this a bit before the start of the off-season, but when you put it all together, you have a net decrease in payroll of one million. Not a lot, but a start in the right direction.

 

So, according to my plan, you'd have the following lineup:

 

CF Damon

SS Jeter

RF Abreu

3B Arod

DH Ramirez

LF Matsui

C Posada/Molina

1B Giambi

2B Cano

 

 

You can move Molina down in the lineup. The important thing is that you will be able to rotate some of these players out with Brett Gardner, who has shown an ability to be a terror on the basepaths, and will be the defensive replacement CF, taking Abreu or Damon out of the game. He can also spell those guys once a week each to give them a rest.

 

Starting rotation:

 

CC Sabathia

AJ Burnett

Wang

Joba

Mussina

 

For goodness sake, the Yankees #4 pitcher would be an ace on most teams in baseball. You'd have Hughes and Rasner as backups in case someone gets hurt or Moose comes back down to earth. You can never have too much pitching. You can also play around with moving Joba back to the pen if Hughes has an awesome spring.

 

Bullpen:

 

Mariano

Coke

Bruney

Veras

Ramirez/Robertson/Aceves

 

All this and you save a million a year from this year. If Pettitte comes back, it would be an increase of 7 million, but I don't see that happening. If it does, who really cares? The Yankees are posed to make nearly $400 million next year anyways. The important thing is that you're bringing back a lot of players who want to come back on reduced contract lengths due to club options. Another overhaul is needed next season for the OF, but at least the rotation is in place. Maybe this Austin Jackson guy pans out, but you have Magglio and Crawford and Holiday as free agents, and Damon, Matsui, and Abreu [option] coming off the books, the team can be remade on the fly again. With increased revenue from the stadium, this would be a two or three year transitionary period of intense free agent activity until some of the young players who Cashman drafted either come up and make a difference, or he's relieved from duty.

 

Your thoughts on the update?

[Cocos Disciples]

Mmhmm, yep.

[Gom]

Mmhmm' date=' yep.[/quote']

Let me dream of happiness if Cashman comes back, and then decides to trade Cano for Kemp, dump Abreu and Giambi and replace them with Gardner and Shelley Duncan, and this time is convinced that Hughes and Kennedy will make the rotation with Wang and Joba after Moose and Pettitte take one look at this team and realize they're better off retiring.

 

Seriously though, what do you see wrong with it? The big thing was working Manny into it, and the way I see it, it's really only two teams, us and the Dodgers. You can bet your ass Boras is going to push him on the Yankees.

[TheKilo]

CC will not pitch in NY

AJ is not technically a FA yet, rumor has it Toronto is going to do what they can to sign him

I hope the Yankees sign another LF/DH, they're lacking on those lately.

If you're "kicking the tires on Teixeira", why is Giambi coming back?

Abreu will get more on the FA market, IMO - maybe even the Mets, they need a corner OF with some pop

I hope you go with Coke instead of Marte, garbage time tells you nothing

 

Bold prediction - the Yankees will finish third again next season

[Cocos Disciples]

I doubt Manny goes to the Yankees. I could very well see CC going to the Yanks, but as Kilo said, Burnett will probably sign with Toronto. Overall though it's hard to make predictions this early.

[Gom]

AJ will opt out to find out what other teams are going to offer. I would say that's a pretty strong bet. Why not test the market and see what you're worth is? With the richest team in sports has money to burn and have all but salivated over you, don't you think it's a smart move to test the market? Also, the Blue Jays lose nothing by making an offer to Burnett. If he takes it, great. If not, you've just pushed the Yankee payroll up by raising the bar.

 

As for kicking the tires on Teixeira, I don't think the Angels will get shut out this off-season. I'm trying to be realistic and realize that they won't get everyone they target. The Angels are losing K-Rod, and I figure they get one or the other, Tex or CC. Considering they have Lackey, Saunders, Santana and Weaver, I see Tex as being a bigger priority. I also see CC as being the bigger priority for the Yankees. Kind of a common sense thing.

 

There is no doubt that the Yankees will offer less for Abreu than other teams. Like I said, a one year deal [they'll offer him arbitration for sure] with a club option if he accepts. If he does, and you can't work out a 2 year deal, you get a productive OF for one season, although pricey. If it doesn't work, you get the compensation picks and move Nady to RF, Damon to CF and Matsui to left, with Manny as the DH. I don't think there is a Yankee fan who wouldn't trade Abreu and 2 million for Manny, which is what the difference in salaries would be. Arod, Manny, Giambi or Ortiz, Youk, and Drew? Which one scares you more?

