Yankees Spring Training Thread

[Moose]

Not related to Spring Training, but still an 'important' pre-season topic...

 

My Picks for the Ultimate Road Trip:

 

http://www.yesnetwork.com/uploads/roadtrip_finalists/6ED8DE9EEB8C46E7BA84FED62C4183DE.jpg Maria

http://www.yesnetwork.com/uploads/roadtrip_finalists/5781FD1CD36C41DE8E7FCCF9CBE0B466.jpg Michael

http://www.yesnetwork.com/uploads/roadtrip_finalists/02EB4004AA7E4940A3EC3E4FE97F88C1.jpg Kevin

http://www.yesnetwork.com/uploads/roadtrip_finalists/86D4F109919F44AC8BCC50C0A44520DA.jpg Tatiana

 

Sorry for being ignorant here, but what is this about?

[CrespoBlows]

Sorry for being ignorant here, but what is this about?

 

s***** show. s***** actors. s***** Network.

 

YES Network sumed up for you. (The games are OK to watch though.)

[26 to 6]

s***** show. s***** actors. s***** Network.

 

YES Network sumed up for you. (The games are OK to watch though.)

Ranked #1 Regional SPorts Network in the Nation. I wouldnt call that s*****.

 

You live in South Africa. How would you know anyways?

 

Sorry for being ignorant here, but what is this about?

YES' Ultimate Road Trip is a show where they pick 4 Yankee fans and send them to all 162 Yankee games. Its a reality show and they go on missions and do all types of cool stuff. Due to some problems last year with the cast members and their personal lives and whatnot YES is changing the rules a little bit this year. The 4 contestants have to live in a house together and be able to get off of work for the duration of the seaosn. Basically they have to devote themselves to YES and the show to avoid conflict.

 

I like the show, and would LOVE to go on it in a future season.

[CrespoBlows]

Ranked #1 Regional SPorts Network in the Nation. I wouldnt call that s*****.

 

You live in South Africa. How would you know anyways?

 

 

YES' Ultimate Road Trip is a show where they pick 4 Yankee fans and send them to all 162 Yankee games. Its a reality show and they go on missions and do all types of cool stuff. Due to some problems last year with the cast members and their personal lives and whatnot YES is changing the rules a little bit this year. The 4 contestants have to live in a house together and be able to get off of work for the duration of the seaosn. Basically they have to devote themselves to YES and the show to avoid conflict.

 

I like the show, and would LOVE to go on it in a future season.

 

Of course you love the YES Network, you're a Yankee fan. Oh, they have the largest market, hence explaining the popularity.

 

I actually tried to watch the Yankeeography, (how the hell did that win an Oscar, well that Pimp song won one so that explains a lot) lots of tidbits on useless players. Seriously, I know Luis Polonia scored a lot outside of the ballpark, but did he really deserve a show? Other shows on the YES network, Yogi and a Movie. That speaks for itself. It doesn't help that they showed the Bad News Bears go to Japan. The only bad news was the s***** box office turnouts.

 

They also show Mike and the Mad Dog, ON TV! What the hell?! Radio talk shows are for the radio ONLY.

 

Yankees Classics are bit overrated. Other teams show that on other networks. Except they don't gush over them, they simply call them repeats.

 

I hate NESN, other than the Red Sox games, why shouldn't you hate YES?

[ORS]

I dont think that not looking up those guys stats before using them as examples as mediocre pitchers who were traded to a team who was willing to take a risk on them is putting a foot in my mouth.

But, that's just it. When you bring up some examples to support your idea and those examples are wrong, then you are putting your foot in your mouth. Sorry if you don't see it that way, but society accepts the meaning of that phrase to be when you assert something and it turns out wrong.

 

I dont understand why people cant just have general baseball conversation. If i just throw some thoughts out there and just talk baseball without going and looking up all the stats, im being an unintelligent person who just talks out of his ass. I'm not the president delivering a specch regarding a particular topic nor am I a baseball reporter who is writing a column or anything. Im justa guy talking baseball. I look up stats and whatnot when I feel necessary, but I have no problem just posting my opinions and whatnot. Forgive me guys for having different posting philosophies than you, but thats just how I feel. If I felt the need to practically do research before each and every post I would be up 24/7.

