Red Sox had talks with Braves about Andruw Jones

[ksushi]

I'm not looking for Theo's head here. IF this offseason goes by without a big signing and notable smaller signings, I'll be upset. I think Loretta can walk, Nixon can walk, but a pitcher a utility player and a reliever need to come in. And when I say a pitcher, I mean a Schmidt or a Zito. I want the Sox to get it done on a big signing. Theo still has some wiggle room with me. Not to talk offseason too early though, I still think the sox have a great chance at being in the post season.

[a700hitter]

I'm not looking for Theo's head here. IF this offseason goes by without a big signing and notable smaller signings, I'll be upset. I think Loretta can walk, Nixon can walk, but a pitcher a utility player and a reliever need to come in. And when I say a pitcher, I mean a Schmidt or a Zito. I want the Sox to get it done on a big signing. Not to talk offseason too early though, I still think the sox have a great chance at being in the post season.

I'm not looking for his head either, but he shouldn't be looking for a pass either. It was a f*** up. It should be acknowledged and he should move on. He stood up and took the blame for BK Kim's contract extension.

[ksushi]

Yeah, the contract extension was a hurting, but I don't think he ever stood up and acknowledge it was a mistake. Yeah, it didn't work out. But saying it was a mistake to sign a 22 or 23 year old ace reliever is crazy. He was nasty before he came unraveled here. Thats like saying you wouldn't trade for K-rod and sign him to an extension.

 

I like what Theo has done overall. There are minor things I don't like. I would have loved to have acquired Hernandez and Perez from the Pirates. I would have given up crisp for the two of them without thinking twice. Move pena into center as a stop gap, bring up murphy. It would have been a gum and glue outfield but who knows it might even work. Those are the little moves I would have made at the deadline, but I'm hoping he can make it up this offseason.

[a700hitter]

Yeah, the contract extension was a hurting, but I don't think he ever stood up and acknowledge it was a mistake. Yeah, it didn't work out. But saying it was a mistake to sign a 22 or 23 year old ace reliever is crazy. He was nasty before he came unraveled here. Thats like saying you wouldn't trade for K-rod and sign him to an extension.

He did publicly acknowledge that it was a mistake. It was an admirable gesture on his part, and I agree that it might not have been completely necesssary.

[ksushi]

I did not know that. Probably a PR move. BK Kim was a disaster but not really a mistake. I would like our FO to trade for young pitchers more often, its just a hard thing to do.

[a700hitter]

I did not know that. Probably a PR move. BK Kim was a disaster but not really a mistake. I would like our FO to trade for young pitchers more often, its just a hard thing to do.

Sometimes an old pitcher like Maddux can help too.

[ksushi]

Maddux would not have OKed a deal to the AL, let alone the AL east.

[a700hitter]

Maddux would not have OKed a deal to the AL, let alone the AL east.

I know. I was using him as an example.

[ahhchon]

Thats ludicrous. Andruw Jones is good and everything but please. Perhaps Coco Crisp and a couple mid-level prospects but certainly not Craig Hansen and Jon Lester.

 

Get real Atlanta

 

....lets talk to Houston and get Roy Oswalt and Lance Berkman for those guys

 

to land oswalt AND berkman you'de probably need crisp, lester and papelbon. you're getting one of the best pitchers and hitters in the league...

 

john

[SchillingIsTheNatural]

to land oswalt AND berkman you'de probably need crisp, lester and papelbon. you're getting one of the best pitchers and hitters in the league...

 

john

 

I wouldn't trade Jonathan Papelbon straight up for Roy Oswalt (age is the issue there). I would trade Lester, Hansen, and Crisp for Berkman and Oswalt. Houston would get much younger and cheaper....everything being mentioned was talked about at the trade deadline. If the Astros were looking to rebuild there team...this might have made sense but they never did that.

[AlexanderTheGreat13]

I would trade Lester, Hansen, and Crisp for Berkman and Oswalt.

You would be lucky to get Oswalt with that trade let alone Oswalt and a top offensive player in Berkman.

[SchillingIsTheNatural]

You would be lucky to get Oswalt with that trade let alone Oswalt and a top offensive player in Berkman.

 

Like I said....if the Astros were looking to get younger and cheaper it was a route they may have considered. Whether they would take it or not, I don't know. The Phillies took a bag of s*** for Lidle and Abreu so you never know what teams are thinking.

[ahhchon]

There are minor things I don't like. I would have loved to have acquired Hernandez and Perez from the Pirates. I would have given up crisp for the two of them without thinking twice.

 

sushi, as much as i love perez he has shown no sign of being anything he was. i have mlb tv and i've seen all his games this season (i have a young pitcher fetish) he had pretty much one game which he was vintage op, that was against the houston lineup. his control has been awful, whip of more than 1.8, opponents are batting almost at a 300 clip against him. he's shown NO signs of improvements. giving up crisps for the both of them would be a bad move considering he's out CF for the future.

 

I wouldn't trade Jonathan Papelbon straight up for Roy Oswalt (age is the issue there). I would trade Lester, Hansen, and Crisp for Berkman and Oswalt. Houston would get much younger and cheaper....everything being mentioned was talked about at the trade deadline. If the Astros were looking to rebuild there team...this might have made sense but they never did that.

 

never did i say i WOULD trade papelbon, i simply stated that is what would need to be done to land those 2 players. btw, oswalt is not OLD, he's 28 and in his PRIME (29 at end of month). at 24 oswalt struck out 208 in 233 innings and had an era of 3.01. papelbon is 26 in november.