 

I am not looking at Coke as being the answer, I am just not sold on a reliever who has poor control in Marte. I like Coke's mechanics and he has a decent fastball with decent control. Do I think he's a solid reliever, the new bridge to Mariano? No. I see a 1.30 WHIP, a 4.20 ERA. An average reliever who hopefully will get better with experience. Incidentally, that's what I expect you'd get out of Marte. Why spend six million for the same production you can pretty much get out of 300K? Plus, relievers have a longer initial effective time, since they don't pitch as often. Just ask Oki. He went a full season before teams figured him out.

 

How bold is that prediction Kilo? They finished 3rd this year. A bold prediction would be first or last place. Predicting the same place as the year before hardly qualifies as bold.

[CrespoBlows]

That defense that you project is awful. Jeter is below average, A-Rod is average, Cano can be very good, but he's very lazy, Matsui has never been good, Damon is absolutely awful in CF, Abreu is afraid of the RF wall, and only Ryan Howard is worse than Giambi on defense at 1B.

 

I'd get rid of Damon, Abreu, and Matsui. Both players are old, declining with the bat, and defensive liabilites. I'd keep Nady, but platoon him with someone like Matt Stairs.

 

I think this team's position players are too old, and the young players aren't any good for the Yankees to make any major leaps next year. They need to be patient, shed those horrible contracts, invest heavily in the draft, and then make major splashes to compliment an already strong core. Currently, they have a very old lineup, a variety of underachieving young players, and a rotation that is average.

[CrespoBlows]

Who figured Okajima out?

 

He's been rock solid out of the pen.

[TheKilo]

Okajima gave up one more earned run this year than last. One.

[Gom]

Okajima gave up one more earned run this year than last. One.

I thought Oki had done a lot worse. My bad. I remember when he was sucking, and I haven't seen him pitch against the Yankees or heard much either. I dropped the soap on Oki. My bad.

 

As for the Yankees defensively, yes, they are poor. We saw earlier this year how many wins Melky gave us with his stellar defensive play. Defense is overrated in my mind. The offensive contributions of the following players outweigh any defensive deficiencies:

 

All the starting Yankees [with the exception of Posada], with the jury out on Matsui due to injury.

 

Last I checked, you guys did ok when Papi was still playing the field and Manny was in the OF.

[CrespoBlows]

Last I checked, you guys did ok when Papi was still playing the field and Manny was in the OF.

 

Fenway Park covered Manny's defensive problems. The rest of the outfield was relatively good.

 

In 2004, Johnny Damon was still a good CF. Trot Nixon played above average defense in RF. Bill Mueller was average at 3B. Cabrera was good at SS. Bellhorn was average, and surprisingly Millar was OK at 1B.

 

In 2007, the Red Sox had an outstanding defense. Crisp played HOF defense in CF. Lowell and Youkilis played Gold Glove defense at the corners. Pedroia and Drew were average. Lugo and Manny pretty bad, but the Red Sox pitching staff was second in strikeouts. Manny was helped by Fenway, and Coco Crisp being on his right.

 

Ortiz has never been the full time 1B of a championship Red Sox club.

[YAZMAN]

I've done some analyzing, and have come up with a revised plan for the 2009 Offseason. Without further ado, here you go. The moves that have been changed have had an asterisk assigned to them.

1. Convince CC to come to NY. I'm not so sure that he's so in love with the West Coast as the media makes him out to be. I think it's part of the gamesmanship to maximize the biggest payday for a pitcher in baseball history. Sadly, it works. He's going to top what Johan made, and he isn't worth it, but that's the price you pay for mismanagement. My call: 7 years, 140 million. [+20 million]

 

*2. Blow out the competition immediately for AJ Burnett [i had previously advocated Ben Sheets]. The truth is, the Yankees really need two starting pitchers. My change of heart is due to the fact that pitchers who switch leagues to the AL East tend to bottom out, and vice-versa. Look at Beckett his first year, and how well Pedro did when he went to the Mets, and Derek Lowe when he went to the Dodgers. Let someone else take a shot at Sheets and Lowe. Give me AJ, and pass on Sheets. Brian Bruney met with AJ, they went to dinner during the last series. Rest assured, he let AJ know what management wants.[+16 million].

 

3a. Kick the tires on Teixeira. What's not to like about a young, switch-hitting Gold Glove firstbaseman who hits for power and average? Nothing. However, I can't see the Angels letting him go. I'd offer him 17 million a year for 6 years, but my guess is he'll stay in Anaheim. Of course if he takes it, I'd have to revamp some of the thinking. I'm assuming he stays out in the sun in Cali. If you can't, and you probably won't be able to sign Texeira, then that leads to 3B.[break even with Giambi's 2008 salary]

 

*3b. Bring back Giambi. On second thought, we would be better off bringing back the Big Sexy. Looking at his final numbers, and realizing that what's out there would cost a lot more than what we could bring back, Giambi as the full time 1B is the best option. One year deal, mutual option at 10 million is a good call. Factoring in the $5 million payout, it's a net of [- 3 million].

