Maxbialystock

This thread continues to be a good discussion of the Sox future (and past). I think just about everyone agrees pitching is the problem and that a good starter--or two--is/are needed ASAP. Plus 2 or more good bullpen arms. moonslav has pointed out the Sox could do some of that this offseason and still stay below the $241M threshold. I think he said around $60M or $80M would be available. The problem, as is universally agreed upon here on talksox, is with the owner John Henry. Somewhere around 2019 he seems to have put his foot down and insisted, "no more with the big bucks for great arms that go sour." In his defense--and I'm the only one defending him these days--the 2019 Sox not only had the highest payroll in MLB, they had a CBO, David Dombrowski, who was and is excellent, but who back then needed a lot more money to keep Mookie Betts from the Dodgers and to replace Price and Sale while still paying them $40M/year or whatever it was. That was then. Price is long gone, and this is the last year of paying Sale ($17M) for not pitching for the Sox. Unfortunately, however, the brand new CBO, a Yale man with 12 years MLB pitching experience, dumped Sale to the Braves for whom he is a Cy Young candidate, and signed Giolito for $19M/year, the first year of which was/is money down the drain. Moreover, Breslow did little too improve the 2024 Sox over last season. The rotation--especially Houck, Crawford, Bello, and Pivetta--are all guys from last year, and most of the bullpen is too. Same goes for the lineup. And don't forget Cora, who was just re-signed for 3 years and $21M. So, while I agree with all of you who insist the Sox need to invest much more in arms and maybe even a bat or two, I'm still mindful that neither Breslow (so far) nor Bloom inspired much confidence--and that John Henry came into Sox ownership more than willing to underwrite a payroll that for almost 20 seasons was in the top 3 in MLB.

Pessimism is one thing, but you have gone beyond that. So I can only imagine your grave disappointment when the Sox won tonight. I was thrilled. I was greatly disappointed when Bernardino gave up the 3 run dinger, but not overly surprised when Kelsey gave up the tying run. Then the Sox made a great comeback in the 9th and Martin got a nice save/win.

Meh. You are about as pure a pessimist as we have on talksox. The Apollo 13 guys don't make it back if you are on it or back in Mission Control in Houston. If you were MacArthur when we made it all the way to the Yalu River in October 1950, we get pushed all the way back to the 38th parallel. Oh, wait.

There have been some pretty bad ones in the past--and I only go back 8 years--but in the past year or two I've seen very few. There are several I consider to be negative or unduly pessimistic, but that's not the same. If that's because of mvp 78, good for him.

A semi-perfect game for the Sox. Good pitching and good defense and a couple of nice singles Plus they kept things close even though they never had a prayer of winning. And they end up losing the 5 game series to Toronto. The Royals lost and the Twins didn't play.

Tonight's game is an example of what the Sox might look like if Breslow will aggressively pursue that really good defensive team so many on talksox are clamoring for,. We would relish seeing no errors by the good guys, but also no runs. The pitching stuff would love it too. And JH might be happy because good glove/sarms with weak bats come cheap.

Ah, yes. The genius of the English language. We are so lucky.

Not the young guys, especially the ones having good seasons.

Ouch. Got me. But RBI just doesn't work for me as a plural noun. I was an English P for 3 years.

Sogard has the Sox only hit.

I think the Sox plate discipline might be OK, but Rafaela has never had any. Casas has excellent plate discipline.

We can, however, be pretty sure this weak Sox hitting is not because Devers is out. Nope. I read it right here on talksox that his having the 8th best OPS in MLB is just a bunch of hooey because he isn't driving in enough runs (even though heads the Sox in rbi's).

Sogard singles off a pitch in the dead center of the strike zone.

He hasn't just pitched to Vlad, he's given him fat pitches. Most of Crawford's pitches have been near the middle of the strike zone. Francis has hit more corners, but has still given the Sox pitches to hit. Abreu's last at bat was class. He took two strikes, then swung at a pitch well below the zone--and he had the righty vs lefty advantage.

Try those 3 dots in the upper right corner of your posts.

Both pitchers are crappy, but the hitters are much worse, except for the redoubtable Guerrero., to whom Crawford is obligingly serving up fat pitches.

Exactly. It's possible that at some point the Sox will decide he must go, but we are nowhere near that yet. And let's not forget that Mayer is no model of fitness/wellness. Let's also not forget that there are two middle infield positions to fill next year. I've beat up on Grissom endlessly, but he too should be a candidate/option.

Well written, able defense of Breslow. I would add one other item: it was his first year in a job a whole bunch of other potential CBO's probably turned down because of the uncertainty of where JH wants to take the Sox. On the other hand, Breslow also seems to be in the mold of his predecessors in not being able to make big moves on pitchers that work out. Even DD had to leave because in 2019 because two very pricey starters, Price and Sale, were struggling--and continued to in subsequent seasons while being paid enormous sums of money. Bottom line: Breslow is probably the best available CBO for the Sox. He's smart, and he knows pitching after having been one for 12 seasons in MLB. I'm guessing he and Cora are in sync.

Shakespeare said it best: much ado about nothing. My version: a stupid article just to write something, anything. Reality: when Story is ready, Cora will plug him in at SS or 2b, depending on the needs at the time. I frankly like 2b because I like Rafaela at SS and Duran in CF, leaving LF and RF for Ref, Abreau, O'Neill, et al. We know Story is a plus middle infield defender because we've seen that right here in Boston, and there is no end to the rantings and ravings on talksox about the dire need for good defense--almost to the extent of ignoring hitting and pitching, but not quite. Also, as was the case with Yoshida earlier this season, why wouldn't Cora play someone being paid $22M/season, who is also a plus defender and, back in Colorado, a plus hitter? I thought, you thought, we all thought Mayer was going to shore up the middle infield next year, but he too is injury-prone. All the more reason to take a look at Story this season.

Terrific win in just 2 hours and 10 min!!!!!!

The Sox dumped McGuire, not Wong. Tonight he caught a shutout. How many times has that happened this season for the Sox?

JBJ had 3 seasons when his OPS was over .800, but I'm inclined to agree with you. I also agree Rafaela will improve.

Agree. Eight is more than enough.

2d game without Devers. There's an article on the website that argues Wong absolutely, positively stinks behind the plate. Not sure I agree.

Either O'Neill read my post, or the Jays bullpen is as bad as ours.