Maxbialystock

Pom is a lefty who has no changeup and over relies on a weak ass fast ball. He has a good knuckle curve, but can't keep it low. He does not believe in covering first bast on grounders to the right side even though he sometimes does it. He is easily the worst pitcher I have ever seen with an ERA of 3.15 this late in the season.

Did I forget to mention that normally, usually Pom is not good at keeping the ball low, which has been very much in evidence tonight.

moonslav likes to comment on weak fundamentals but has never to my knowledge gone after Pom, who to me represents the polar opposite of Sale, who is professional in every way. I can never forgive a pitcher who can't be bothered to cover first base on grounders to the right. I am continually astonished he has been pitching this long and doesn't have a usable changeup unlike very other starting lefty in MLB. I give him credit in some games for having decent command of two pitches he does have, but would comment that even then he needs a lot pitches to get thru an inning.

ABsolutely right.

Tonight Pom is revealing his unprofessional side. First and foremost, he made absolutely no effort on that ball to the right side that was in fact a grounder. Second, he has no changeup even though he is a lefty sure to face 75% righty batters. Third, he can't spot his knuckle curve very well, which means batters can sit on the slow motion fast ball of his. He has to be the worst starter I've ever seen with a 3.15 ERA this late in the season. And he right now is our #2 starter in the playoffs. Lots of luck with that.

POm was lucky to give up just the 1 run because all he threw for strikes was that weak ass fastball.

wrong thread.

Gotta like Pom as the starter, especially with this lineup against a lefty starter-- 1 Bogie SS 2 Nunez DH !!!!!!! 3 Betts RF 4 Ramirez 1B 5 Vazquez C 6 Devers 3B 7 Young LF 8 Marrero 2B 9 JBJ CF

Dorothy yearned to return to Kansas. I lived their (eastern side, close to KC) 3 times. Nice state. Beginning of the Sante Fe Trail. Geometric center of the USA (not including Hawaii or Alaska). Lots of wheat. Not sure I see it as baseball country. The Kansas City Chiefs and Royals, FWIW, are both based in Kansas City, MO.

You are never unfriendly. I just like illinoisredsox's perspective and the notion that,once that throw went amuck, the normal procedure for rundowns between 1b and 2b just might have left home plate uncovered. I just don't know. Try this on for size-- Pedroia was running toward 1b and maybe should have been the guy covering home. He was the mostly experienced and probably the headiest player on the field. But he never made a move after the bad throw. Workman was the guy trying to catch the ball and was no doubt thinking about retrieving it. He made no other move. Plus he's a pitcher and not the best guy to race home. Vazquez hustled to back up 1b which it turned out was a good idea. He may have been the one who actually retrieved the ball. In the final shot he was running toward home plate, as were Bogie and Devers. Moreland was somewhere near 2b. Covering home was not his responsibility I think. Devers had to cover 3b, but still tried to race Hamilton home. Bogie was also near 2b but he was supposed to be the guy Workman threw to if the rundown continued. But he also saw the bad throw and probably should have been the guy going home, which he did but belatedly. I would suggest that he has not had to react that way very often in his young professional career and maybe never--running from 2b to home to cover home plate. Remember, when the bad throw was made, Hamilton was actually headed back to 1b, then quickly reversed. All in all, I would say the worst mental mistake had to be made by Pedroia. He saw the bad throw and was in the best position to cover home plate because he could see the catcher retrieving the ball. But he didn't, maybe because it was not part of the normal routine of a rundown between 1b and 2b.

Well put. The problem was execution on the rundown, which led to an errant throw by Pedey of all people. Thereafter, as you point out, guys needed to figure out where to go or be because it wasn't part of the rundown playbook. Funny no one mentions that the Reds let Betts score from 2b on a infield single, with no errors committed, because they too became absorbed in getting Devers out at 1b and just kind of forgot about Betts. Hamilton like Betts is fast and simply capitalized on a misplay by Pedey followed by reactions which had to go outside the usual rundown playbook. The carping critics are using 20-20 hindsight.

Guys have played with a lot of grit this year, no question. I am anti-Stanton as well, plus I think several will bounce back next year. Meanwhile they have been fun to watch especially now that the have a good shot at 95 wins this year. If I were to single out players, it would probably be Sale, Betts, and Kimbrel in that order. Sale for his stunning ability and numbers, but also because he is a complete player and willing to make adjustments in his pitching. Betts because in a down year he still leads the Sox in hits, total bases, runs, OPS, rbi's, dingers, SB's, you name it. Kimbrel because he has mostly been lights out when closing out a game.