 

*4. The shocker of the off-season. Get ready for this. Sign Manny Ramirez. 4 years $70 million. The market is really reduced to three teams. Dodgers, Yankees, Mets. That's it. The Mets have bullpen and rotation issues. The Dodgers are forced to make a run at him. Manny should be Bronx-bound. Don't buy this "Manny will be Manny" crap. He was a happy and productive player in Cleveland. In recent years, you have had a slew of "bad" people leave the Red Sox and join the Yankees. Boggs, Clemens, Damon. Don't lose sight of the fact that Manny is from Jackson Heights, and nothing would make him happier than to beat the pants off of Boston. Signing one of the best hitters in the game that's got a personal vendetta against your hated rivals would be a coup we haven't seen since Ruth joined the Yankees. If you give 4 years, you get three productive ones from Manny. This move alone will give the Yankees one ring in the next three years. Maybe more. Just ask the Red Sox if he was worth the money. They are still without a championship since 1918 if not for this guy. [+18 million]

 

5. Resign Abreu for 2 years, 11 million a season, club option in second year. He claims to want to come back. Let's see if he does. Abreu is one of those players whose value is greater than the first look. He can run, he takes pitches, and can succeed in the pressure cooker of New York. Plus, the Yankees, being an older team, will have injuries. They need to rotate their players to keep them fresh. This will be one of Cashman's big mistakes this off-season. Letting Abreu go. I say keep him. [+11 million, net -6 million]

 

6. Trade Nady. There is no place for him. With Giambi at 1B, Manny at DH, and re-signing Abreu, you have one too many OFs. Which Yankee OF has the greatest trade value? Nady, who ironically, is their worst hitting starting OF. Nady came back to earth with the Yankees. He's a career .794 OPS hitter. For the Yankees, he had a .793 OPS. Expect a full-season of about .280 BA and .330 OBP and a .450 SLG. Not what you'd really want, but as far as value goes, he gives a lot of bang for your buck. Trading Nady for some prospects will offset one set of prospects lost in signing CC or Manny [and Tex if they can lure him]. -3.3 million

 

7. Bring back Moose. He also is used to New York, and likes it here. A good guy to have around, and a nice change of pace in the rotation. 2 year contract at 11 million, with the second being a club or mutual option, is the way to go. [Wash].

 

8. Do not trade Cano. If anything, Cano's struggles this year will probably be a bit of a wakeup call. Will he get back to the .330 BA he once had? Doubtful. However, look for him to generate more power next year as he has closed up his stance a bit. Giving up on him at this point is a mistake. This will be Cashman's biggest mistake this off-season if he get's rid of him.

 

9. Trade or release Marte. $6 million for a wild lefty reliever in the pen? I'll take my chances with Coke. Better mechanics, better speed. A bullpen of Mariano, Bruney, Coke, Veras, and Robertson should be sufficient. I see the Yankees cutting costs here and going with their youth in the pen, which is actually starting to look like a strength in the Cashman Era. [-5.75 million]

 

10. Say goodbye to Pettitte [-16 million], Ivan Rodriguez [-using Farnswoth's salary of 6 million], Pavano [-9 mill [11 million-2mil buy out]. If Pettitte wants to come back, that would be fine to bring him back at no more than 8 million a season. I don't see him taking a 50% paycut, so it may be fitting that he started the last game at the old stadium. Total saving from this trio: [35 million]

 

So there you have it. The new updated plan. I may tweak this a bit before the start of the off-season, but when you put it all together, you have a net decrease in payroll of one million. Not a lot, but a start in the right direction.

 

So, according to my plan, you'd have the following lineup:

 

CF Damon

SS Jeter

RF Abreu

3B Arod

DH Ramirez

LF Matsui

C Posada/Molina

1B Giambi

2B Cano

 

 

You can move Molina down in the lineup. The important thing is that you will be able to rotate some of these players out with Brett Gardner, who has shown an ability to be a terror on the basepaths, and will be the defensive replacement CF, taking Abreu or Damon out of the game. He can also spell those guys once a week each to give them a rest.

 

Starting rotation:

 

CC Sabathia

AJ Burnett

Wang

Joba

Mussina

 

For goodness sake, the Yankees #4 pitcher would be an ace on most teams in baseball. You'd have Hughes and Rasner as backups in case someone gets hurt or Moose comes back down to earth. You can never have too much pitching. You can also play around with moving Joba back to the pen if Hughes has an awesome spring.

