moonslav59

To me it would be close.

The guy should never start vs a lefty again at all cost. With Moreland only on a one year deal, why not think about moving Panda to 1B/DH, especially if Hernandez or Devers prove they are deserving a FT job? I know we have Travis for 1B, but what if Devers or Hernandez look much better? We have to find ways to fill departing players' roles within the system.

That's like saying the Yankees are my second favorite team.

They wouldn't have had to win a ring for Ben to save his job... maybe.

I don't disagree, but just imagine if Hanram and Porcello had their 2016 seasons in 2015, and Pablo didn't bloat into a blimp? We might not have won a ring (or even made the WS or playoffs), but Ben might still be here.

Buch Showalter....probably kicks himself thinking about E Rod pitching several years for Sox, a kid he drafted. ERod was drafted two days after Buck was signed to manage the O's. I doubt he had much, if anything, to do with the pick. I'm sure he'd want him back though.

Not bad at all. These forums do tend to bring out more of what we think was done wrongly, but most of us Sox fans, especially the longer term ones, are tickled pink Henry took over this club and brought us 3 rings.

The pen has been great so far, but I still think the pen will prove to be not weak but our weakest link.

Preaching to the choir.

Yes, probably enough.

To me, it's the whole Abad is out of options thing. I still wish we'd have just cut him loose or traded him. Maybe when Thornburg comes back...

True, but when I watched the play, it looked like it might be caught. He probably could have been 2-3 steps off 2nd base and still tagged up, if he caught it.

It was a tough hit to know it was not going to be caught. I'm not sure he deserves much or any blame.

It was nice to see ERod settle down. 66 pitches in his last 4.1 IP was not bad. The last run allowed was unearned. Big hits by Marco & Bogey, too. Finally, some big walks taken helped as well. Nice win!

True enough, especially good young Sox pitchers who seemingly never pan out.

I get your point, but every great pitcher was a promising teenager at some point. Not many pitchers have been ranked so highly at his age. Yes, that still makes his value highly speculative, but there's a reason he is ranked so highly. Experts think he has such a high ceiling that the risk-reward is not a hindrance enough to drop him in their rankings. He may turn out to be a dud. The risk of that is certainly high enough to see why getting 2.5 seasons and 3 playoff cycles from a possible #2-3 type starter was worth it. The idea is logical. I guess I still have a gambling instinct in my soul. Espi's ceiling is just too tantalizing for me to want to part with for anything short of a guy like Sale or Quintana (not that I think we could have gotten either in a straight up deal).

You just can't say no to an opportunity like this.

Price....There was simply not much available as far as top of the line pitching was concerned. Again, it was something DD had to do. Did we overpay? Perhaps but not knowing what the going price was DD was not going to take any chances and get beaten out by another offer. It's unfortunate $31M per year sticks out like a sore thumb but it is what it is. No chance we win the division without him last year. Can we have it done cheaper? Perhaps but it's all Monday am quarterbacking to me. There was other top starters avaiable, like Cueto, but although I felt like we grossly overpaid to get him, he was the best we could hope for at that time of great starter need. Kimbrel....this one hurts but it was our inability to have a healthy closer at the time that forced DD to make this move. Not only did it take Kimbrel, but we also had to trade for Ziegler and convert Kelly in a relief role to accomplish what we did. With emergence of some arms in the pen, it's pretty certain we will not resign him after 2018. As Moon said, was it worth paying FA price AND prospects for his 3 years of service? I'd say yes only if we win the world series. BUT again, this was a move DD thought he had to make in order for us to become a contender for 2016. He was right, even though we may have overpaid. I totally understand why the move was made, but that's not enough for me to agree with it. I don't "blame" DD for making the move, because I try to avoid the blame game as much as possible, but I guess some could argue over the semantics of my position. While there were no other top closers available at that time, getting a top closer was not an essential priority, in my opinion. We could have obtained two or three good closers for the same money but with less prospects given up. Those prospects could have been saved or used as part of a bigger package to land us someone better than Pomeranz- see below. Again, I viewed Kimbrel as a top 3 closer and expected top 5 closer from him for all 3 years. The fact that he has slipped from top 5 status makes the trade look worse in hindsight besides the fact that good RP'ers market value has sky-rocketed since the trade. I'm hopeful he can regain his earlier form. Pomeranz....again, inconsistencies from Kelly, E Rod and Clay B forced this trade. I still think it was the correct move. The possibility exists for Espinoza to become a stud pitcher and Pomeranz to be mediocre pitcher for 2 1/2 years of service. Did we overpay? Probably. But DD was not going to sit idle and watch the team implode. As it turned out, Pom did not help the Sox but again that's after the fact. While true, some of us disliked the deal when it was made, so it is not "hindsight" in my case anyways. I do think we needed a starter, but maybe a 2 month rental would have been enough.Maybe we could have tried to go larger and trade for Sale or Quintana last summer, but who knows if the CWS were open to the idea back then. I think we may have gotten Sale & Quintana for probably less than Moncada, Espi, Kopech, Margot, Allen, Guerra, Asuaje, Basabe and V Diaz. Now, that's hindsight and speculative hindsight at that!