 

http://www.baseball-reference.com/o/oswalro01.shtml

 

we DREAM that papelbon can become a roy oswalt. trading him for one is a guaranteed ACE on your staff. papelbon is filthy, don't get me wrong, but we are not certain that he can be an oswalt material starter, we think so. assumptions only make an ass out of you and me.

 

think of it this way, you trade papelbon for oswalt and crisp and lester for berkman.

 

it's a fair trade, it's something we need for this year but not something we want for the future.

 

schilling, oswalt, beckett would be scary in the division series.

youk, berkman, manny, ortiz, willy mo, lowell, crisp, loretta, tek/lopez would be devastating anytime.

that's a: R, S, R, L, R, R, L, R, S (tek) R(lopez)

 

ortiz would be where he belongs (imo) the 4th spot, not the 3rd. the first 5 would be the most devastating five to face in the history of baseball.

 

youk----------damon---- edge sox

berkman-----jeter------- edge sox

manny-------abreu------ edge sox

ortiz----------a-rod------ tie (sox fans are going to kill me)

willy mo-----giambi----- edge yankees

 

so ok, maybe th first 4 would be the most difficult

 

ok, back to earth, sorry for the rant.

 

john

[ahhchon]

The Phillies took a bag of s*** for Lidle and Abreu so you never know what teams are thinking.

 

because both of them combined make 20 million a year. anytime you can get rid of that when you're 12 games back is a good idea (yes, i realize they are only 3 back from the WC). freeing up 20 mill = plenty of money to throw at free agents, they could probably sign smitty AND zito if they throw in a couple more mill.

 

smart move by the phillies. houston would not to do the same, ever, the whole point in paying the rocket a almost 20 mill per season salary was so they could make the playoffs. it wouldn't be smart for them to trade 2 key pieces of success on their team when they are in the chase the way they are.

 

john

[Beckett95]

 

schilling, oswalt, beckett would be scary in the division series.

youk, berkman, manny, ortiz, willy mo, lowell, crisp, loretta, tek/lopez would be devastating anytime.

that's a: R, S, R, L, R, R, L, R, S (tek) R(lopez)

 

 

one problem with that lineup, who would play SS??

 

Anyway. I would be willing to trade anyone for Berkman and Oswalt, just not Papelbon. If we could have made a deal for them both, without including Paps, I would have made it.

 

Willy Mo, Lester, Hansen and (Pedroia, Ellsbury, Bucholz, Delcarmen)

 

youk

loretta

ortiz

manny

berkman

lowell

vtek

gonzo

crisp

 

with a rotation of...

 

Schilling

Oswalt

Beckett

Wake (when healthy)

Wells/Johnson

 

a lineup and rotation like that would EASILY put the Sox ahead of every team in the league.

[SchillingIsTheNatural]

because both of them combined make 20 million a year. anytime you can get rid of that when you're 12 games back is a good idea (yes, i realize they are only 3 back from the WC). freeing up 20 mill = plenty of money to throw at free agents, they could probably sign smitty AND zito if they throw in a couple more mill.

 

smart move by the phillies. houston would not to do the same, ever, the whole point in paying the rocket a almost 20 mill per season salary was so they could make the playoffs. it wouldn't be smart for them to trade 2 key pieces of success on their team when they are in the chase the way they are.

 

john

 

According to cbs.sportsline I saw that Oswalt and Berkman combined to make 25.5 million this season. I can understand how good the two of them are and I can see why they would not make the deal (they didn't explore it which proves that). That money compared to the amount of a Hansen, Lester, and Crisp combination certainly saves. I was also reading that Roy Oswalt may not be interested in returning to Houston after 2007.

 

I'm not exactly sure what we are really talking about. This trade never happened. The rumors I heard after the trade deadline was the Red Sox were going to swing Andruw Jones to Houston in exchange for Roy Oswalt (that makes even less sense for Houston). I would expect the Houston Astros to make major moves after this year since Roger Clemens will be leaving and they have key components walking into contract years.

 

Either way the Astors didn't make any moves and the Red Sox remain reluctant to moves there young pieces. I don't forsee this changing but....its possible.

[ahhchon]

one problem with that lineup, who would play SS??

 

Pffft, with that lineup we won't need a shortstop, we'll find a hot dog and put it out there. fenway franks are awsome afterall.

 

john

[Cityofchampions33]

Yeah, this lineup is one solid power-hitter away from being atop the league

[yankeessuck013]

Anyone think we'll take a run at Andruw this winter?

[jsinger121]

nope

[SchillingIsTheNatural]

Anyone think we'll take a run at Andruw this winter?

 

Yup, the Red Sox will probably talk to the Braves about it. Again the Braves will want too much. It would be fantastic to aquire his services for a year before his contract expires. At that time (2008) Jacoby Ellsbury will be ready for the Majors. Tough to go through 4 CFs in 4 years though.

[jsinger121]

Yup' date=' the Red Sox will probably talk to the Braves about it. Again the Braves will want too much. It would be fantastic to aquire his services for a year before his contract expires. At that time (2008) Jacoby Ellsbury will be ready for the Majors. Tough to go through 4 CFs in 4 years though.[/quote']

 

Why trade a bunch of talent for what could be a 1 year rental?

[Cityofchampions33]

Why trade a bunch of talent for what could be a 1 year rental?

 

I agree, Coco will be better, we dont need tow ate more of our future on a one eyar rental when we alreayd ahve one.

[SchillingIsTheNatural]

Why trade a bunch of talent for what could be a 1 year rental?

 

I never said I would.....I was just saying its a nice idea. I'm not interested in giving up too much for Jones who is hitting 30 pretty soon I believe.

[Ray10]

Yea right he's good but he's not worth that much. If that is what Atlanta wants for him then forget Andruw Jones. Maybe next time around they will expect a little less but I doubt it.