DocHolliday

No doubt the Sox will need to rebuild the pitching with a strong emphasis on drafting, developing, and acquiring pitching prospects. But they will need to supplement those prospects with short term, high value veteran pitchers. As many media outlets and fans alike have speculated, it looks the like White Sox won't be picking up Peavy's option for next season. If this does become the case, he'll hit the FA market coming off a strong season. If he's looking for a 2 or 3 year deal at reasonable $, he would make sense signing. Lots of opportunity for improvement with so many aspects of this team and so many ways to improve. This is shaping up to be a very intriguing and important off season.

It is almost as if the Sox are the opposite of the Orioles this year when it comes to closing out games. Atleast the organization appears to be heading in the right direction to fixing this perpetual pitching problem. Lucchino mentioned today that the team would be looking to add a dedicated pitching evaluator for the entire organization and another senior advisor to Cherington in the near future.

I know the season is over and has been for a long time. But that was pathetic. This team had a perfect opportunity to end the Rays season for good with 3 outs to get and a 3 run lead. Literally from day 1, this team has been walked off on a regular basis.

The "hot shooter" that is the Baltimore Orioles appear to be on their way to a 15th straight extra inning win. If they hold on, they will be 2 extra inning wins away from tying the all time record set by the 1949 Cleveland Guardians. For the record, that Guardians team was coming off a WS championship (the last time they ever won one) and finished 3rd in the AL behind the NY Yankees and the Boston Red Sox, missing the playoffs. This Orioles team, on the other hand, was almost unanimously picked to finish in last place. Unbelievable.

Agreed- Ellsbury is too much to give up for a guy with the injury history of Johnson. As you mention, Ellsbury's injuries have been due totally to elements out of his control, while Johnson's injuries can be traced back to no outside cause. If Ellsbury is dealt, it needs to be for a young, cost controlled player with high upside that makes sense for this organization in the future. With Ellsbury's pending FA, it would also have to be to a team that would have both a need and interest in signing him long term. This is part of the reason I have mentioned the Rangers as a logical trade partner. With Hamilton almost certainly due to leave after this season, the Rangers will have a big hole in their lineup going forward. They will continue to mash, but without Hamilton & Napoli, coupled with Young and Beltre's aging, they will need someone to take over Hamilton's role on offense and defense. The interest would presumably be there as well as the need. They have shown they will spend in FA, as their payroll has seen the highest % increase of any ML club since 2009 (and with Beltre as an example, they don't seem to shy away from Boras clients). Add to all of this quality and depth of their farm system and recent call ups, and its easy to see why they would be a logical trade partner. I'm sure there are other teams in similar situations- this is the one that comes to mind immediately.

Perhaps it's time to consider more than just player moves to fix the pitching next season and going forward. Outside of Buchholz, this organization has managed to extract the upside of just about every pitcher that has been with this team over the past few seasons. Yes, there are examples like Buchholz and Tazawa. But there are far more examples of mysterious under performers like Melancon, Bard, Lackey, and, to some extent, Lester. Whether its poor evaluation/acquisition, poor coaching, or poor preparation/conditioning, it's clear that this organization needs to look outside the organization for answers to improve ALL of these aspects. Yes, talent will ultimately be what turns this tide, but without the proper support system, I'm afraid we fans will continue to be let down and frustrated by the pitching failures.

The balance of power has certainly shifted for the time being. But it wasn't that long ago when the baseball world could agree that the AL would come down to the Yankees and Red Sox. Things can change in this sport quickly as we have seen this season with the O's and A's, the Rangers in 2010, and the Rays in 2008. Outside of Ortiz and maybe Lackey, the Sox don't have near the number or commitment to aging stars as the Yankees do. Jeter, Arod, and Rivera (assuming he returns) immediately come to mind, with Sabathia and Teixiera not too far behind. That's around $70 M in commitments to players who will fit the aging stars tag over each of the next 4 seasons. By contrast, the Sox are currently on the hook for $32M total for Lackey over the next 2 seasons and around $12 M to Ortiz if he returns for next year. From where things stand today, it certainly appears that the Red Sox are much better equipped to improve on their current position in the coming years than the Yankees are.

Peavy is definitely the most intriguing of those options for me - just because the Sox wouldn't have to give up any prospects. Unlike the other guys, Peavy has a $22 M club option for next season, which the White Sox will not exercise. Peavy would become a free agent and would not cost Doubront or prospects to acquire. The other guys are younger but would require a LT extension similar to the Gonzalez trade. Peavy on the other hand could be signed for shorter years and $ than the other guys, despite his age. With his injury history, I doubt a team would commit to him beyond his age 35 season (greater than a 4 year deal). Other guys, like Haren, represent similar options in FA the Sox could take - particularly if any of these pitchers are looking for 1 year pillow type of contracts.

