The official Bellhorn thread

soxie thefangirl · July 4, 2005

It's not that he doesn't want to. He's physically incapable of it. His knees would blow out in like a week. God. I think before speaking and acting like one is the GM, one should know the facts. And the facts are that Mueller can't play 2nd 'cause it would put him on the DL in like a week. And boy do we not need that right now.

stocker323 · July 4, 2005

It's not that he doesn't want to. He's physically incapable of it. His knees would blow out in like a week. God. I think before speaking and acting like one is the GM, one should know the facts. And the facts are that Mueller can't play 2nd 'cause it would put him on the DL in like a week. And boy do we not need that right now.

So you'd bend your knees more at 2nd than 3rd? At 3rd more hot shots go right at you so I would think that you would bend your knees more at 3rd than 2nd. But I'm not recommending Mueller play 2nd, I just think that the reason you give won't apply if they ever asked Mueller to play 2nd.

riverside sluggers · July 4, 2005

mueller is a guy who takes pride in what position he plays, a la third base. mueller's days in boston could unfortuanetly be over, hopefully at least see him as a backup to youkilis next spring.

YanksHater213 · July 4, 2005

Whoa... soxie, calm down... you see, the only thing right now for me thats keeping me from chopping Bellhorns arms off is his quietness. He never talks, he doesnt bitch at the media, and he just plays, and I respect that about him.

Mueller CAN play 2nd. 3rd to 2nd isnt a hard switch, and I can see him doing that, but soxie is right in the sense that hes more liable to be injured. But to be honest with you, at this point I've had enough of Bellhorn, and any change to get him out of the lineup at this point wouldnt bother me, even in if it meant putting Mueller at risk.

Youkilis is a 5000000 times better hitter than Bellhorn, he makes contact and gets on base, and this is what this team needs to have at the bottom of the order. I would much rather take Youkilis getting on base at the bottom of the order over a 50/50 strikeout or a walk.

No, I do not want Boone. He will probably want a lot of money, more than he is worth at this point, and I would much rather have Youkilis and Mueller in the lineup rather than Boone and Mueller.

soxie thefangirl · July 4, 2005

Youk has been striking out a lot lately.

And secondly, I am trying to be calm. I'm just so sick of the negativity he gets. He's not gonna do any better when he's booed and it does affect him but people have zero sympathy. People are so quick to forget the good things he does.

Youk has struck out his last 18 ABs. Just saying.

And glad that some people who rather not see Boone here.

riverside sluggers · July 4, 2005

youkilis struck out his last 18 ABs?? i beg to differ his last 18 at bats dating back to june 6 have been... 5 strikeouts, 4 hits (including 2 doubles and homerun), 3 runs scored, 2 RBIS, and his average is still just below the .300 mark

bellhorn's last 18 ABs dating back to the Guardians 6/28 game... 9 strikeouts, 4 hits (including 1 double and homerun), 3 RBIs, and 2 walks, with his average now at .230

stats are from yahoo sports

YanksHater213 · July 4, 2005

Yeah, Im trying not to be negative, but its so hard when he is striking out in 50% of his at bats.

schillingouttheks · July 4, 2005

Okay, think of it this way. Put the bad of Bellhorn on one side of a scale, and the good on the other. Which side weighs more?

YanksHater213 · July 4, 2005

Bad.

schillingouttheks · July 4, 2005

I rest my case

sarasoxfan · July 5, 2005

Bad.

He has broken up more rallies than tear gas.

he just is a very lousy hitter, who occiasionally hits the ball, but usually just whiffs.

I cant stand him and think he is a liability bordering on foulkian proportions.

soxie thefangirl · July 6, 2005

http://p086.ezboard.com/fsonsofsamhornfrm56.showMessage?topicID=46.topic

Everyone should read the top post there. It all goes back to the Moneyball theory.

Youk Of The Nation · July 6, 2005

Just read it, and it makes ten different kinds of sense. This is one of the basic principles on why we need to keep Bellhorn and other players like him. The K's may be an issue, but when he does come through, he comes through good.

BellhornLove · July 9, 2005

Thank you! I love it

RedSoxRooter · July 9, 2005

niiice.

http://gypsybarboston.com/uploads/images/gypsyredsox.JPG

YanksHater213 · July 9, 2005

Hahhaa, that might be the funniest picture I've seen in a while.