 

Bullpen:

 

Mariano

Coke

Bruney

Veras

Ramirez/Robertson/Aceves

 

All this and you save a million a year from this year. If Pettitte comes back, it would be an increase of 7 million, but I don't see that happening. If it does, who really cares? The Yankees are posed to make nearly $400 million next year anyways. The important thing is that you're bringing back a lot of players who want to come back on reduced contract lengths due to club options. Another overhaul is needed next season for the OF, but at least the rotation is in place. Maybe this Austin Jackson guy pans out, but you have Magglio and Crawford and Holiday as free agents, and Damon, Matsui, and Abreu [option] coming off the books, the team can be remade on the fly again. With increased revenue from the stadium, this would be a two or three year transitionary period of intense free agent activity until some of the young players who Cashman drafted either come up and make a difference, or he's relieved from duty.

 

Your thoughts on the update?

 

Dear Gom,

 

I think Jacko stole your password.

 

Sincerely,

 

YAZMAN

 

PS - If that lineup were any older, the team would be traveling on a AAA tour bus with their AARP cards.

[jacksonianmarch]

You gotta keep Nady. He's a versatile defender, albeit average at both COF position as well as 1B. But when you look at our offense, you need the righty balance.

 

Giambi, Cano, Damon, Matsui, Abreu?, Gardner?, Miranda?, Posada is better from the left. All guys could be on our roster next yr. The only right handed balance in terms of power is Nady and ARod. So he wont be going anywhere.

 

I have told you before that Marte was getting abused in Pittsburgh and his arm started barking for us. He appeared in one game during a 10 day stretch to rest the tendonitis in his elbow and since then, he was lights out. 11IP 5H 2ER 4BB 13K to finish the yr. He got a one yr option at 6 mil that you have to pick up. While I like Coke a lot, he picked up about 3mph on his fastball since the move to the pen and I'd want to see he sustain that before isolating him in our pen as the only lefty reliever.

 

Our pen is gonna be very, very good next yr. Here are all the candidates.

 

1. Mariano will be back after having off season AC joint surgery (which is pretty much nothing). And he's coming off the best season of his career. For those who wish to look, take a look at the stats. They're preposterous. 1.40ERA 39/40 Sv/SvOp 98%Sv% 70.2IP 41H 77K 6BB 9.8K/9IP 12.8K/BB 0.67WHIP. The bolded parts are all career bests for a full season. His K/9 total was his second best of his career. Just ridiculous

 

2. Veras will be returning coming off a pretty damn good first yr in the bigs. Its even better when you note how poorly he finished, most likely due to fatigue in his first full MLB pen season.

 

3. Edwar also has his first full yr under his belt, which was solid by all standards, especially when you look at the stellar peripherals (1.23WHIP, 10.25K/9IP).

 

4. Marte as indicated above

 

5. Phil Coke, after being nearly dealt to Pitt, came up in late August and has been lights out as a middle reliever/long man. Remember, as a former starter, he has the capability to be more than just a lefty specialist. His numbers were dazzling. 14.2IP 8H 1ER 14K 2BB 0.68WHIP. As I said above, dont let his numbers and stuff fool you. He was in the 86-90 range as a starter last yr. This yr, he was throwing 90-92 as a starter in AA and is throwing 92-95 as a reliever. I dont know if he was on a strengthening program (legal or illegal), but big jumps in velocity can sometimes mean a drop the following yr. I am not ready to just hand him the reigns as the lefty specialist.

 

6. Brian Bruney- 34.1IP 18H 14BB 33K. Another sub 1 WHIP kind of guy who looked damn good this yr, even with the lisfranc injury

 

7. Joba Chamberlain, if he is healthy and if he doesnt see winter ball. It looks like the yankees are easing off the pedal. They were gonna reconvert him to a starter and get him some innings out in ARI fall league. But after his injury, he said he was taking it easy a bit and the heater just wasnt there. It looks like they're gonna monkey around with him some more and start him in the pen to build up his innings. Didnt they learn that this didnt work last yr? I think Joba's future may be in the pen now that we've f***ed him over enough. So here he is. Our dominant 8th inning guy.

 

8. David Robertson- didnt like the walks, but the K/9IP was solid. He was 23 in only his second season of professional baseball, so he has some learning to do. But he throws well, has a nice bender and will see a lot of time in the majors in 2009.

 

9. Jonathan Albaladejo will be back from his elbow stress fracture. Word is, the velocity was down after his rehab, so he'll likely begin the yr on the DL in the minors. But when he was right, he was pretty solid. His numbers look pretty crappy, but as a reliever, one outing can skew anything. On May 1, he was left out there to burn since the pen was spent. He went 1.2IP 6H 4ER. Outside of that outing, 12IP 9H 2ER 3BB 10K. Not bad. If he is healthy, he is another guy who can swing between long relief and short.

