Papi’s HR trot irks Weaver .

[MANNYHOF24]

Welcome to TALKSOX, where Red Sox players can do no wrong, but every other player on every other team can and does! Come on, what he did was wrong. If you don't know that, you never played the game on anything but your Nintendo.

 

How would you have felt if Arod had admired the bomb he hit off of Papelbon that started our season turn around? Or if Tejada watched his tie breaker against Gagne?

 

So if Ortiz gets drilled today, the Angels pitcher is the anit-Christ right?

 

Tell me how admiring a homerun is any different than when a pitcher does a fist pump after a strikeout. It is absolutely no different. Seriously it was a huge homerun for a struggling hitter. I could care less what Ortiz does when he is going around the bases, I think Jered Weaver should pay more attention to his pitching and less attention to how the other team reacts to certain plays.

[Gom]

Here's what I don't get. The guy who is calling everyone a homer here and is bringing up the quotes of all the ball players' date=' the guy saying this is bush and not playing the right way, that guy, was full bore in support of ARod on the play in Toronto. I have seen and heard quotes from a multitude of current and former ball players and an overwhelming majority of them called that play bush. So, Mr Hypocrite, what say you regarding the unwritten rules? You espouse yourself to them so vehemently, asking the non-believers to drop the joystick and pick up a glove and bat. Why is your supposed supreme knowledge of the way the game is played so at odds on these two issues? Did you press A when you should have pressed C? Gotcha.[/quote']

 

He is trying to win. This kind of stuff is the way the game was played. McGraw used to hook his finger in the belt of baserunners to slow them down. Brushbacks, sliding spikes high, going in hard on a slide....this is part o fthe game. Arod tried to win the game, but you know what happened....the next time, in New York, they hit Arod. You know what? If you say he had it coming, fine...even though I don't agree, I see why they hit Arod. You guys can't complain if Weaver nails Ortiz. Or does the double standard still exist, ORS?

[He Hate Me]

I'm ok with the admiring thing, as long as Ortiz doesn't complain when he gets dusted or catches one in the ribs. I'm not cool with getting hit in the head, I think something intentionally done like that deserves a godo swift beating.

 

Anyway, Ortiz admired his HR, I really don't care for the reason. He's frustrated, he hit a nice one, etc. It's part of the game. If he wants to admire it, go ahead, long as I don't have to hear him or anyone else complain when he gets dusted or catches one in the ribs as part of payback.

[example1]

Another example of someone who never played the game. IT IS PART OF THE GAME. UNDERSTAND THE GAME.

 

All state 3B/P in HS, played one year in college until I realized it was a waste of money to pay to practice instead of study.

 

Strike one.

 

That *******, that Clemens guy, did you think so when he played for the Red Sox? What a f***ing double standard you have. It's ok when your guys do it, but not when its the other team. So Clemens would be an ******* for drilling Ortiz, but it's ok for Ortiz to show up the pitcher? Do either you or this other guy live in a place called reality?

 

What does Clemens being an ******* have to do with him playing for the Red Sox? In fact, when did I say that beaning a guy would be wrong? I said "go ahead and bean him", it IS part of the game. Admiring a 450 ft. shot is also part of the game. Get used to it. The double standard is saying that pitchers have the right to brush guys back but guys can't admire a home run. They admire at their own risk, but I see nothing wrong with it. Perhaps Weaver SHOULD have brushed back Manny, that doesn't make what Papi did "bush league".

 

You know, if he watched it, he deserves to get drilled. I can't really tell from the highlight..I saw him take two steps, and the camera angle shifted.

 

Or he was just watching the same thing that EVERY PERSON IN THE PARK WAS WATCHING. Do you think he looked down at his shoes? Jesus, get off your high horse Gom. A-Rod did the same thing in the VERY FIRST clip I looked at. I bet I could find 20 more where he does, and Delgado does, and Pujols does, and Manny does, and Sheffield and Giambi and Bonds. T

 

The ONLY reason this is an 'issue' is because Weaver stared him down, and the only reason Weaver stared him down was because he has pride and got absolutely smoked. Why did he throw an inside fastball to Ortiz? Everyone pitches him away, he got cocky and got burned for a grand slam that ended up knocking him out of the game.

 

Milestone homeruns, I understand. They're not about showing someone up, they're about that player's accomplishment. You aren't showing up a pitcher when your team is down 7-1 and you hit a career milestone homerun.