ORS · July 9, 2005

I could live with the strikeouts if they were accompanied by some average production (i.e. .270 BA and 10-15 HR), but to strikeout 32% of your plate appearances while only hitting .224 with 6 HR just ain't cuttin' it. Call up Pedroia in the 2nd half, get him ready for next year.

riverside sluggers · July 9, 2005

i was hearing on fox actually that 46.2% of the at bats bellhorn has had, he has either struck out or walked--besides that the "mathematical equation" that was shown to us proves nothing. it says by him striking out under 200 times last season, sox gained runs by him doin that. oh ok, so i guess we need to cheer him on or something to take whiffs in. :blink:

whereisnomar · July 10, 2005

Yeah, Bellhorn might be pretty good, but Pedroia looks pretty good also, so Tek is right. If he is so good, call him up, use him as back up, and get him ready for next season. Although, hopefully he will produce this year.

riverside sluggers · July 10, 2005

Yeah, Bellhorn might be pretty good

dude take another look at my post cuz i was being 100% sarcastic acting like what he does offensively is good, i for one dont think bellhorn is good. just for his defense at times, and thats about it. cuz that mathematical equation ******** was saying bellhorn striking out was a good thing for the sox, which it isnt. Strikeouts alone this season, hes cost the sox 102 outs in the first 86 games

riverside sluggers · July 10, 2005

from mlb.com on the trading block rumor deals, which would be an upgrade:

2B Orlando Hudson, Blue Jays

Contract status: Signed through '05

July 6 -- The Toronto Sun reported that the Red Sox, Reds and Devil Rays all are interested in Hudson. He is Toronto's best trade chip, mostly because of his glovework and the fact that he hasn't even hit arbitration yet. The second baseman will start to get expensive this offseason, but he's starting to get recognized as the AL's premier defender at his position. The Jays have Russ Adams and Aaron Hill in the fold, so Hudson's likely on borrowed time.

ORS · July 10, 2005

from mlb.com on the trading block rumor deals, which would be an upgrade:

2B Orlando Hudson, Blue Jays
Contract status: Signed through '05
July 6 -- The Toronto Sun reported that the Red Sox, Reds and Devil Rays all are interested in Hudson. He is Toronto's best trade chip, mostly because of his glovework and the fact that he hasn't even hit arbitration yet. The second baseman will start to get expensive this offseason, but he's starting to get recognized as the AL's premier defender at his position. The Jays have Russ Adams and Aaron Hill in the fold, so Hudson's likely on borrowed time.

It's highly unlikely that Toronto would trade to a division foe when they are still in the pennant race. Especially if that division foe is the one they are chasing. Hudson is magnificent in the field though, and would be asset to the team if acquired.

soxie thefangirl · July 10, 2005

Doubtful the Sox would go after him. Makes no sense at this point.

YanksHater213 · July 10, 2005

I would take Bellhorn getting on base as much as he does, even with the strikeouts over Hudsons glove. Hudson has little pop, and I would much rather have a guy who gets on base a lot and is solid on defense rather than a guy who doesnt get on much and is spectacular on defense.

riverside sluggers · July 10, 2005

sorry dude but stats speak for themselves for offense:

Orlando Hudson- .257 avg, 7 HR, 39 RBIs, 39 Runs scored, 4 SBs, 23 walks, 38 strikeouts

Mark Bellhorn- .221 avg, 6 HR, 27 RBIs, 39 Runs scored, 3 SBs, 47 walks, 102 strikeouts with defense plays lacking as of late

soxie thefangirl · July 10, 2005

Wow. He has one more homerun and a couple more RBI's. Have as many walks which means his OBP is not as high. And you know Theo lives for OBP.

YanksHater213 · July 10, 2005

Hudson might be the better player. But I hate to say it, but Bellhorn would be better for the team right now.

riverside sluggers · July 10, 2005

not sure whats behind this lineup, but john olerud yet again will be getting the nod to start 1st base for todays game, as well as sox are giving bellhorn the day off by having alex cora in second base

Tek4pres · July 11, 2005

Love Bellhorn or hate him. You gotta love being a part of a fan base that can generate 418 posts on the number nine hitter in your line up. Hell, that's almost twice Bellhorn's avg.

ORS · July 12, 2005

sorry dude but stats speak for themselves for offense:

Orlando Hudson- .257 avg, 7 HR, 39 RBIs, 39 Runs scored, 4 SBs, 23 walks, 38 strikeouts

Mark Bellhorn- .221 avg, 6 HR, 27 RBIs, 39 Runs scored, 3 SBs, 47 walks, 102 strikeouts with defense plays lacking as of late

You missed a stat that is very important when regarding the frequency of a player striking out. How are the non-strikeout outs made? Hudson has 104 ground-outs to Bellhorns 48. That makes the double-play more likely. Thus far Bellhorn has had 92 AB's with a runner on first and has grounded into 4 DP's, while Hudson has 86 AB's with 6 DP's.

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