 

10. Humberto Sanchez is back and throwing smoke. He'll see time in the majors next yr

 

11. Dan Geise was a solid long relief option, who I think has the inside track on being the 6th man/ long reliever on this team.

 

12. Kei Igawa may see time as a long man next yr. He quietly was a very solid pitcher in AAA this yr.

 

13. Dont forget about the minor leagues. Mark Melancon will break camp in the majors this yr, unless he just has an awful ST. I have him pegged as our #3 prospect and he was a beast this yr. 95IP 69H 89K 22BB. Pretty dominant. And the only reason why he threw 95IP out of the pen is because it would take him 3-4 innings to reach his pitch limit. I have seen BA and other news orgs label him a "beast", a "sure thing", etc. He's Mo's replacement BTW and one of our biggest trade chips, who I dont think we should deal. And when you consider this was his first full yr back from TJ, you have to be impressed.

 

14. JB Cox started the yr on fire, then fell flat on his face. But it was his first yr back from TJ, so some fatigue was expected. He will be in our plans.

 

15. And there are too many more to count. Lots and lots of starters are pegged to relieve in the future.

 

What does this all point to? A trade. We have a lot of young talent in our bullpen, too much to fit onto 2 teams, let alone 1.

[TheKilo]

You gotta keep Nady. He's a versatile defender, albeit average at both COF position as well as 1B. But when you look at our offense, you need the righty balance.

 

Giambi, Cano, Damon, Matsui, Abreu?, Gardner?, Miranda?, Posada is better from the left. All guys could be on our roster next yr. The only right handed balance in terms of power is Nady and ARod. So he wont be going anywhere.

 

I have told you before that Marte was getting abused in Pittsburgh and his arm started barking for us. He appeared in one game during a 10 day stretch to rest the tendonitis in his elbow and since then, he was lights out. 11IP 5H 2ER 4BB 13K to finish the yr. He got a one yr option at 6 mil that you have to pick up. While I like Coke a lot, he picked up about 3mph on his fastball since the move to the pen and I'd want to see he sustain that before isolating him in our pen as the only lefty reliever.

 

Our pen is gonna be very, very good next yr. Here are all the candidates.

 

1. Mariano will be back after having off season AC joint surgery (which is pretty much nothing). And he's coming off the best season of his career. For those who wish to look, take a look at the stats. They're preposterous. 1.40ERA 39/40 Sv/SvOp 98%Sv% 70.2IP 41H 77K 6BB 9.8K/9IP 12.8K/BB 0.67WHIP. The bolded parts are all career bests for a full season. His K/9 total was his second best of his career. Just ridiculous

 

2. Veras will be returning coming off a pretty damn good first yr in the bigs. Its even better when you note how poorly he finished, most likely due to fatigue in his first full MLB pen season.

 

3. Edwar also has his first full yr under his belt, which was solid by all standards, especially when you look at the stellar peripherals (1.23WHIP, 10.25K/9IP).

 

4. Marte as indicated above

 

5. Phil Coke, after being nearly dealt to Pitt, came up in late August and has been lights out as a middle reliever/long man. Remember, as a former starter, he has the capability to be more than just a lefty specialist. His numbers were dazzling. 14.2IP 8H 1ER 14K 2BB 0.68WHIP. As I said above, dont let his numbers and stuff fool you. He was in the 86-90 range as a starter last yr. This yr, he was throwing 90-92 as a starter in AA and is throwing 92-95 as a reliever. I dont know if he was on a strengthening program (legal or illegal), but big jumps in velocity can sometimes mean a drop the following yr. I am not ready to just hand him the reigns as the lefty specialist.

 

6. Brian Bruney- 34.1IP 18H 14BB 33K. Another sub 1 WHIP kind of guy who looked damn good this yr, even with the lisfranc injury

 

7. Joba Chamberlain, if he is healthy and if he doesnt see winter ball. It looks like the yankees are easing off the pedal. They were gonna reconvert him to a starter and get him some innings out in ARI fall league. But after his injury, he said he was taking it easy a bit and the heater just wasnt there. It looks like they're gonna monkey around with him some more and start him in the pen to build up his innings. Didnt they learn that this didnt work last yr? I think Joba's future may be in the pen now that we've f***ed him over enough. So here he is. Our dominant 8th inning guy.

 

8. David Robertson- didnt like the walks, but the K/9IP was solid. He was 23 in only his second season of professional baseball, so he has some learning to do. But he throws well, has a nice bender and will see a lot of time in the majors in 2009.

