moonslav59

I have to think we could have traded for some overpaid pitcher and gave up nothing very important. Just making the effort might have appeased fans to some extent, and who know, maybe it even would have helped the team.

Here is a look at some of the bigger trades made, recently and how BTV valued them vs what might the Sox have had to give up to match the value actually given up. (There is no way of knowing the other team would have accepted the deals I am describing, and I would not have been for many of them, but here are a few ideas. Do any look like deals you might have supported? 21.2 for Civale for 26.2 Houck 24.0 Anthony 22.0 Yorke & Hickey or Brannon 20.1 Crawford 21.8 Rafaela & Romero 22.7 Rafaela, Paulino & Walter 20.9 for Verlander & $35M for 20.1 Crawford 21.8 Rafaela & Romero 22.7 Rafaela, Paulino & Walter 20.1 for Scherzer & $35M for 20.1 Crawford 21.8 Rafaela & Romero 22.5 Rafaela, Paulino & Drohan or Perales 4.6 for Flaherty 7.2 for Montgomery & Stratton for 8.7 Romero 8.0 Walter & Perales or Drohan 7.0 Paulino & Hickey

If he almost always agrees with what the people around him suggest, and I'm not saying he does that, then in a sense, he is not the major decision-maker, despite possibly having "the last word," so to speak. I think we all agree on the biggest money decisions, JH and others have the final say.

I feel the same way. At least spending that $10M or so would give fans the impression the plan involved being as competitive as possible within the confines of a reset. NOPE! Quick question: are fans more pissed after this deadline than the last one? (I'm kinda thinking no.)

He's cut and reset, before and followed it up with increased spending and occasional splurges. I'm thinking this is the pattern. The spending has already seen an uptick, and the Devers extension kicks in, next year. I'm thinking JH will spend heavily, when he thinks the moment is right.

Fixed it for you.

Putting " Beergate" to shame.

You have always been so optimistic!

Just in time for the Astros series!

Let's hope hometown cooking changes that!

Would DD have wanted to stick around, if JH told him he not only had to trade Betts and half-Price, but cut even more from the budget going into 2020, and then take 3 years to get back to similar spending? I think he'd have quit, under the directives Bloom was given. If your argument is that had DD been "given more time," meaning he could have spent more than Bloom was given, and been allowed to go ahead and trade Casas, Duran, Bello and others, then one might argue Bloom's record would have been better under those same terms.

It's not exactly the same situation, but Ben hardly traded any prospects- like Bloom. Ben was given a bigger budget earlier on than Bloom was, but Bloom has spent a lot, recently, especially if you count the Devers extension. I think JH wanted to build a sustainable winning team under Ben, and figured he'd have to spend here and there to plug a few holes, but the losing made him switch gears and shift to the opposite plan by hiring DD, who was given the ability to trade over 20 prospects that were, at one time or another, top 20 prospects on SPs. Compare the top prospects trade by DD vs Ben & Bloom. It's obvious big changes in direction and directives were made.

German is out on alcohol rehab.

I think JH started the current plan with Ben, but gave up after the 3 last place finishes were just too much to handle. The fans and media were irate. He then switched gears from 1st to 5th, almost overnight. Maybe, this time he lets the plan run its course,

IMO, much of Bloom's biggest choices had to do with building for long term success. I think that came from the top. I think seeing Bello, Casas, Duran, Wink and a few other make an impact on the current team has only solidified the strategy they chose during the 2019 season. Like it or not, it seems clear all the talk of trying to stay competitive every year was mostly just talk. It may have been a low priority, but clearly not a top one. Bloom drafted mostly HS players, the first few years. The loss of a year of development in 2020, slowed the maturation process, a bit. It's really impossible to know just how good all these new players and prospects will be. Bloom's final grade will not be know for many years. The farm looks solid, on paper, with some weak areas, but in theory, it is much better than 2019's farm. Almost every major trade Bloom made involved bringing a prospect or young controllable player to the Sox. The Aldo ramirez for Schwarber represented one of the very rare prospect for Vet trade he has made. Certainly, mistakes have been made- more than anyone of us wanted, but again, when you have so many holes to fill and limited funds, you end up signing guys for $3M to $10M, and you basically get what you pay for. Add to that, most of those low range deals were one year and done deals. What do you expect for a success rate for a $10M/1 SP'er? 50%? Well, Bloom went oh for 2, but in theory, one was supposed to fail, so he really missed by 50% not 100%. He did better on his $4-9M deals and had some great hits on even lesser ones, like Renfroe, Refsnyder, Schreiber, Whitlock, Bernardino and others. It looks like Bloom will be here for 2024 and probably beyond. I thought this would be his "make or break" year, but I think JH sees it differently, and I can't say he's wrong for wanting long term success strategies put in place.

Because DD the Almighty liked the guy- twice! That must have value.

He's owed $43M, but HOU is not paying all that. The Mets are paying a combined $35MM of Verlander’s 2023-24 salary. They’d pay half of his $35MM salary in 2025 if his option vests. In all, they’re paying as much as $52.5MM of the nearly $93MM that could still be paid out on his deal, pending that option. -MLBTR That being said, I would not have traded Rafaela and Romero- about the BTV equivalent of what HOU gave up to pay him the difference. There were some trades, I think I might have matched in equal prospect value, but I think Bloom & Co. chose to ride the horses that got us here, and hope the returning horses give us the boost we need. It's clear that the extended future is a much higher priority than the here and now. Maybe, this time, JH will let it play out to its end (unlike replacing Ben with DD.)

Indeed. There are 30 teams in MLB. Even if you discount the 10 or so that are making no try at winning a ring, that leaves 20 all trying hrad for a ring. If we don't win, the GM sucks.