You don't just throw ideas out there, though. You throw them out there, someone challenges them, then you defend them, which is what happened here. I'll give you your due when you are right, but I'm going to check to see if you are wrong. That's the way the world works. If you don't like being accused of pulling stuff out of your ass, then maybe you should do some research. Otherwise, get used to it, because without looking it up, that is what you are doing.

[26 to 6]

Of course you love the YES Network, you're a Yankee fan. Oh, they have the largest market, hence explaining the popularity.

 

I actually tried to watch the Yankeeography, (how the hell did that win an Oscar, well that Pimp song won one so that explains a lot) lots of tidbits on useless players. Seriously, I know Luis Polonia scored a lot outside of the ballpark, but did he really deserve a show? Other shows on the YES network, Yogi and a Movie. That speaks for itself. It doesn't help that they showed the Bad News Bears go to Japan. The only bad news was the s***** box office turnouts.

 

They also show Mike and the Mad Dog, ON TV! What the hell?! Radio talk shows are for the radio ONLY.

 

Yankees Classics are bit overrated. Other teams show that on other networks. Except they don't gush over them, they simply call them repeats.

 

I hate NESN, other than the Red Sox games, why shouldn't you hate YES?

You're mistaken. Polonia idnt get a Yankeeography. You might have been watching Tales of Triumph: 2000 World Series.

 

And I agree, Yankeeography isnt meaty enough, its half the athlete-documentary show that SportsCentury is. But i'll still watch it from time to time to see what they have. But it's certainly not my favorite one.

 

 

And I agree with you on Mike and the Mad Dog. However, when im just staying home one day, and just sitting on the couch with nodthing to do its nice to put it on rather than get up and turn the radio on and whatnot. But I could definately live with some more Yankee-orinted programming for those 5 hours.

 

but another thing Mike and the Mad Dog being on YES does is it increases the audience. It provides WFAN with a National audience (kinda. Anybody with DirecTV or access to YES can watch it).

 

But, that's just it. When you bring up some examples to support your idea and those examples are wrong, then you are putting your foot in your mouth. Sorry if you don't see it that way, but society accepts the meaning of that phrase to be when you assert something and it turns out wrong.

I wasnt wrong though. You admitted it yourself. They were having mediocre seasons and were traded to a team that was willing to take a risk on them and hopefullly push them over the top. I dont believe I was wrong.

 

You throw them out there, someone challenges them, then you defend them, which is what happened here.

I wasnt arguing or defending anything here.

[CrespoBlows]

You're mistaken. Polonia idnt get a Yankeeography. You might have been watching Tales of Triumph: 2000 World Series.

 

Actually, that was a joke. I hoped you would pick up on the scoring "outside of" the ballpark.

 

but another thing Mike and the Mad Dog being on YES does is it increases the audience. It provides WFAN with a National audience (kinda. Anybody with DirecTV or access to YES can watch it).

 

Take a wild guess. What radio station ranks ahead of WFAN without televised radio? Would that be WEEI? It turns out the better the quality of the show is, the more viewers it gets. Which speaks facts the quality of Mike and the Mad Dog.

 

Another thing about the YES Network. How despicable is it that EVERY citizen of New York is unfairly taxed so that George Steinbrenner can finance his baseball team. That's what you call extortion, and that's why the YES network still sucks.

[ORS]

I wasnt wrong though. You admitted it yourself. They were having mediocre seasons and were traded to a team that was willing to take a risk on them and hopefullly push them over the top. I dont believe I was wrong.

It is so hard to have an intelligent conversation with someone who contradicts himself so regularly. I admitted they weren't having great seasons, but I never said they were mediocre, that was your description of their performance. More importantly though, you said they would want to trade Mussina if he was "not doing good", ie having a bad year, not a mediocre one. Bad is below average. When I said no contending team would be interested in a bad pitcher, you brought up those examples, none of which were bad. How is this so hard for you to understand? Hell, you even say that those examples don't support your argument.

 

...but I just thought of those names off the top of my head. But yea, I guess you got me with those numbers.

I'm not surprised you don't think you were wrong. You never think you are wrong, even when confronted with evidence to the contrary and, strangely, even when you admit it.