 

9. Jonathan Albaladejo will be back from his elbow stress fracture. Word is, the velocity was down after his rehab, so he'll likely begin the yr on the DL in the minors. But when he was right, he was pretty solid. His numbers look pretty crappy, but as a reliever, one outing can skew anything. On May 1, he was left out there to burn since the pen was spent. He went 1.2IP 6H 4ER. Outside of that outing, 12IP 9H 2ER 3BB 10K. Not bad. If he is healthy, he is another guy who can swing between long relief and short.

 

10. Humberto Sanchez is back and throwing smoke. He'll see time in the majors next yr

 

11. Dan Geise was a solid long relief option, who I think has the inside track on being the 6th man/ long reliever on this team.

 

12. Kei Igawa may see time as a long man next yr. He quietly was a very solid pitcher in AAA this yr.

 

13. Dont forget about the minor leagues. Mark Melancon will break camp in the majors this yr, unless he just has an awful ST. I have him pegged as our #3 prospect and he was a beast this yr. 95IP 69H 89K 22BB. Pretty dominant. And the only reason why he threw 95IP out of the pen is because it would take him 3-4 innings to reach his pitch limit. I have seen BA and other news orgs label him a "beast", a "sure thing", etc. He's Mo's replacement BTW and one of our biggest trade chips, who I dont think we should deal. And when you consider this was his first full yr back from TJ, you have to be impressed.

 

14. JB Cox started the yr on fire, then fell flat on his face. But it was his first yr back from TJ, so some fatigue was expected. He will be in our plans.

 

15. And there are too many more to count. Lots and lots of starters are pegged to relieve in the future.

 

What does this all point to? A trade. We have a lot of young talent in our bullpen, too much to fit onto 2 teams, let alone 1.

 

lolwut

[26 to 6]

I can't help but shake my head at a lot of what has been said in this thread. For one, both Nady and Marte need to stay put. Nady has been good since coming over, he's got a decent contract, and i think he fits well with this team. A lefty duo of Coke and Marte in the pen is extraordinary, assuming Marte can adjust better in a full season. Either way, it's way too early to give up on him, $6 million or not.

 

I absolutely agree with every point made by Jacko on the bullpen. Our real priority, as we all know has to be starting pitching. I'm not big on Burnett, but I wouldn't be overly opposed to him coming aboard. C.C. would be nice, although historically I have never been a big C.C. fan and always kinda considered him overrated, but based on what he did this year and down the stretch, albeit in the NL Central, definitely can't be overlooked. I still don't think he would want to come here though. He likes hitting and the west coast. We'll see though, we all know money talks.

 

Giambi would definitely be welcomed back by me, only if he is willing to take a significant paycut. Time to see if he'll put his money where his mouth is and stand by his self-proclaimed Yankee love affair, or if he bolts elsewhere for more money. I say $5 mil should be our absolute max on Giambi, if he wants more then sayonara, give us those picks. I'm up in the air about Abreu, he's been terrific since coming over, but the numbers game comes into play big. When you have Damon, Matsui, Gardner, Melky, Nady and Abreu a lot of tough decisions have to be made. If Nady were more willing to spend some increased time at first that would be helpful. I'm not talking all the time or anything, but once in a while here and there. I think he only appeared in 1 or 2 games at first for us this year. If not, remember that both Damon and Matsui have stated they would be willing to do some work around the bag in camp. As for Cano, I would be very disappointed if he's traded. I think it would be a HUGE mistake. The only way I would even slightly consider moving Cano is if Matt Kemp were coming back our way, but that would only complicate things further with our excess of outfielders.

 

I think our bench will be pretty solid again, I dont know if too many additions need to be made as long as we have that outfield excess and the versatility of Ransom and Betemit in the infield. Jose Molina, AKA the best backup catcher in baseball will hold it down behind the plate backing up Jorge. If the numbers allowed for it I wouldn't be absolutely opposed to holding onto Pudge and letting them all share time, if he wanted to that is. But that's a near impossibility, and he's certain to go. I know he was bordering on Type b status last time I checked, so hopefully he still qualifies and we can get a pick for him.

 

We have tons of insurance arms in the minors, which proved helpful this year, so i think in that regard we're good. Honestly, I dont think much needs to be changed this offseason for us to be right back where we belong next season. But the offseason is long and unpredictable, so we'll see what happens.

[Gom]

26, a couple of things you don't realize. First of all, to get the picks, you have to offer arbitration if it is available [correct me if I'm wrong here]. Secondly, Giambi is not going to take a 16 million paycut after a 100 RBI season. I looked at the numbers, and he'd be looking at at least 12 million at the bare minimum to stay.