I thought the return of Judge might spark a fire, but the team is totally lethargic.

Sale's FB was 95, last night in his rehab. I know it seems like we've struggled for years, while singing the "Wait for Sale to comeback" song,but after struggling over his first 3 starts, this year, he was clearly near top form and the best pitcher on the team. From 4/13 to June 1: 8 starts/ 47 IP (just shy of 6 IP per GS) 2.87 ERA 2.72 FIP .633 OPS Against 7 of 8 starts with 3 or less ERs allowed 6 of 8 with 2 or less 5 of 8 with just 1 ER allowed I know, I know, "fool me once- fool me twice...," but I'm optimistic he will help, bigly. With a rotation of Bello, Paxton, Sale, Crawford and Pivetta, we can use the returning Houck and Whitlock from the pen, where they belong. I keep hearing people say, "But they both have ERAs over 5!" While this is true, so is this about THIS YEAR'S NUMBERS: OPS Against in 2023 Houck .504 1st PA in game .534 1st 25 PAs in game .596 PAs 26-50. Whitlock 4.85 last 5 GS with a 4.04 FIP Not great but better than before. I have to think these two are better than jacques and Llovera.

I think they are thrilled he didn’t sell. Lol. We have a very good chance to make the playoffs. Let’s talk again in 2 weeks.

True, but I think people might be surprised at how long some of his goos stretches are. The problem is, when he is bad, he is really bad.

It looks like TOR and either TEX or HOU are our best bets to pass in the next 2 months. The AL 66-41 BAL (up 1.5 on TBR but 3 in the loss column) 61-46 TEX (up 0.5 on HOU) 55-53 MIN (up 2.0 on CLE, but neither are a real WC threat) WC 66-44 TBR +7.5 on BOS 61-47 HOU +3.5 on BOS 59-49 TOR +1.5 on BOS 57-50 BOS -1.5 56-52 LAA -3.0 55-52 NYY -3.5 (2 down on BOS) 55-52 SEA -3.5 Next 12-13 games after tomorrow's series finale: BOS: (1 more @ SEA), 3 v TOR, 4 v KCR, 3 v DET, 3 @WSH (after SEA, we play 10 of 13 at home.) TOR: (2 more v BAL), 3 @BOS, 4 @CLE, 3 v CHC, 2 v PHI 7 Home-5 Away after the BAL series. TEX: (2 more w CHW), 3 v MIA, 3 @OAK, 3 @SFG, 3 v LAA 6 H/ 6A HOU: (1 more v CLE), 3 @NYY, 3 @BAL, 3 v LAA, 3 @MIA 3 H/ 9 A vs all winning record teams These next 2 weeks gives us a chance to gain some ground, as those in front of us will be knocking each other off. We cannot afford to slouch vs lesser opponents, anymore. We need to win 2 or 3 games in every series.

Although TEX got Scherzer, I'm thinking HOU wins the division, and we have to pass TOR or TEX with TBR and BAL as much longer shots at falling sharply.

I was thinking of starting a Part III thread, as I have done in the past, right after the trade deadline, but this one was so uneventful, for the Red Sox perspective, that I won't do it, this year. We may see some major changes to the 26 man roster in the next few weeks, as Urias joins the team, Schreiber and McgUire start playing more, and players start coming off the IL. A 100% healthy team would create some difficult decisions to be made, but that's not a bad thing, and besides, has that ever happened in Sox history? It looks like Story may join the club in a week or so. Arroyo, Reyes and Chang are out of options, but apparently Urias has one remaining. Sale should be the first SP'er to come back- maybe in 10-15 days. Jacques can be demoted or Llovera DFA'd to make room on the 26 or 40, as he is on the 60 day IL. (Ort is on the 60 day, too, so DFA'ing him does not free up a 40 man roster slot. Houck and Whitlock's ETAs are a bit murky. Some say September, but apparently they are throwing pen sessions and may start rehabbing at any moment, and could possibly join the big club in 15-25 days, or so. Joely's return might cause a squeeze, as he has no options (DFA Bleier?) Kluber could easily be DFA'd once he comes off the IL. Is this the best 26 man roster? 13 Pitchers: SP: Bello, Paxton, Sale, Crawford, Paxton LR: Whitlock, Houck SR: Jansen, Martin, Schreiber, Winckowski, Bernardino, Joely (DFA'd due to out of options: Kluber, Bleier, Llovera) 13 Everyday Player(DFA due to out of options: Reyes) C: Wong, McGuire 1B: Casas 2B: Arroyo (0 options) SS: Story, Chang (0 options) 3B: Devers LF: Yoshida, Refsnyder CF: Duran, Duvall RF: Dugo DH: Turner The rest of the 40 (players with options): P: Murphy, Walter, Robertson, Mata (to 60 day IL?), Jacques (DFA?), Garza (DFA?) C: none 1B: Dalbec 2B: EValdez (to 60 day IL?) SS: DHam 3B: Urias (SS/2B) (to 26 and DFA or phantom IL Chang until Sept call-ups?) OF: Abreu, Rafaela That's only 12 players. Do we demote Bernardino, so we can keep Bleier? (that makes 13 in the minors) If we can get healthy or even just 24-25 top men healthy, we can be a force. This could be our line-up: 1. Duran CF/LF 2. Yoshida LF/DH 3. Turner DH/2B/1B 4. Devers 3B 5. Casas 1B 6. Story SS 7. Dugo RF/Duvall RF or CF/Refsnyder LF 8. Wong/McGuire C 9. Arroyo/Reyes/Chang/Urias 2B