moonslav59

I'm not sure how several players have better season numbers but never had a better month. Impossible.

Many of our top pitching prospects have really cut down on the BBs. Has the focus changed in our minors? Our top pitching prospects by rank (OPS Against, K:BB & IP'd) 4. Bello .514, 52:13 in 40 IP 6. Walter .592, 60:3 in 43 7. Mata (N/A) 9. Gonzalez .679, 37:17 in 29 10. Groome .675, 29:12 in 31 (before today) 11. Murphy .501, 51:17 in 42 12. Winckowski .499, 34:6 in 32 13. Seabold .498, 37:10 in 37 None have regressed, and just about all have improved their standing, IMO.

We also risk getting nothing but a comp pick for Bogey and some salary to try and replace him with. With Betts, we traded 1 year, that turned out to be 60 games, for Verdugo, some questionable prospects and some salary relief that lasted until the end of this year with Price. It's hard to compare the two, and I kinda felt Betts was a big part of the clubhouse attitude, too.

How can those numbers be the "hottest" in the system?

Yes, but Red's point is to let him go only 1 IP as a traditional closer.

I'm not sure why he has waited this long, but there seems to be no indication he's even thinking about naming either the closer. I thought when Wacha returned, he had a good chance, and he can start letting Wacha and Hill go longer in games, so no need for that piggy-back crap. To me, Whitlock is a natural for long relief. and that translates better to starter than Closer, but he could very well be a great closer, if given the chance. I wouldn't mess with him. Houck seems like a more natural closer, and has done very well in his first inning or two over the vast majority of his games pitched. He has a .311 OPS Against in his first 25 pitches of a game. 2022 1st PA as starter .584/ as RP'er .568 2nd PA as starter .774/ as RP'er .606 Career 1st PA SP .504/ 1st PA as RP'er .554 2nd PA SP .647/ 2nd PA as RP'er .503 3rd PA SP 1.017 .369 Pitches 1-25 (like a closer usually gets, especially with that OPSA) .685 Pitches 26-50 .756 51-75 .767 76-100 Whitlock .637 pitches 1-25 (not bad but double Houck's) .487 pitches 26-50 (Yup, better as a longer man) 1.037 51-75 (but not too long) 1.267 76-100 As a RP'er: .627 first time through a line-up BUT .229 the second time through! WOW!

Exactly. How are you so sure that role is for him? I see two times, last year, and we lost both games with him allowing run(s) to score. 9/6/21 We're up 9-8, Whitlock comes in and allows a HR to the first batter. Later, in the 10th, he loses the games by allowing 2 singles. 9/12/21 We're tied 1-1, Whitlock comes in and allows a solo walk-off HR to Leury Garcia with 2 outs. (A crucial loss in a tight playoff race) His short career has shown he does better in long relief than short.

"Beni has Boggs type numbers," and you say he got it right? LOL, what a joke... I mean Mr. Joke.

If you look at 2021, month by month, it seems that Whitlock did about the same as a long man or as a short man, but his worst 2 months were the ones he averages the shortest IP per game. His best 3 were his longest 3. IP/per appearance and ERA 2.1 0.00 April 1.6 4.09 May 1.6 0.66 June 2.5 0.75 July 1.6 2.77 August 1.3 4.35 Sept 2021 games where he came in the 8th or 9th: IP H ER BB K 2.0 1 0 0 2 2.0 2 0 1 3 1.0 1 0 0 0 (8th) 1.0 0 0 0 3 (8th in a loss) 2.2 1 1 0 4 (9th to 11th- let up a run but got win) 1.0 1 0 0 2 (9th not a save situation) 1.1 3 3 0 2 (9-10th blown save vs TBR) 2.0 1 0 0 1 0.2 1 1 1 0 (Got the loss- came in 1-1 game) He doesn't have a long history as a 1 inning closer.