 

As for our bench being solid again...it wasn't solid this last year. It was terrible. Please don't include Melky in the discussions for OFers. He's not a viable major league player. When you said Nady is a good OF...I don't consider a .793 OPS OF that good. He's not a great defensive OFer, and offensively, he's average at best. I'd consider moving him and bringing in a solid right-handed OFer [burrell or Manny comes to mind].

 

Don't fool yourself into thinking that the Yankees don't have to do a lot. The injuries were not an aberration. This is an old team that needs a lot of flexibility in the lineup. Their players will regress more quickly than in Tampa and Boston, and they will lose more time due to injury. They are not as close as you think. It was this thought process that caused the problem.

[ORS]

Yeah, you have to offer him arb to get the picks, and after making $22M to go for 30+ bombs and 100 RBI, he won't take a cut in arbitration. He's already said he wants to stay, so he'll accept arb. The only option for the Yankees is to take him at his word and work out a reduced AAV deal, or let him go all-together. No picks coming back from Giambi (unless they broker some under the table deal for him to decline arb).

[jacksonianmarch]

Wait, this is an old team, so you want to get older by adding manny and keeping abreu? That makes no sense. To be honest with you, this team has so much in flux right now and the FA market is so good that predictions and wants will change daily.

 

Again on Nady, he finished the yr at a line of .305 25HR 97RBI. He hit .268 12HR 40RBI in 59 games for us and only because he slumped for us in Sept, when we were out of it. Over the past 2 yrs, Nady has hit in the .320 range with RISP and RISP with 2 outs, something this team has badly needed. 3 of the last 4 seasons have seen him at a .800+OPS and the only season that wasnt was a yr he missed a lot of time with injury. He finally became a full time player in 2007 and since then he's been well over the .800OPS mark, based mostly on the SLG. He reminds me a lot of some of the players we had during our champioship run. Good RBI guy, good doubles guy, can hit it out, is versatile, etc. And, with Cashman returing, you better believe we didnt give up Tabata and McCutchen for half yr rentals. Both are staying, so deal with it.

 

Overall, a lot of things will be floated. One of them will be a potential deal with SF. They need young offense, we need starting pitching, and a Matt Cain for Robby Cano deal has been on the rumor wire for a long time now. We'll kick the tires on Manny and on Pat Burrell. We'll make a good run at Tex. We will destroy the competition for CC, and the only way he isnt in pinstripes is if he doesnt want to come here. We'll kick the tires on Dunn, although I think we pass ultimately. Giambi will be in the fracas, and he will be our fallback option should Tex leave. Burnett is a wild card and should be considered mostly because he has stayed healthy for consecutive yrs and finally showed he can avoid the free pass.

 

But all in all, I think our team will get better. Adding Wang and a healthy Joba will help. Having Posada behind the dish while moving Molina to backup will help a ton. Getting Cano off to a normal start should have him in the .300 range for 09. A lot of bad things need to happen again to keep this team from being very competitive next yr.

[jacksonianmarch]

Yeah' date=' you have to offer him arb to get the picks, and after making $22M to go for 30+ bombs and 100 RBI, he won't take a cut in arbitration. He's already said he wants to stay, so he'll accept arb. The only option for the Yankees is to take him at his word and work out a reduced AAV deal, or let him go all-together. No picks coming back from Giambi (unless they broker some under the table deal for him to decline arb).[/quote']

 

or unless he signs with another team prior to the arb deadline. This actually happens a good amount of the time. A player signs elsewhere before the arb deadline and makes the decision easy for the team the player is leaving. I dont think that happens here, though, since there are better options and Giambi will have limited suitors (Al team, unafraid of the negative pub from his roid admittance).

[BSN07]

or unless he signs with another team prior to the arb deadline. This actually happens a good amount of the time. A player signs elsewhere before the arb deadline and makes the decision easy for the team the player is leaving. I dont think that happens here' date=' though, since there are better options and Giambi will have limited suitors (Al team, unafraid of the negative pub from his roid admittance).[/quote']

 

I think Giambi heads back west. I don't know, for some reason i'm thinking SF. They don't see seem to care about roids, and he be a name on a piss poor team. Theres not too many teams out there looking for a DH. I don't see him on a contender, maybe a team that thinks there close and make a splash, maybe Seattle.

[Gom]

Wait' date=' this is an old team, so you want to get older by adding manny and keeping abreu? That makes no sense. To be honest with you, this team has so much in flux right now and the FA market is so good that predictions and wants will change daily.[/quote']

You still love untested youth at the expense of productive experience. Abreu had 100 runs, 100 RBI's and hit .290. Even a drop off will see him in the .280-80-80 range with a 3.70 OBP. Manny is a .900+ OPS hitter for the next 3 seasons.