[26 to 6]

Actually, that was a joke. I hoped you would pick up on the scoring "outside of" the ballpark.

lol yea. One thing is for sure. If he's ever doing an autograph signing in the area (which he does from time to time through Steiner Sports), and I attend, I am definately gonna make sure my younger sister is not with me.

 

Take a wild guess. What radio station ranks ahead of WFAN without televised radio? Would that be WEEI? It turns out the better the quality of the show is, the more viewers it gets. Which speaks facts the quality of Mike and the Mad Dog.

I dont know the reasons, and I dont have the numbers in front of me or anything. But (and correct me if i'm wrong) WEEI is really the only good sports station in Boston (I believe they have others up there, but nothing good). In New York, because its such a huge market and there are so many people, we have 2 major sports stations (in addition to several small ones who do sports as well). Just a thought. That might have something to do with it.

 

Another thing about the YES Network. How despicable is it that EVERY citizen of New York is unfairly taxed so that George Steinbrenner can finance his baseball team. That's what you call extortion, and that's why the YES network still sucks.

Unfairly taxed?

[a700hitter]

s***** show. s***** actors. s***** Network.

 

YES Network sumed up for you. (The games are OK to watch though.)

The Road Trip show is just plain boring.

[CrespoBlows]

Unfairly taxed?

 

When the YES network launched its on cable network, it demanded two things. One, an excessive payment per customer to the YES Network, per month. Two, the YES Network is made part of basic cable. So, being part of basic cable means that the YES Network collects from EVERYONE who owns basic cable. That means that a local Mets fan who wants nothing to do with YES still must pay the extra fee per month. Seeing as there is no competion for cable in New York, the Yankees extract a s*** load of money that other markets couldn't dream of doing.

[26 to 6]

It is so hard to have an intelligent conversation with someone 1)who contradicts himself so regularly. I admitted they weren't having great seasons, 2)but I never said they were mediocre, that was your description of their performance. More importantly though,3) you said they would want to trade Mussina if he was "not doing good", ie having a bad year, not a mediocre one. 4)[/iBad is below average. When I said no contending team would be interested in a bad pitcher, you brought up those examples, none of which were bad. How is this so hard for you to understand? Hell, you even say that those examples don't support your argument.

1) I didnt contradict myself at all here.

2) You dont think mediocre describes their performance? I sure do. Even with the stats you provided

3) I didnt say they would WANT to trade him. I said I wouldnt be SURPRISED if he was traded/shoped.

4) You are right. I didnt explain enough here. I hold Mussina, based on his history and experience, to higher standards than other pitchers (same with guys like Clemens, Pettitte, Schilling, Colon, Oswalt, Santana, Johnson, Schmidt, etc). To me Bad for them = Mediocre for others. Others including the guys I listed. My fault here, bad communication.

[ORS]

1) I didnt contradict myself at all here.

2) You dont think mediocre describes their performance? I sure do. Even with the stats you provided

3) I didnt say they would WANT to trade him. I said I wouldnt be SURPRISED if he was traded/shoped.

4) You are right. I didnt explain enough here. I hold Mussina, based on his history and experience, to higher standards than other pitchers (same with guys like Clemens, Pettitte, Schilling, Colon, Oswalt, Santana, Johnson, Schmidt, etc). To me Bad for them = Mediocre for others. Others including the guys I listed. My fault here, bad communication.

Let's test your "Bad for Moose = Mediocre for others" theory. Without looking it up, that is the point of this tangent, did Moose have good, bad, or mediocre years in 2004 and 2005?

[jsinger121]

The Road Trip show is just plain boring.

 

Agreed on that one....My friend Dave was on the show last year and it got boring after a few episodes. Towards the end of the season he just wanted it end.

[26 to 6]

When the YES network launched its on cable network, it demanded two things. One, an excessive payment per customer to the YES Network, per month. Two, the YES Network is made part of basic cable. So, being part of basic cable means that the YES Network collects from EVERYONE who owns basic cable. That means that a local Mets fan who wants nothing to do with YES still must pay the extra fee per month. Seeing as there is no competion for cable in New York, the Yankees extract a s*** load of money that other markets couldn't dream of doing.