You have to count the losses we'd have when Whitlock pitched well in long relief or as a starter. Subtract those from the projected wins we'd have with him closing, assuming he did very well in the closer role. I'm not doubting we'd have been better, but we can never know. It's a trade off. The fact that we lost many games where Whitlock pitched well in long relief or as a starter does not take away from the fact that he helped put us in a position to win, and a weak closer lost those games. Flip the roles, and maybe Whitlock never gets that many save opportunities, because the new long man is coughing up dingers, left and right, and we're down 6 by the 8th and 9th innings. We are 6-4 in games Whitlock has pitchers, and in all but 1 of those wins, he pitched very well. (That was his last start.) In the 4 losses he pitched in, he blew one save and started 3 games, where he allowed 3 ERs, total! It's hard for me to look at those 3 starts and say that because he we didn't win, he was misused. We've had this running debate for a while, but IMO, Houck's profile fits the closer role better than starter/long relief, and Whitlock's fits the starter/long relief role better than Houck. Better than closer? Who really knows? He's dove very well as a starter and long man. Yes, this year, his numbers in relief are much better than as a starter, but most of those numbers were not as a traditional closer (1 IP, maybe a little more every now and then).

And his OBP is 65 points higher than Beni's- more if you compare it to Beni's numbers after the trade. Just saying both of their names in the same sentence is Pink Hat extraordinaire/ Beni apologist territory.

It's you making the strawman argument. Where did I say or even hint Bloom is not accountable? Of course Henry's head will not roll. I was making a point about not signing Devers being more of Henry's call than Bloom's. If henry gives Bloom $110M, next winter, and he chooses to sign let-down free agents instead of extending Devers, then of course, it's all on Bloom, but he was just barely been given his first freedom to sign a longer term guy a couple months ago (Story.) Can we give the guy a chance? It's not like Bloom's moves have burdened the budget. It's not like the totality of Bloom's moves have been s*****. He brought a team crippled with debt and a sad bottom 20 on the 40 man roster and $40M to fix it. Only Story's contract continues past 2022, unless you want to count Diekman's $4M for 2023, then he's done. This next winter is Bloom's make or break period. The Story signing will be part of his evaluation after 2023. If we suck by then, I won't be defending Bloom. No, you can't fire the owner, but fans can blame him or Bloom for losing Devers, and I'm sure they both will get roasted, if we lose him.

Sounds like the Sox excuses when our starters were doing great. but we were still losing.

Nobody said he was a great runner. We compared him to the even slower runners on this team you thought would have been better. You also changed the subject on Vaz being the last catcher available. Just admit you were an idiot on that one, and stop moving the goalposts.

.288 and a .779 OPS since the trade- hardly Boggsish.

You'd rather we kept Workman and Hembree, instead of getting Pivetta and Seabold? BTW, you do know, with the money saved on the Beni trade, we signed Renfroe to play OF, right?

Yes, we should have kept Nomar, Ellsbury and Workman.

We also avoided paying Betts $40m X 10+ and half of Price's contract for several years. That money saved helped us sign Renfroe, Kike, Wacha, Hill and Starhm plus many more to come. It was not just about one year of Betts for a "grab bag."

If we lose Devers it will be with henry's blessing. Should his head roll, too? Bloom did not extend Sale. He did sign Story and extend Barnes, but I doubt those contracts are keeping us from extending Devers to a market rate contract.

I did not say by May 24th. Look at the May 6th numbers, as in "early May." I never said he might heat up on the exact same dates. BTW, he's at a whopping .613 in his last 9 games! Signs of starting to heat up? Who knows?

I'm not predicting a Dalbec heat-up, but he looked just as awful last April and early May. On May 6th, 2021: 1 HR 6 rbi and .507 OPS May 26, 2021: 5 HR 21 rbi .640 OPS On May 4, 2022: 1 HR 3 rbi and .441 OPS May 24, 2022: 1 HR 6 rbi and .486 OPS

You never know. If Dalbec heats up, like he did last summer, and our OF'er continue to all hit under .600, maybe we'll see him in LF more and more, especially vs LHPs.

One of the very few.

It's easier to ignore his defense in LF.

You knew a bad stretch was bound to happen, at some point. Now, how long will it last?