Fair assessment. As for next season, I don't see a whole lot changing - in fact I see the league becoming even more competitive. The Orioles and A's will bring the core of their teams back for next year. The Yankees will continue to get older with their core of players. The Rangers will probably lose Hamilton and Napoli to FA while Michael Young and Adrian Beltre are a year older. And the Rays will have to decide whether to pick up Shields option (expensive for them) or lose their number 2 pitcher to FA. Without even mentioning the central teams and teams that should improve next season with better health and/or pending offseason changes (Blue Jays, Red Sox, Angels), next year should be very similar to the races we are seeing now.

It was only a matter of time before the Rays had a collapse like this down the stretch. Their offensive output over the last few seasons has always been putrid, but went through these types of stretches mid season and for shorter lengths of time. For all of the times they have tortured us since 2008, winning this series can serve as some kind of consolation prize. The next order of business will be to knock the Yankees out of the playoffs who, mind you, completely bent over backwards for the Rays at the end of last season. There's no excuse for giving up a 7 run lead with 6 outs to play whether or not you have already made the playoffs.

Well, we can officially scratch Colby Lewis off the list of potential starting depth options for next season as he signed a 1 year extension with the Rangers for next season. He will be 33 and coming off of TJ around the All Star break next season.

All of these are intriguing options. If the Sox have learned anything from the recent past, it's to have quality options for depth at all positions. If they trade Ellsbury, they should seriously consider 2 or more of these options and let them compete for the starting job in ST. A little competition would do this complacent culture that has taken over the clubhouse in recent years a world of good. But again, I'm not advocating dealing Ellsbury for the sake of getting something back. It would have to make sense for both the short and long term competitiveness of this team.

Andrus is a top of the order batter and would have to bat lead off - no question. My issue with the move is- what does Elvis give the Sox that they don't already have? When healthy, Ellsbury is clearly the better player from the offensive side. Ellsbury has better ability to get on base, better speed than Andrus, and can hit for more power- even if it's not 30 HR. Defensively, I would grade them both about the same as elite for their positions. The deal breaker for me comes from the stock of SS we already have in the minors. Boegarts and Marrero are at least a year away from contributing. How much is Andrus going to be worth to us for a year or so until those guys are ready? Unless the Red Sox would then use them to trade for an elite starter like a Felix Hernandez, this deal doesn't make sense. I'd feel much more comfortable letting Iglesias play short until the prospects are ready and get the guy who could fill a position of need for next year AND the future, Mike Olt. If the Rangers aren't willing to deal him, the Red Sox would be better off shopping Ellsbury elsewhere or just hanging onto him for next year. Assuming both players are healthy, I have little doubt that Ellsbury gives the Sox more over a full season than Andrus would.

Any deal with the Rangers involving Ellsbury would have to be centered around Olt or Profar coming back. The Rangers are high on both and have been rumored to refuse any trade involving either of the two. The Rangers would be getting a younger and far less risky replacement for Hamilton and would avoid having to move Kinsler into an already crowded OF with Cruz and Murphy signed for next season. Obviously, Elvis is a talented and relatively young SS. But he has next to zero power and his ceiling for gaining more power isn't very high. In the Rangers home run friendly ballpark, he has averaged 4 HR per season since 2009 with his highest total 6 coming in 2009. He also doesn't really help the Sox need for a more disciplined plate approach going forward any more than Ellsbury has. His OBP has stayed around .350 the past few seasons while he walks around 60 times per season - similar to Ellsbury. Olt has been known for his superior plate discipline throughout his college and minor league career and has a much higher power ceiling than Andrus - not to mention Olt is an above average defender at both 1st and 3rd base. Right now, Middlebrooks and Ortiz (assuming he resigns) are the only legitimate power threats in the lineup. Pedroia, Ross, and some of the options available through FA represent good supplementary sources of power, but this team is going to need more power and plate discipline going forward - not to mention getting younger. I would take my chances with Boegarts and Marrero and live with a guy like Iglesias until one of those 2 is ready for the majors. Only question becomes, who will play CF next year if the Sox deal Ellsbury?

I still have faith that Iglesias will be productive with this team in the future. Probably the worst time you can judge players abilities and future contributions is in the last month of a season with the team out of the race. To this point, there is no question that Iglesias is not a finished product. He's been able to figure out how to hit at a respectable level for stretches at all levels of his development. With his limited number of AB, there is reason to give him a chance to prove himself beyond this season - no matter what his stat line shows. Still, I would not be opposed to trading him in a deal that can improve the team in the LT.