You're mistaken. There is competition for cable in NY. Cablevision and Time Warner. In fact, when YES launched, Cablevision wanted to carry YES as a premium network (dont remember all of the details) so that they could profit off of it, because they knew it would be popular. YES refused to allow Cablevision to YES because they didnt want to limit fan access, or make fans have to pay more, and because they didnt want Cablevision to profit off of the Yankees. The people who own Cablevision are also the same people who own MSG, the Knicks, Rangers, FSN NY, and MSG Network. YES was launched after the contract between the Yankees and MSG Network expired. By making YES a premium network, Cablevision would still be profitting off of the Yankees, despite not having a contract with them. The Yanks didnt like that.

 

And I disagree with the unfairly taxed thing. The Discovery Channel is offered in Basic Cable. Some people want nothing to do with the Discovery Channel. Does that mean they're being unfairly taxed? No.

[26 to 6]

Agreed on that one....My friend Dave was on the show last year and it got boring after a few episodes. Towards the end of the season he just wanted it end.

Ahh..I know we discussed this before. But I forget the discussion lol..so i'll just re-state my initial thought to that post:

 

Wow, really? Dave seemed to be the most psyched and energetic person on the show. Seemed like he loved it.

 

Let's test your "Bad for Moose = Mediocre for others" theory. Without looking it up, that is the point of this tangent, did Moose have good, bad, or mediocre years in 2004 and 2005?

I mean, from my point of view, where I hold successful pitchers to a hugher standard, they were bad. But in general, held to regular standards, they really werent that bad. They were decent. I'm sure that there are some teams who were in contention up until about September the last few years, who fell apart in September, who would have loved to have Mussinawith the year he would have been having, just because he was better than some of the guys they already had and he possibly could have carried them over the top.

 

I'm not really sure what you were looking for me to say. Is this kinda what you wanted, mastre?

[ORS]

YES refused to allow Cablevision to YES because they didnt want to limit fan access, or make fans have to pay more, and because they didnt want Cablevision to profit off of the Yankees.

Wow, I alway thought you were naive, but this takes the cake. Do you know how the cable rate system works at all? Here, let me help you.

 

Every channel picked up by a cable provider charges that provider a standard rate to air their programming. These rates get passed on to the customer via the basic service plan, premium service plan, or service plans plus optional programming. By forcing the YES channel into the basic service plan, YES is guaranteeing itself customers since most people want basic cable, but not everyone is a baseball fan. Cablevision wanted to allow their customers to choose. Either way though, the fan is paying. With YES shoved into the basic plan, the customer pays by having their monthly bill go up. I'm not faulting YES for doing this, since they are just trying to increase their revenue stream and were in a position to do it with the Yankees being so popular. But, Cablevision's bottom line would be the same if YES were an option or if YES was part of the basic service.

 

There's a recent example involving ESPN that should make this concept clear. Recently, ESPN was thinking about raising the rate that they charge to providers. However, the providers got together and said they didn't want to raise prices on their customers so they would have to make ESPN only available as an optional upgrade to basic service. ESPN didn't want to risk losing some of their audience, so they backed off and didn't go through with the proposed increase.

[ORS]

I mean, from my point of view, where I hold successful pitchers to a hugher standard, they were bad. But in general, held to regular standards, they really werent that bad. They were decent. I'm sure that there are some teams who were in contention up until about September the last few years, who fell apart in September, who would have loved to have Mussinawith the year he would have been having, just because he was better than some of the guys they already had and he possibly could have carried them over the top.

Fair enough.

 

Now let's compare those years to the three pitchers you said were mediocre. Mussina put up a combined 100 ERA+ those two years (98 in 2004, 101 in 2005), which is exactly league average, or "decent", like you say. Loaiza put up a 101 ERA+ before he was traded to the Yankees, so I'll give you that one. He was mediocre to Mussina's bad. The comparison holds.

 

However, Suppan prior to being traded to the Sox and Ponson prior to being traded to the Giants put up 119 and 115 ERA+ respectively. That doesn't come close to being mediocre, in fact, that is quite good. So, in 2 out of 3 examples, your "Bad for Moose = Mediocre for others" comparison doesn't work. This is why your entire premise, that Mussina would be attractive to other teams if he slips, and I contend that he would need to slip for the Yankees to want to trade him, doesn't really make sense. At least, not at his salary, even if it is for only 1/2 a season. If bad for Mussina is league average, I'm sure there are plenty of cheaper league average pitchers that would be available for teams in need of pitching for a pennant race. And this doesn't even touch on the fact that there will be better pitchers available, assuming Mussina slips, that are entering a contract year who could become available if their current teams' are out of contention.