 

And you are showing the pitcher up when you start walking/jogging down to 1st after you hit a 4 run home run when down by 3 in the mid-to-late innings of a playoff race game at home against the team with the second best record in baseball? ********. He was admiring a beautiful homerun, not by tossing his bat into the dugout while yelling at the pitcher. It was a majestic homerun, possibly the best HR of the year for a Sox player, on a night when they absolutely needed a win. I don't have a problem with either case, A-Rod or Ortiz--but you have a double standard if an individual can celebrate an individual accomplishment but an individual cannot celebrate a team accomlishment.

[Ray10]

Man really who cares so it's not like he started taunting Weaver or was showboating.

[BSN07]

GOM I DO PLAY THE GAME...

 

I thought I made that clear in my post.

 

Lets get this s*** sorted now, this is not the battle field, this is a childs GAME. So stop acting like this is the most dishonerable thing a player can do. Theres someone on everyones team who at some point who admired a HR, got pumped over a big K or what have you.

 

This is so typical for these types of messages boards, lets take something and completely blow it out of the water and act like it was the biggest dis we have ever seen. oooooo damn no he didn't. He watched a HR for an extra 5 seconds people, this is so not a big deal and we shouldn't even waste our time discussing something so trivial. We should be talking about the nice race for the AL East we have going for the stretch run, but no, we have to talk about someone admiring a grand slam.

 

I remember when AROD hit a HR against the Sox and he was standing at the plate acting like he didn't know where the ball was, he knew damn well he hit it out but he was acting it up, I didn't get mad, it wasn't Bush League, everyone is so quick to call things Bush this yr, it's like the new taboo or something. We might as well go around saying "thats hot".

If anything it adds to the entertainment value. Gom you watch Football? Is it Bush when someone celebrates a TD? Or when someone celebrates a 1st down or a sack? Not its not it entertains the fans.

 

And just incase it didn't sink in the 1st two times( im not trying to pick a fight with you Gom, your a good poster and one of the only Yankee fans I like to read) I do play baseball, I am a Pitcher, and if someone hit a GS off of me and looked at it for an extra 5 seconds I would not care, infact I would make it a point not to leave fat fastballs to that person in the future, I would not put a pitch in the ear of the next guy and put my team at a greater disadvantage. Yes there are times to plunk the opposing team, but not after "I" give up a HR.

[BSN07]

And just to add one more thing on this, if Weaver plunks Manny, its an automatic ejection, Weaver would be gone and LAA has to use the BP for 4 innings. It would have been a very dumb move.

[ORS]

He is trying to win. This kind of stuff is the way the game was played. McGraw used to hook his finger in the belt of baserunners to slow them down. Brushbacks' date=' sliding spikes high, going in hard on a slide....this is part o fthe game. Arod tried to win the game, but you know what happened....the next time, in New York, they hit Arod. You know what? If you say he had it coming, fine...even though I don't agree, I see why they hit Arod. You guys can't complain if Weaver nails Ortiz. Or does the double standard still exist, ORS?[/quote']

What double standard? I haven't supported what Ortiz did here. I know what the unwritten rules are. If he gets dusted, he gets dusted. It wouldn't be the first time. I just find it funny you like to lecture so hard about what is what when it's pretty clear you have one leg on either side of the fence.

[jacksonianmarch]

Here's what I don't get. The guy who is calling everyone a homer here and is bringing up the quotes of all the ball players' date=' the guy saying this is bush and not playing the right way, that guy, was full bore in support of ARod on the play in Toronto. I have seen and heard quotes from a multitude of current and former ball players and an overwhelming majority of them called that play bush. So, Mr Hypocrite, what say you regarding the unwritten rules? You espouse yourself to them so vehemently, asking the non-believers to drop the joystick and pick up a glove and bat. Why is your supposed supreme knowledge of the way the game is played so at odds on these two issues? Did you press A when you should have pressed C? Gotcha.[/quote']

 

I have no issue with someone watching a homer, so long as they are prepared to face the repercussions. I also have no problem with a bush league play if it helps you win, so long as ARod was ready to deal with the repercussions.

[ORS]

And that is consistent, so I take no issue with your stance on what is or isn't bush, Jacko.

[mtbykr]

About as much class as Ortiz did in admiring his homerun, is that what you are trying to say? It's a term..putting one in his ear. I'm sorry you don't understand the game. No one wants to end the career of a player. Plunking him in the ribs is wrong too, a broken rib knocks you out for weeks. Hitting a player in the thigh is the way to do things. Giving him a close shave, knocking off the top button of his shirt....if you played the game, you might have heard these terms. You should have tried swinging a bat once in a while then pressing the B button.