You are correct. Sale did not pitch against the Astros in June.

I consider it unlikely as well, but stated it simply because of the slim possibility that the October 1 game might determine who has home field advantage for the ALDS--us or the Astros. I like the home field advantage, but don't think it is as important as leading with Sale in game 1 on October 5. Illinoisredsox thinks Sale could start October 1 and maybe go 2 or 3 innings as a tune up for October 5, but I would prefer the Astros seeing him for the first time since mid-June.

Funny how this thread is no longer about this year and this pennant race. I find the Stanton talk tedious, frankly. Sox are now up 5 on the Yankees and 4 back of Houston, who come to town for their final four games. Sale right now is schedule to pitch the last game on October 1. If he does, he can't start game 1 of the ALDS on Oct 5, but he could still start on Oct 6 and on Oct 11 the scheduled 5th game of the ALDS. Last year talksox raged for weeks over Farrell's apparent unwillingness to "win out, maintain momentum," whatever it took to stay ahead of the Guardians for the home field advantage in the ALDS in which we lost three straight and were out. I think that's nonsense, but can see it happening again this year.

I do agree the playoffs--vs. the Guardians, Astros, or Yankees--will be a challenge. especially if their pitching is good. I don't agree that many guys are not doing their jobs. We won Saturday, for example, because of Moreland's 3 run dinger. Our bullpen has been amazing. Even our rotation is looking decent with Sale apparently returning to his early season form. Beni and Bogie seem to be coming around. Pedey, admittedly, is worrisome right now because he seems to have dropped into some can't-hit-spit chasm, not at all the guy he was earlier this month and earlier this year for that matter. JBJ ain't looking too good either. But overall you have to like this team right now. Plus none of those three--the Guardians, Astros, and Yankees--dominated us this season. JBJ's errant throw today notwithstanding, I think our outfield defense is excellent, our catching good, and our infield subpar but not a disaster. Plus good pitching--rotation and bullpen. And I think these guys will hit in October: Bogie, Beni, Betts, Nunez, Devers, Vazquez. Moreland might (now and then). JBJ might. Pedey might.

Too true. With Fister starting today, one is astonished the Sox even took the field knowing all those terrible truths you have just related. This team is such a mess and barely clinging to a 5 game lead with now 7 games to play.

What an incredible 8th innning rally and game. Bullpen great again, but so were the killer B's especially Betts who not only cleared the bases to tie the game, but scored from 2b on an infield single that was never mishandled. Yankees down 4 in the 9th, but I don't see them pulling this one out. Up 5 with 7 to play.

No offense and really no defense either.

Big 7th inning rally. JBJ walks and HanRam strikes out on 3 pitches.

Our outfield ain't helping one bit on defense.

Bogie, Pedey, Beni, and Betts have all been up three times against this guy and remain hitless.

No help from the defense. Or the offense. But let's blame it all on Fister and the manager.

Great stuff. I too look at those ERA and WAR rankings of individual pitchers and agree those numbers are meaningful. Quite another story on the hitting side, where the Sox have just one guy, Betts, in the top 40 of AL hitters as measured by OPS or WAR (not OWAR). Thanks to his fielding prowess, he is 5th in the AL in WAR, but only 36th in OPS. A year ago we had 6 of the top 40 AL hitters in individual OPS: Ortiz, Betts, HanRam, JBJ, Pedey, and Bogie. This precipitous drop must be because JF does not know how to do lineups.

Meh. This ain't a June swoon we're seeing right now, not when the Sox are 8-2 in their last 10 and 7 of 8 on their final road trip. The monkey is on the Yankees back, not ours. You sound almost accusatory when you say, "JF had Young and Holt in the game and we lucky . . ." Do you honestly think he was resting Pedey and Betts because he doesn't want to win or that maybe he thought they were tired? And what was lucky about Moreland's dinger batting cleanup where he has batted a big chunk of the season? Yes, pitching has been vital and very good, but it too has had its ups and downs what with Porcello and Fister both struggling to get out of the first inning unscathed. Not too long ago ERod had the same problem. The first inning!!! That's pretty darn hard to manage around even in September with the presumed deep bullpen.