 

I'm not really sure what you were looking for me to say. Is this kinda what you wanted, mastre?

Nice. At least you acknowledge that I have some OWNAGE on you based on our interaction on this board. Sorry man, but you left that door wide open.

[jsinger121]

Ahh..I know we discussed this before. But I forget the discussion lol..so i'll just re-state my initial thought to that post:

 

Wow, really? Dave seemed to be the most psyched and energetic person on the show. Seemed like he loved it.

 

 

I mean, from my point of view, where I hold successful pitchers to a hugher standard, they were bad. But in general, held to regular standards, they really werent that bad. They were decent. I'm sure that there are some teams who were in contention up until about September the last few years, who fell apart in September, who would have loved to have Mussinawith the year he would have been having, just because he was better than some of the guys they already had and he possibly could have carried them over the top.

 

I'm not really sure what you were looking for me to say. Is this kinda what you wanted, mastre?

 

 

Dave did like it for awhile but the season becomes tiring and basically he told me that the cast just wanted it to end as it became too demanding.

[CrespoBlows]

And I disagree with the unfairly taxed thing. The Discovery Channel is offered in Basic Cable. Some people want nothing to do with the Discovery Channel. Does that mean they're being unfairly taxed? No.

 

How smug and stupid. Not a single service offers the Discovery Channel in basic cable, and besides even if it was the citizens are still being unfairly taxed.

 

If I don't want the Discovery Channel, which by far is a premium service channel, I shouldn't have to pay for it. The YES network unlike your example is put on a basic cable service. That means, an 88 year old couple who doesn't even like baseball have to pay extra rates to get a channel they'll never watch.

 

By the way, the Discovery Channel is offered via the STANDARD SERVICE through Time Warner. That's a difference from the Basic Service.

 

EDIT* Found an article that proves that YES is a basic service channel.

 

http://www.cablevision.com/index.jhtml;jsessionid=0KYM23NPUG3EQCQFSALCFEQ?id=2004_03_24

[26 to 6]

How smug and stupid. Not a single service offers the Discovery Channel in basic cable, and besides even if it was the citizens are still being unfairly taxed.

 

If I don't want the Discovery Channel, which by far is a premium service channel, I shouldn't have to pay for it. The YES network unlike your example is put on a basic cable service. That means, an 88 year old couple who doesn't even like baseball have to pay extra rates to get a channel they'll never watch.

 

By the way, the Discovery Channel is offered via the STANDARD SERVICE through Time Warner. That's a difference from the Basic Service.

 

EDIT* Found an article that proves that YES is a basic service channel.

 

http://www.cablevision.com/index.jhtml;jsessionid=0KYM23NPUG3EQCQFSALCFEQ?id=2004_03_24

A) I did in fact go and check it out before posting that Discovery is a Basic Cable station. Maybe most cable companies dont offer it on Basic, but one does for sure (dont remember which one. I typed in basic cable on google, was brought to a cable company's website, and it said something like "our basic cable package includes ESPN, Discovery, ..............". I wouldnt have posted otherwise)

 

ALso, no need to post the link, nobody was denying that YES was a Basic station.

 

 

However, if you dont like the Discovery example, perhaps John Doe only likes to watch ABC, and NEVER watches Fox. Is he being unfairly taxed because he'll never watch it?

 

Dave did like it for awhile but the season becomes tiring and basically he told me that the cast just wanted it to end as it became too demanding.

Right, Vinny said that it was demanding as well. That's why they've changed the rules and it is required that you are completely devoted to the show and station.

[CrespoBlows]

A) I did in fact go and check it out before posting that Discovery is a Basic Cable station. Maybe most cable companies dont offer it on Basic, but one does for sure (dont remember which one. I typed in basic cable on google, was brought to a cable company's website, and it said something like "our basic cable package includes ESPN, Discovery, ..............". I wouldnt have posted otherwise)

 

You're wrong though, not a single major cable provider carries the Discovery Channel as a basic package. You have to upgrade to get that.