I like to praise or critique trades/signings at the time of the transaction. It's always easy to look back and support your decision based on what transpires afterwards. Clay B.....even if Clay was healthy and pitching well for the Phillies, I still would think the decision to trade him was the right one. 100%!

To me, it was more than just resetting the tax. It meant we can wait until mid season and spend the savings on a better pitcher or two better pitchers or a positional player that covers a currently unforeseen need. Flexibility.

MLBTR... Buchholz has been diagnosed with a partial tear of the flexor pronator mass in his pitching arm, per a club announcement. He is headed to visit Dr. James Andrews for a second opinion. As things stand, it’s not clear what treatment will be undertaken for the injury. That’ll be sorted out after the trip to Dr. Andrews’s office — which is never where a pitcher hopes to find himself. Clearly, though, Buchholz is headed for a layoff of some duration. Surgery isn’t always required in cases of strains (slight tears) or partial tears, but in such cases a fairly lengthy rest-and-rehab protocol is typically followed.

Agreed, but it is what it is. As much as both of us would like to go back and undo a trade or two (maybe three for you), we can't. I hate to have to rely on multiple hopes and prayers for our long term outlook to improve, but I fear that's all we can do now. We really are going to need Travis and Devers to be ready by the time we lose Moreland (2018), HanRam & Pablo (2020). Maybe a Dalbec or Hernandez can take a role, if Travis or Devers fail, but filling these 4 slots from within the system would go a long way towards freeing up salary space to keep our rising young stars, pay their arb raises, extend one or two of them AND maybe be able to keep Chris Sale. That's a lot to hope for from Travis, Devers, Hernandez & Dalbec, but it's not an absurd hope. What worries me is that we could have all those hopes come through, and we'll still have to let Bogey or Porcello go and maybe even one from Betts, JBJ or Sale go as well. Maybe not. Maybe we can stay below the $20M excess of luxury limit point where severe penalties kick-in, but it will not be easy. Hoping Groome can first replace Pom and then replace Porcello's slot is too much for me to realistically think is possible. If he can do it, it's likely Devers or Travis will not, and finding great corner IF'ers via free agency is usually very costly.

The lack of a true "long man" was apparent last night. Once Price comes back, and Pom or Wright go to the pen, that problem will be solved. Taylor did a great job giving us over 3 innings of good pitching. I hope he keeps producing like this.

It's +$20M to avoid penalties such as taking away draft picks or lessening amounts for draft signing pools. Resetting the luxury tax will be a big deal, because it will lessen future tax percentages when we likely will have to go over possibly starting as soon as 2018. The actual luxury tax still significantly increases each consecutive year a team goes over the limit.

In foresight too. DD knew we could always at least trade scraps for a salary dump pitcher mid season and do as good as Buch projected to do. If we can wait until July 31st, we only pay 1/3 of a pitcher's yearly salary, so Buch's $13.5M is really like a third of two pitchers making $20M each!!! Or 3 pitchers making $13.5M each. It's hard to imagine us doing worse than even a healthy Buch would have done.