 

If you don't want someone to do that, don't give up the grand slam? You think that's what he was trying to do?

 

I didn't like it when Soriano did it, and the Yankees put an end to it, specifically Torre. I didn't like it when Sosa did it, and I don't like it when Ortiz does it. About the only one I can excuse from that is Bonds with 756.

 

You obviously know NOTHING about the game, because everyone, even the announcers, the fan, Ortiz, etc., knew it was gone. Except for you. Besides being an idiot, you didn't realize one thing. If Ortiz hit the grandslam, and just put his head down and rounded the bases, LIKE HE SHOULD have, none of this would have been an issue.

 

In case anyone wants to see if he was grandstanding, here's the link. Just click on the link for the mlbtv for the Red Sox.

 

http://mlb.mlb.com/mlb/scoreboard/20070818.html

 

You know what gets to me here sometimes? The fact that some of you [thank God not most of you] think your team, FO, etc., can't do any wrong. If Arod had done what he did against Papelbon when he rocked him, you guys would be up in arms. Ortiz does it, and it's ok. I gave it to Cashman for signing Igawa and Pavano. I got it from you guys, and take it.

 

If you can't take it, go watch the Harlem Globetrotters. You know they will win and no one will question your team.

 

 

Here you go again saying I don't understand the game and never played, so let's clear this up. I played, starting when I was young (farm system which was pre-LL) and played until college (LL, HS, ect...) I would have loved to see how far I could go, but didn't get a baseball scholarship and had to pay my way through school working 2 jobs while double majoring. I would have loved to keep playing, but I don't think I was good enough and couldn't be in school if i didn't work. (although it was hard when friends got drafted)

 

I have no problem with someone admiring a HR (we obviously disagree) because if they hit it they deserve it. It's just like when someone makes a great play in a key situation and they celebrate, they can do what they want. If the pitcher feels he got disrespected, fine hit him in the back, butt, legs, ect... and it will work itself out; but don't throw at his head. I'm sure I've gotten pissed in the past when the yanks hit one off the sox and admired it...in the heat of the moment i am pissed, but i have no problem with them doing that. To put this to bed, let's call a spade a spade and admit that the reason Weaver was pissed was not because Papi watched it, it was because he just gave up a grand slam in a key moment of the game that ended up costing his team the win. Getting pissed at Papi was just a way to vent his frustration.

 

 

Now I understand the game, and as much as you want to add in these phrases that you say i don't understand, the problem I have is with what you said initially:

 

Ortiz deserves one in his ear for that

 

Please explain what you mean here because according to you I don't understand the game enough.

 

This is where we disagree; you think it's ok to throw at someones head, and I don't. I would hope that your intention is to throw at his head so he'll get out of the way without injury...but sending a message. I disagree with this as well, because too much can go wrong when you throw at someones head. Maybe one day you'll mature enough to realize that you can send the message you want without endangering someones life, future, and livelihood. You may think it's ok, i don't...I've seen what happens when something goes wrong (both on TV and in person) and it's not worth it.

 

 

 

 

 

Milestone homeruns, I understand. They're not about showing someone up, they're about that player's accomplishment. You aren't showing up a pitcher when your team is down 7-1 and you hit a career milestone homerun.

 

 

This is hilarious. In an interview after the game Papi said that's the hardest ball he had ever hit at fenway and he thought he had a chance to 'beat the seat', ie the farthest ball ever at fenway, passing Williams red seat. So to him it was a chance at history....so i guess now it's ok with you since it had a chance to be a milestone

[shortstop]

Don't the Yankees players make a "curtain call" every single time one of them hits a homerun at home?

[mtbykr]

Don't the Yankees players make a "curtain call" every single time one of them hits a homerun at home?

 

I will admit i don't watch too many yank games....but it does seem like there are a ton of curtain calls at the toilet

[schillingouttheks]

I don't think Ortiz should have stood there as much as he did, but at the same time I think Weaver should just shut his mouth. It's his second year in the league and he should be focusing more on his pitches than on Ortiz's trot around the diamond. If Weaver pegs Ortiz, he'll probably get eaten.

[Gom]

Look, I just like the game played without hotdogging, or showboating. I didn't like Henderson's snatch catch. I didn't buy Arod watching his homerun and thinking it was a pop up. I didn't like players watching their homers, or pitchers with the fist pump after a strikeout. I'm old school in the way I like the game. Nothing wrong with celebrating at the plate like the Sox do when they get a game winner. Nothing wrong with a curtain call at home [even though the Yankees over do it BIG TIME].