 

 

However, if you dont like the Discovery example, perhaps John Doe only likes to watch ABC, and NEVER watches Fox. Is he being unfairly taxed because he'll never watch it?

 

That's a bad analogy. Fox and ABC are major news networks, and are enjoyed by a wide audience. Fox and ABC on basic cable services are often offered cheaply. When you receive the YES Network, CableVision is forced to up the cost, because the amount that the YES Network charges to be carried.

 

Besides, you don't really think the Yankees are that popular do you? You can't seriously compare Fox to the YES Network, or even the Discovery Channel.

[26 to 6]

Wow, I alway thought you were naive, but this takes the cake. Do you know how the cable rate system works at all? Here, let me help you.

 

Every channel picked up by a cable provider charges that provider a standard rate to air their programming. These rates get passed on to the customer via the basic service plan, premium service plan, or service plans plus optional programming. By forcing the YES channel into the basic service plan, YES is guaranteeing itself customers since most people want basic cable, but not everyone is a baseball fan. Cablevision wanted to allow their customers to choose. Either way though, the fan is paying. With YES shoved into the basic plan, the customer pays by having their monthly bill go up. I'm not faulting YES for doing this, since they are just trying to increase their revenue stream and were in a position to do it with the Yankees being so popular. But, Cablevision's bottom line would be the same if YES were an option or if YES was part of the basic service.

 

There's a recent example involving ESPN that should make this concept clear. Recently, ESPN was thinking about raising the rate that they charge to providers. However, the providers got together and said they didn't want to raise prices on their customers so they would have to make ESPN only available as an optional upgrade to basic service. ESPN didn't want to risk losing some of their audience, so they backed off and didn't go through with the proposed increase.

You're right, I dont know very much about the cable system, nor do I care to. I was posting with what I remember from the incident when it was going on. Most of what I said is pretty accurate. There was big financial conflict, not because Dolan and the other heads at Cablevision wanted to give their subscribers a choice, but because they were trying to profit off of the Yankees. Correct, either way, the fan is going to have to pay, but making it a premium channel would allow Cablevision to keep a larger percentage of the money brought in by YES. And regardless of if it were basic or premium, MANY, MANY, and possibly most people in the area would have subscribed.

 

It has nothing to do with Cablevision trying to be good to their customers, it had to do with the trying to stick YES the year after the Yankees decided to leave MSG. The same thing is going on with the Mets and SNY right now.

 

However, Suppan prior to being traded to the Sox and Ponson prior to being traded to the Giants put up 119 and 115 ERA+ respectively. That doesn't come close to being mediocre, in fact, that is quite good. So, in 2 out of 3 examples, your "Bad for Moose = Mediocre for others" comparison doesn't work. This is why your entire premise, that Mussina would be attractive to other teams if he slips, and I contend that he would need to slip for the Yankees to want to trade him, doesn't really make sense. At least, not at his salary, even if it is for only 1/2 a season. If bad for Mussina is league average, I'm sure there are plenty of cheaper league average pitchers that would be available for teams in need of pitching for a pennant race. And this doesn't even touch on the fact that there will be better pitchers available, assuming Mussina slips, that are entering a contract year who could become available if their current teams' are out of contention.

I notice you edited a bunch out of this post. Last night when I saw it there was more to it. I had written a long reply, but my computer froze before I was able to post it.

[26 to 6]

You're wrong though, not a single major cable provider carries the Discovery Channel as a basic package. You have to upgrade to get that.

 

 

 

 

That's a bad analogy. Fox and ABC are major news networks, and are enjoyed by a wide audience. Fox and ABC on basic cable services are often offered cheaply. When you receive the YES Network, CableVision is forced to up the cost, because the amount that the YES Network charges to be carried.

 

Besides, you don't really think the Yankees are that popular do you? You can't seriously compare Fox to the YES Network, or even the Discovery Channel.

No, it wasnt a major cable service. It was a local one. Local for where? I dont remember. I'll tyr to find it again for you.

 

In New York, I would bet my life that YES is more popular than the Discovery Channel.

[26 to 6]

OK, this thread has gotten really out of hand. If someone wished to move the post to another thread i'll continue the Mussina/YES discussions, but i want to try to get this thread back on topic....so back to Yankee talk.

