cp176

Oh - and thank you for responding. Obviously SK that was meant for you and not me.

I saw that catch by Jackson last year, I'm thinking that I might agree with you. Although I really did like Yaz's catch in '67 when Rohr was pitching for the no-no quite a bit. I'm pretty sure that you do understand where I am coming from here. I'm really not as interested in the advanced metrics that some hang their hats on. I love trying to defend my observations and feelings based upon what I have seen and what I see as opposed to quoting something so finite. I'm probably wrong but folklore is written by people like me. That is what baseball is to me. It is an incredible game. Take the human element and perspective out of it and not so much. I still like umpires. I didn't at one time but now I do. lol

So when Baseball America lists JBJ as the best defensive center fielder playing today, I should ignore this because they did not list the incredible number of statistical sources they used to come up with this rating? Just checking ...

I loved that story. It's easy to forget that these guys are human beings with families. They don't exist just for us to go on about. the story about Cora and his twins should help to put into perspective what is really important.

Wait wait Slasher - I'll go with you. We represent two posters who have some opposing thoughts and ideas who can still actually get along with each other most of the time. lol

I get the fact that everybody loves the long ball - well not everybody. Do people love the number of strikeouts just as much? Also, what did I just read - the average time now between batted balls in play is what 4 minutes - just a little too long for most. Many more pitchers just throwing as opposed to pitching. I think that it is things like these that are not making the game a better game. My question would be what's happening and what's causing it too happen? Not to mention once again an over emphasis on shifts. An over emphasis on analytics has led to these changes. If the "average" fan wants to watch a game like what we are seeing develop today - so be it. Also, yes I mentioned the word bunting an it obviously become a focal point of my statement. It shouldn't be. Whatever people think about the art of bunting it is and has been an integral part of the game along with all of the so called "small" ball concepts. I think that all of us want to see the best brand of baseball played that we can see, I don't really think that that is what we are seeing.

2. wasn't really just about the bunting but I do get the point. I think that I might be what I consider the average fan. Maybe the average fan of yesteryear. I post primarily from the heart. I understand that. I really don't care much about the advanced metrics. I also think that big money is the culprit of the game to some extent as well. I'm not saying that change is bad. In most cases it is good.

I don't like the following: 1. instant replay - which isn't instant 2. the potential concept of relying on robots to ultimately replace umpires 3. a homerun or a strikeout with a de-emplahsis on many of the things that some baseball fans still love such as bunting, hitting and running, and stealing bases. 4. pitdhers not pitching to conatact As the game changes, i don't think that it is the old folks that you have to worry about losing. Numbers have always been important to the game and will continue to be. If the numbers dictate change, I hope that they are the types of changes that the average fan wants to see. I don't think that the game is as entertaining as it once was and I don't think that I am alone in feeling that way.

Please don't misunderstand what I am saying. Talking about the numbers and making projections based upon them I doubt is turning anyone away from the game. It is when believing absolutely that the numbers tell all and the result lead to what some might consider to be negative change to the game that I think might affect interest. Attendance is down that we know.

I don't disagree at all about the potential for decline here. I'm sure that the statistical evidence once again indicates that it is risky to sign any player older than 30 to a long term contract. I don't think that a degree in math is necessary to figure that one out. lol My entire premise with statistical data is that they are not always right. You can't take the human element out of the game. The more that it is done the more people will turn away from the game.

For sure - for many athletes 32-33-34-35- can be extremely productive years.

You said a lot here in a thoughtful way. As useful as any type of statistic is, they tend to tell only a part of the story. It is really all about the humans.

I find this interesting too. Although shifts have been used for a long time now they certainly are used to a much greater extent. What confuses me quite a lot though is that there is a lot of clamor about doing something to reign them in. I'm am an old school guy but yet I have absolutely no problem with shifts. Maybe it will usher back in a time when hitters have to think about what they are doing as opposed to just trying to bash the ball. Robots and replay - Nope Shifts - sure bring them on.

no one is questioning the relevance of how using how any data can help. Maybe i am misreading what players like Martinez and others are saying about the infusion or maybe intrusion of too much information being sent their way. For every player like JD Martinez there will be others who share his views that possibly too much emphasis is being placed on the data and the people gathering it as well. It is all useful but I guess I will just stick with what Martinez has to say.

You cannot take the human element out of the game. At least I hope they don't. There have been numerous articles written over the course of this season about what a difference having real bats in the lineup can make directly quoting players who play the game. I think that there is of course real relevance to using available statistical data to help a team but it never trumps what is going on in the minds of men who actually are on the field playing the game. In many cases the guys who don't care what the data says in fact.

ditto on the harper wish. not in Boston please.

I like this one. I actually believe that a great deal of success in any sport at any level cannot be accomplished without a certain type of mental approach. It has never been just about the talent. If the players are serious with respect to the article in SI that I just read, it is good enough for me.

I'm glad that you said probably here Moon. If the Red Sox had not signed JD Martinez simply because they assumed and hoped that everybody would have hit better this year just because, it would have been a foolish risk to take. I just finished reading the article about JD written in SI. I knew they I liked him and what he has brought to our team, now I know why I really like him. I like him just as much for what he does personally as I do for the ways in which he has helped our young players develop their hitting skills. It was a great read particularly if people can get by how he felt about the reasons Houston released him. I bet a clear majority of the payers playing the game have many of the same feelings that he has. Regardless of what the statistical odds say, it is possible to still get better.

As silly as it is to think that JD Martinez is solely responsible for the hitting resurgence that our guys are experiencing, Personally I think that it is just as silly to think that they would all be having the years that they have had to date without him in the lineup. It is obvious that to a man his influence has been felt in a positive way, whether it is through the protection he provides or simply from the advice and coaching that he has given. It really is a good situation for all and not really worth arguing over something that once again cannot be proven.There are lots of things that can't be proven by the way. It doesn't make them wrong.

You are probably right about the numbers. I certainly would never question the numbers. I am much more interested in what the players say and think with respect to having JD in the lineup as opposed to what the numbers say.

No one is arguing with you here notin. if you are suggesting that I don't listen to alternative views, which you are, you are wrong - I do. I do not need everything proven to me with your concept of strong logic or rationale in order to believe it. There are always different ways of looking at things regardless of how right you think your personal opinions might be.

Watching a guy like Butler for years now kind of makes me realize the talent it takes to get to the highest level. Dan Butler is a helluva baseball player - just not quite good enough.

Of course it doesn't make it a fact. Once again - I don't need everything proven before I believe it.

The fact that not everything can or even needs to be proven is ok with me.

I think you are right. I can't speak for anyone else but when (if) I am working and I feel comfortable , relaxed, and happy I tend to do a better job at whatever it is I am doing. Most of my athletic endeavors lately have to do with golf and if I am in a team competition and I have a good solid partner, my game is better. There is less stress as well as less pressure on me to perform. It is apparent to me anyway that this is the way many of our guys feel with JD in the middle of that lineup. We are damn lucky to have him!