Again on Nady, he finished the yr at a line of .305 25HR 97RBI. He hit .268 12HR 40RBI in 59 games for us and only because he slumped for us in Sept, when we were out of it. Over the past 2 yrs, Nady has hit in the .320 range with RISP and RISP with 2 outs, something this team has badly needed. 3 of the last 4 seasons have seen him at a .800+OPS and the only season that wasnt was a yr he missed a lot of time with injury. He finally became a full time player in 2007 and since then he's been well over the .800OPS mark, based mostly on the SLG. He reminds me a lot of some of the players we had during our champioship run. Good RBI guy, good doubles guy, can hit it out, is versatile, etc. And, with Cashman returing, you better believe we didnt give up Tabata and McCutchen for half yr rentals. Both are staying, so deal with it.

Mistakes are made. The bigger mistakes are sticking with them. Was Nady/Marte a mistake? No. It just didn't work out, since the Yankees didn't make the playoffs. Jacko, saying that Nady slumped but it didn't matter because we are out of it is laughable. So Cano's resurgence didn't mean anything? Neither did Hughes good starts? Or Phil Coke? Or Brett Gardner? Come on, buddy. You dropped the soap on that one.

 

Also, Nady's OPS since 2005: .760, .790, .806, .867. The .867 OPS is highly skewed to his time in Pittsburgh. He had a .793 OPS with us. That is more in line with what he'd be. What we saw in New York is what we'd get over a season. I'm not that impressed. He has the most value in a trade, so I'd dump him, recoup some of what you gave up. Holding on to prove a point is what hurt us initially in not getting Santana, and then not trading for CC. Remember, this is what we SHOULD do, not what Cashman would do. If Cashman comes back, look for another 3rd place finish while touting youth. When that youth arrives and it sucks, it will be "Oops. I guess I missed...but wait..there is this 12 year old parapalegic we signed from Burkina Faso who will be the next Hall of Famer, once he recovers from Tommy John surgery". What I'm saying is that I'd like to use Nady and Marte to recoup some of the draft picks lost [i.e. prospects] in signing one, two, or three Type A free agents.

Overall, a lot of things will be floated. One of them will be a potential deal with SF. They need young offense, we need starting pitching, and a Matt Cain for Robby Cano deal has been on the rumor wire for a long time now. We'll kick the tires on Manny and on Pat Burrell. We'll make a good run at Tex. We will destroy the competition for CC, and the only way he isnt in pinstripes is if he doesnt want to come here. We'll kick the tires on Dunn, although I think we pass ultimately. Giambi will be in the fracas, and he will be our fallback option should Tex leave. Burnett is a wild card and should be considered mostly because he has stayed healthy for consecutive yrs and finally showed he can avoid the free pass.

 

But all in all, I think our team will get better. Adding Wang and a healthy Joba will help. Having Posada behind the dish while moving Molina to backup will help a ton. Getting Cano off to a normal start should have him in the .300 range for 09. A lot of bad things need to happen again to keep this team from being very competitive next yr

According to Brian Sabean, Matt Cain is untouchable. His words. Read transcript here. You're overly optimistic. The Yankees are on a downward trend. I say the new drop off is 32 years old. Jeter, Abreu, Giambi, Posada, Mariano, Arod, Damon, Matsui are all on the wrong side. Do I expect a drop off? More like injuries. If they tread water offensively, I'd be ecstatic. Overall, what you'll get is what you got this year, maybe a slight overall offensive decrease. Can't beat Father Time.

[ORS]

or unless he signs with another team prior to the arb deadline. This actually happens a good amount of the time. A player signs elsewhere before the arb deadline and makes the decision easy for the team the player is leaving. I dont think that happens here' date=' though, since there are better options and Giambi will have limited suitors (Al team, unafraid of the negative pub from his roid admittance).[/quote']

Why in the world would any team sign him before the arb deadline knowing what is known now? When that happens it's usually for a player who is a) a sure fire bet to receive an arb offer, and a sure fire bet to decline and opt for FA. It very rarely happens for bubble guys. Given his stated desire to return, and the amount of additional risk that places on an arb offer, I think other teams sit tight and make the Yankees blink first.

[Gom]

It's Jacko, ORS. He lives in a world where free agents don't have other options, where the Yankee farm system is filled with future Hall of Famers, and decline over time to a player's skill only happens if you don't wear pinstripes. Let him be.

[riverside sluggers]

Jacko, if Joba is going to stay in the bullpen, why will he just be a set up man to Melancon? A lights out established reliever with his blazing fastball would be racking up saves as they come

[jacksonianmarch]

Jacko' date=' if Joba is going to stay in the bullpen, why will he just be a set up man to Melancon? A lights out established reliever with his blazing fastball would be racking up saves as they come[/quote']

 

agreed. Forgot about Joba for a second there