 

For the unofficial record, I never condone injuring a player at all. It's one thing to go in hard, another to try to injure the player. These people have careers and families, and that wasn't what I was implying. However, Manny should have been brushed back, that's my opinion. When Krod or Chamberlain fist pump, I would bunt down to first and spike him. That's the way the game, or at least used to, should be played. This is just the way I was taught to play, and how I teach my little league team to play. Act like you've been there before.

 

What do you expect someone to say when they got caught admiring? Arod called it a pop up, Ortiz said he hit it hard, etc. I've seen him hit the ball a lot harder, unfortunately, off of my team's pitchers.

[schillingouttheks]

Did you see how far that ball was hit, Gom?

[Gom]

Yes, it was a nice shot. But I think the one he hit off of Proctor is still in orbit.

[jacksonianmarch]

Don't the Yankees players make a "curtain call" every single time one of them hits a homerun at home?

 

yes, but the curtain calls are more for the fans, not an effort to show up the pitcher. Standing there and watching a homer like that is showing up the pitcher. To be honest, I am surprised Bonds hasnt had his tower buzzed with the way he watches them. You would think that for a guy who has hit so many, he'd not need to admire every one.

[Cityofchampions33]

yes' date=' but the curtain calls are more for the fans, not an effort to show up the pitcher. Standing there and watching a homer like that is showing up the pitcher. To be honest, I am surprised Bonds hasnt had his tower buzzed with the way he watches them. You would think that for a guy who has hit so many, he'd not need to admire every one.[/quote']

 

I seriously doubt he was trying to show up Weaver, they kind of need to know each other a bit better to have anything against each other, meaning it probably wasn't personal towards the Angels or Weaver. When Beckett flipped on Howard for the same thing I thought it was a bit of an overreaction, espeically since Beckett gives the arm pump after a big K. Tejada complained about Lowe supposedly giving the 'suck it' after clinching the 03 ALDS. All of these "show ups" happen during big moments in or after a game, it is never personal, usually its just showing emotion (and how can't you playing in fenway or yankee stadium, etc) and the loser of these big moments always complain. It's been done before, so it's realy not that big of a deal.

[BoSox21]

To be honest' date=' I am surprised Bonds hasnt had his tower buzzed with the way he watches them. You would think that for a guy who has hit so many, he'd not need to admire every one.[/quote']

 

considering the size of his tower, im surprised every high pitch doesn't plunk him

[example1]

yes' date=' but the curtain calls are more for the fans, not an effort to show up the pitcher. Standing there and watching a homer like that is showing up the pitcher. [/quote']

 

So, you think that the majority of the embarassment that Weaver was feeling as he watched that ball sail out of the park was because of what David Ortiz was doing at the moment? Geez, I thought the embarassing thing was giving up the go-ahead grand slam.

 

How the hell do you know that the curtain call doesn't "show up" the pitcher? It is a reminder that the batter got the better of the pitcher, it is WELL after the play and is just one last chance for the crowd to cheer against the pitcher and for the hitter.

 

this argument is getting lame. I figure, if a guy wants to watch a ball sail away then let him. If the pitcher is too proud to let it happen, or if he isn't professional enough to take the heat for giving up the HR, then he should go ahead and plunk the next hitter--thus allowing for the possibility that he will give up further runs.

 

If you REALLY want to show someone up, then shut up and strike out the next hitter. it's not that complicated.

[Khan]

It's how you play the game bosoxnation. It's bush league. Admiring that homerun is bush league' date=' no matter how you cut it. Ortiz deserves one in his ear for that. If you ever played the game, you would understand.[/quote']

 

Just like A-Rod yelling something aas he rounds third.

[MANNYHOF24]

I need to know what someone eles thinks of this subject, is a fist pump by a pitcher after a strike out any different at all then watching your homerun?

[Khan]

or for that matter D-Lowe's "Suck It"

[TheKilo]

You know who admired a home run? Aaron boone.

[rician blast]

I need to know what someone eles thinks of this subject' date=' is a fist pump by a pitcher after a strike out any different at all then watching your homerun?[/quote']

 

And what about the "Jeterian Fistpump?" He's had many an opportunity to use it, and does so, but it gets a bot annoying after a while too.

[example1]

You know who admired a home run? Aaron boone.

 

I wonder where I could see a picture of him doing just that? hmmm...

[schillingouttheks]

I wonder where I could see a picture of him doing just that? hmmm...

 

LOL

 

Seriously. Gom kinda shot himself in the foot there. Cue the "special circumstance" excuse.