 

This kid Luis Garcia thats been hitting pretty well the last few days. Who is he? I've never heard of him. Is he in our system, or did we just recently sign him? This isnt the Luis Garcia that was playing for Mexico in the WBC, is it? I mean, I know he wasnt signed with a MLB organization and was in the Mexican league. Did we sign him?

 

This kid has looked pretty good.

[ORS]

There was big financial conflict, not because Dolan and the other heads at Cablevision wanted to give their subscribers a choice, but because they were trying to profit off of the Yankees. Correct, either way, the fan is going to have to pay, but making it a premium channel would allow Cablevision to keep a larger percentage of the money brought in by YES.....It has nothing to do with Cablevision trying to be good to their customers, it had to do with the trying to stick YES the year after the Yankees decided to leave MSG.

Totally incorrect. Cable providers make their money off of providing the service. When someone upgrades for options, they are just paying the subscription fee. For example, cable companies don't profit any more or less off of HBO, Showtime, or Cinemax. The reason those channels are upgrades is because their subscription rate is fairly high and the cable companies wish to keep their basic service price relatively low. They just pass the cost of subscription on to the customer via the upgrade cost. It doesn't affect the bottom line. It doesn't make any business sense to limit profits by making more off of upgrade subscribers only. The real money is in providing the service, not the upgrades. If that is the reason the Yankees gave and you believe it, then they sold you a bill of goods. Of course they are going to publicly claim they are just looking out for the fans, which diverts attention from the fact that they were really just trying to maximize the amount of subscribers they would collect rates from.

 

 

I notice you edited a bunch out of this post. Last night when I saw it there was more to it. I had written a long reply, but my computer froze before I was unable to post it.

Nice try, McGruff. The only thing I changed when I editted it was the last line addressing your "master" comment. The rest of the post is the same. And, it totally proves my point while disproving yours. Avoiding the issue won't change that.

[26 to 6]

Totally incorrect. Cable providers make their money off of providing the service. When someone upgrades for options, they are just paying the subscription fee. For example, cable companies don't profit any more or less off of HBO, Showtime, or Cinemax. The reason those channels are upgrades is because their subscription rate is fairly high and the cable companies wish to keep their basic service price relatively low. They just pass the cost of subscription on to the customer via the upgrade cost. It doesn't affect the bottom line. It doesn't make any business sense to limit profits by making more off of upgrade subscribers only. The real money is in providing the service, not the upgrades. If that is the reason the Yankees gave and you believe it, then they sold you a bill of goods. Of course they are going to publicly claim they are just looking out for the fans, which diverts attention from the fact that they were really just trying to maximize the amount of subscribers they would collect rates from.

 

 

 

Nice try, McGruff. The only thing I changed when I editted it was the last line addressing your "master" comment. The rest of the post is the same. And, it totally proves my point while disproving yours. Avoiding the issue won't change that.

I am pretty sure there was more. I distinctively remember reading something like "you said the Yankees would want to trade Mussina if he slips, and he would have to slip for them to make them want to trade him"..or something like that. I had a big reply written out but was unable to post it. Whatever though.

 

And ok, I stand back on my cablevision arguement.

However, I wish I could find some articles talking about the conflict back in 2002. There was a lot of financial differences involved. However, appearantly that is irrelevent to you guys until I get some more details.

[ORS]

I am pretty sure there was more. I distinctively remember reading something like "you said the Yankees would want to trade Mussina if he slips, and he would have to slip for them to make them want to trade him"..or something like that. I had a big reply written out but was unable to post it. Whatever though.

Do you mean this?

 

This is why your entire premise, that Mussina would be attractive to other teams if he slips, and I contend that he would need to slip for the Yankees to want to trade him, doesn't really make sense.

That is directly from my post.

[CrespoBlows]

OK, this thread has gotten really out of hand. If someone wished to move the post to another thread i'll continue the Mussina/YES discussions, but i want to try to get this thread back on topic....so back to Yankee talk.

 

 

I'll help.

 

Did you read that article in the NY Post, about Matt DelSalvo? It said that the Yankees might break camp with him as the 5th starter. Personally, I'd rather break camp with Aaron Small then this guy.

[AlexanderTheGreat13]

I'd rather break camp with Aaron Small then this guy.

Small will also be starting the season on the DL. Hes not an option.