I wouldn't mind it if this team makes another big free agent signing in the future - as long as it makes sense for the long term. To use your example, Josh Hamilton doesn't make sense for the LT. At his age, his most productive seasons would be the first few years of the contract. Who knows if this team will be able to compete next year. We're not even considering the other risk factors he brings. Big market FA, particularly those in their late 20s and/or with a proven track record in big markets, can make sense. But they won't make sense if the FO uses them to fix an already underperforming team, as they have done recently. Instead, they should be used as retaining and supplemental pieces with a young core of cost controlled players as the main foundation.

Wow Iglesias- Can't turn a fairly routine DP then makes a spectacular turn on a more difficult play. It's ridiculous that we have to desperately try to find positives with this team.

I would love to see all 3 AL East teams get knocked out but that's not possible. With the Yankees recent slide, I could definitely see them missing the playoffs this year. It would be good for baseball to have them sit out for once. As far as the O's and Rays, if one of them misses the playoffs this year in part to the Sox beating them in the final weeks of the season, I'd be ecstatic. With the way the O's ended our season last year with that ridiculous celebration on the field, it would be a good dose of karma. On the other hand, the Rays have caused much misery to the Red Sox in the past few years. It would be nice to see the Red Sox knocking them out of the playoffs for once. Personally, I feel the central teams or the Angels would have a better shot of going deep into the postseason than either the O's or Rays would. Either of them would be the de facto bye week for the Rangers or top seeded AL team.

What I still will never understand is why the majority of mistake decisons during this period were made with the "pink hat" fans interests as top priority. It seems as though the FO thought process was "as long as we keep the pink hat fans happy, revenue will continue to flow in. Plus, the hardcore, critical, 365 days a year fans will continue to follow no matter what - because it's their nature, in their blood, etc." Going forward, their mindset needs to be "we will make decisions that will benefit our organization in the short and long term because that will lead to prolonged winning. When the team wins, our 365 day a year, hardcore, critical fans will be satisfied. And, because the team is winning, we also keep the pink hat fans interested and the revenue streams they provide." Never again should baseball decisions take a backseat to the business decisions.

The only improvement I can see as it pertains to games in 2012 is performance improvements from the players who will be here in 2013 and beyond. Outside of that, they may be able to find a small ounce of accomplishment if they can knock 2 of the AL East contenders out of the post season.

This is the measure they should evaluate ALL members of the organization for next year and beyond. 2007 was 5 seasons ago and Ortiz is the lone member left from 2004 - which was nearly a decade ago. This organization loves to tout their resume around. And it's been 4 seasons since they won a playoff game, 3 seasons since they were swept out of the playoffs. If they are serious about trying to reconnect with the fans, we will see them making significant progress this offseason to building a team that can go on another long run of success. Let's face it - the landscape around baseball is much different than it was in 2007. The overall competitiveness of both leagues, but particularly the AL, is much greater than it was 5 years ago. Back then, the Yankees, Red Sox, Angels, and a team from the central made the playoffs each season. This could be the 4th season in a row where there is a different group of teams representing the AL. They certainly have their work cut out for them. It would be a complete mistake if they wait until December 1 to hire their manager again. The issues are simply too large and too numbered to waste 1 month of the offseason figuring out their LT organization structure when they could be taking steps to do that now when they have until the end of October to fix organizational issues before the offseason starts.

Had to vote that V would stay through the end of the season because I feel that ownership won't have the guts to fire him in the next few days. Hopefully they prove me wrong and step up. Last year, they spent way too much time with the managerial search and ended up hiring the wrong guy anyway. That said, not sure anyone would have succeeded this year. Fact is, they have so many issues they need to fix this offseason that they will need to start the managerial search BEFORE the season ends. There is no sense in waiting until Dec. 1st to begin their actual offseason. They need to be thorough, but they need to have the guy in place by early to mid November.

Looking at 0-6 on this trip, out scored 30-3 in the 1st 3 innings of games. This team has not been prepared to compete for quite some time. Leave V in Seattle.

0-5 on the trip. The more they lose down the stretch, the more the ownership will be forced to fire V. Let's face it- if things continue to go this badly, we are better off giving Bogar a shot at managing for a few weeks. It was bad enough when they were underperforming earlier in the season. Now, they are simply going through the motions.

Why would he leave Oakland now if he didn't leave 10 years ago when Henry made the offer then?