Palodios

Jung, you really need to clean up your posts. I'd love to have a discussion with you, but there's no way I'm going to read the whole thing. But either way, your main point is simply wrong. Just because Lester never had a Cy Young season doesn't mean he hasn't pitched like an ace. Here are 2008-2011 numbers from the best pitchers in the AL. Pitcher A: 3.33 ERA, 65 wins, 813 IP, ERA+ 135 Pitcher B: 3.37 ERA, 55 wins, 823 IP, ERA+ 126 Pitcher C: 3.45 ERA, 72 wins, 916 IP, ERA+ 125 Pitcher D: 3.05 ERA, 76 wins, 958 IP, ERA+ 143 Pitcher E: 3.35 ERA, 58 wins, 847 IP, ERA+ 125 Pitcher F: 3.86 ERA, 54 wins, 887 IP, ERA+ 106 Pitcher G: 3.38 ERA, (short seasons), ERA+ 117 A: Lester, B: Greinke, C: Verlander D: Sabathia, E:Weaver, F:Shields, G: Price. Some of those guys have better innings, but the reality is that Lester has pitched as well as any of them.

Choo has been underperforming/injured the last two years, and they sold high on him. I agree that their pitching needs some luck, but they added an elite pitching prospect, and a pile of very good players at reasonable contracts.

I mentioned this in the MLB topic as well... but DAAMN, what an offseason for Cleveland. They just picked up Bourn for 4/48.

Cleveland just signed Michael Bourne for 4/48. Wow. What an offseason! Adding a 2x World Series manager, two all-star outfielders, a pretty solid centerfielder in Drew Stubbs, and a top-notch pitching prospect in Trevor Bauer.... all without losing any major pieces, or paying exorbitant prices. The Guardians look like the winner of the offseason to me, in terms of cost versus gain.

Does Dickey really throw his knuckler that fast? I was under the impression that the sweet spot for the pitch was in the low 70s because of some crazy aerodynamic physics.

Not sure what this is about... not many players left on the board.

Halladay is one of the few guys I'd count on in later years. The last time he had a full season ERA above 3.00 was 2007, and the last time he pitched under 220 innings was 2005. He's also dominated the AL East. Schilling was 41 in 2007 afterall, and Halladay is by far the superior pitcher. Either way, it should be an interesting offseason because there will be a few elite arms available who have been in this division-- Halladay, Garza, and possibly Johnson and Marcum.

2/40 is probably what he'll be worth. 2/60 is what it will take to get him to play in Boston.

MLB Trade Rumors totally reminds me... Roy Halladay is a free agent next year. I don't care if he will be 37, Roy Halladay is a guy who is worth a 2/60 contract.

Hopefully they'll call him up when the Guardians face the Red Sox.

Errr, just to be clear, the quote from above is what I want him to say.

I'm just miffed by his evaluation of his skillset. I'd have no problem with one of these: "He's our catcher. We'll stand by him this season, and see what happens as he reaches free agency. He's definitely an important part of this team, and can be a solid catcher within our organization."

I have officially lost faith in Cherries.

More news has come out. As I expected, this was not a small thing. He shot himself clean through his own leg.

I've read scouting reports that have their peaks are 95 mph for Doubront, and 97 for Morales. Edit: I've also seen a report that said Morales can reach 99 mph at times, but I'm skeptical on that one.

How is this not bigger news? http://fullcount.weei.com/sports/boston/baseball/red-sox/2013/02/09/bryce-brentz-suffered-injury-in-gun-accident/ Sounds a lot more serious than he claims it to be.

Lackey and Dempster are your token #3 type pitchers. ERAS in the 4.00s, with high strikeouts and high innings. If healthy and effective, they'll keep the Red Sox in games for the offense/bullpen to finish off. Ofcourse, that is a big if. Doubront and Morales are lefties with 96-97 MPH fastballs-- Morales being a top 10 overall draft pick. They're both young pitchers who simply haven't gotten everything together for a good season yet, but the talent is definitely there. There are a lot of IFS, and I'm aware of it. However, the way the team has started alleviates some of my concerns.

It seems like this is the trend, and I agree with it. Another pitcher would have been great. I think that the important thing to remember is that the team does actually know more about the make-up of the team than we do. They know the prognosis of Lackey's elbow, the progress and projections for MB/AW/RDLR/FM/AA. They also had medical reports on guys like Brendan Mccarthy, Dan Haren, Shaun Marcum, and Jair Jurrgens-- players we all wanted, but may have had health issues.

What would you do? No way you'd go into 2013 with what was here at the end of 2012. Maybe you'd like to think that now, but if you were building the team, it would break your heart. The Red Sox's budget is a lot like government spending. If they don't spend, they lose the money the next year, and have to work in order to rebuild it. Two 50-60 win seasons in a row would kill the fanbase, aggravate the players, scare off future free agents, and would make Talksox a really sad and awful place. As it stands now, we atleast have a "Well, if everything lines up just right" scenario. With Loney, Iglesias, Sands, we wouldn't even have that. We already know that those guys suck. Dempster provides a reliable inning eater. Napoli for 1 year is a bargain-bin signing. Gomes and Ross are spare parts, no big deal. I've discussed this with you a few times before, but Drew, Dempster, Napoli, and Hanrahan could turn into very good trade-bait midseason. Not necessarily all of them, but if a few of them have big seasons and could be turned into young pitching prospects mid-season, who would regret signing them?

Even most of us "ballwashers" knew the pitching was weak going into 2012, and relying on Doubront/Bard was a bad idea. Just as how most of us wanted one more pitcher in 2013.

Tampa doesn't regret trades . Price's home/away splits are insane. They'll trade him away, he'll either get hurt, or turn into a 3.50-4.00 ERA pitcher, pull in a pile of elite pitching prospects, turn them all into superstars and continue the process. You draft your core, and supplement it on the free agent market. That's how it has always been, and how it will continue to be. Finding a #1 pitcher is going to be incredibly difficult, which is why they we're going to see them put a good deal of faith into Lester/Buch/RDLR/ Webster/Barnes/Owens in 2013. Afterall, the Bard experiment was another attempt at finding another elite starter, but that one just happened to go kaput.

Agreed.

It is the right way to term that. They simply are unobtainable. Contenders with money don't trade elite players. It simply isn't done, because it makes no sense. Even if they were offered 5-6 top 100 prospects, teams like that might not make the trade because of how significantly it would hurt their fans and their franchise.

I just don't think those guys are obtainable. If you're looking for a free agent ace available in the seasons ahead, that guy is David Price.

I don't know about everyone else... but spring training has made me feel much better about the rotation. Pretty much the entire pitching staff was already in florida atleast a week earlier-- some longer. These guys are dedicated to pitching better this year. Whether that will turn into results is yet to be seen, but the attitude is significantly improved over what we saw last year, and I like to believe that when talented people work hard in life, they succeed.