a700hitter

We haven't improved. What we have added and lost doesn't add up to any talent improvement, so we are relying on better health to make the improvement to a playoff team, but the competition has made significant improvements in their rosters.

It is irrelevant to to 2012 pitching staff whether he gets a team friendly deal extending beyond 2012. So you are saying definitively that the net improvement in the starting pitching due to Bard moving into the rotation will exceed the negative effect of him being moved from his spot as the 8th inning guy? And do you think that difference will be significant?

No one disputed Bard's awesomeness as an 8th inning guy which was his role in 2011. Moving him out of that role results in a huge hole in the pen. Melancon has not done anything close to what Bard has done as the Sox 8th inning guy.

I'll buy off SFF with some Red Sox tickets.

The last audit of TalkSox revealed that I have been right 98.7 percent of the time. The last time I was wrong was in 2006 about Pedroia, but few people thought he'd win an MVP, so I ha some company on that one. FYI: I also predicted the Super Bowl score in the head the last time we ran that contest.

If Aceves goes into the rotation, I think that would weaken the pen more than it would strengthen the rotation. Doubront is a long shot, but the best shot on the list. Other than Padilla, the rest of that list has virtually no chance of contributing anything of significance in my opinion. You mention Julian Tavares as an example, but by the time Taveras was pressed into duty in 2007, he had spent 14 seasons in the majors and he had been a starting pitcher for 3 seasons for some crummy teams and he did show some ability to eat innings and win as many games as he lost. He spent most of his career as a reliever and was good enough to stay in the majors for 17 seasons and stay healthy. Silva and Maine are bums. Cook is injured beyond repair. He has nothing left. Miller is a bust. Padilla is the only shot. He's the only one of the sorry bunch that might do something, but he hasn't been healthy in 3 years. You are still not saying how the much the decrease in the quality of our bullpen (resulting from moving Bard) will offset the improvement Bard brings to the rotation. I don't think Melancon will be close to the weapon in the 8th inning that Bard had become. It really comes down to the delta between the improvement to the rotation brought by Bard and the decline experienced by the bullpen by losing Bard. I just don't see that as being significant. Finally, I think the addition of a starter easily could be the difference between a 95-96 win team and a 90-91 win team that misses the playoffs.

Jackson is a whole lot better than the garbage heap of Silva, Cook, Maine and Padilla. I have no doubt about that.

Injuries and health issues can't be predicted. There is absolutely no good reason to believe that there will not be an injury to one of the top 3. We don't know what caused Buch' s back fracture and whether it can be a chronic problem. We don't know if Beckett stays healthy etc. Looking at the makeup of the staff, assuming health or injury, I agree that Bard could be an improvement over what was in the 4th slot last year, but we just don't know. He could just as easily blow up. He's an unknown at this point, but I'll concede that he should be an improvement. That still leaves you with TBD in the 5th spot if we don't make an acquisition. Additionally, you are not saying how the much the decrease in the quality of our bullpen (resulting from moving Bard) will offset the improvement Bard brings to the rotation. I don't think Melancon will be close to the weapon in the 8th inning that Bard had become. It really comes down to the delta between the improvement to the rotation brought by Bard and the decline experienced by the bullpen by losing Bard. I just don't see that as being significant. Even the top 3 stay healthy all season long, a black hole in the 5th spot from day one would be even worse than what we had there last year.

Benny Boy needs to go to Oswalt's home and walk in there with a $10 million contract and tell him he has until the end of the meeting to sign. If he doesn't sign, the Sox need to tell him that the offer is off the table and they will go in a different direction and they will announce to the press that they have no interest in Oswalt. That will cause his market and leverage to shrink dramatically. An approach like this is the only chance the Sox have to land him IMO. Ben, get the hell off your couch, buy a plane ticket and go see Oswalt. One of us will drive you to and from the airport. You are not going to make this deal talking on the phone. Get going and get it done.

This is disturbing. Why can't he just pack it in? http://www.floridatoday.com/article/20120129/COLUMNISTS0317/301290050/John-Torres-Wakefield-plays-waiting-game?odyssey=mod|newswell|text|Home|p

I am planning to be in Boston in April for the Yankees (4/21), in May for either the Orioles or Cleveland (haven't decided yet), in June for the Nats, July for the Yanks and August for the Royals. Long Island isn't solid Yanks or Mets, but probably more Yankees at this point. It used to be more for the Mets.

You get charged for an hour but only get 50 minutes.

While the 2011 team was not an utter failure, the consensus is that the biggest problem with the team was the pitching. If we are going to go into 2012 with pitching that we all think is about the same, that is not a good thing. I think we could find ourselves in a similar situation with our current roster at the end of the season, and the downturn or collapse could start earlier.

Now that I know the clinical term for it, am I correctly observing this behavior?

About a week ago, maybe a little more, the members of TalkSox almost unanimously agreed that the Sox needed to get another starting pitcher. There was no dissent on that. Without another starting pitcher we were pretty much in agreement that the 2012 pitching will most likely be about the same as the 2011 pitching not significantly better or worse. Obviously, if everything works out perfect, the 2012 pitching could significantly improve. Similarly, with a few bad breaks, the 2012 pitching could crash and burn. However, the expectation is that they will be about the same as 2011, which proved not to be good enough. Now, that the news has turned very discouraging about us getting another stater, I don't understand how some posters are saying that we will be alright with what we have.:dunno:

Jeesh, we are starting to develop similar posting styles with this "fair enough" stuff.

Fair enough. They are three very solid pitchers. No argument there. They are all All Star caliber. No argument there either.

I deleted the post after I realized that you guys were discussing the playoffs. I didn't want to muck up the discussion.

The Wild Card teams will be at a tremendous disadvantage going forward. They will be forced to use their aces to win the 1 game playoff and then the ace doesn't get to pitch until game 3 of the Division Series, so they will be at a tremendous disadvantage. Yes, it does help that the Sox have a very good top 3, probably better than most teams, but you would want the hottest of those 3 to get 2 starts in the 5 game series. That's not going to be a possibility for the Wild Card teams. I am a baseball purist, and in my opinion, the result of the 162 game schedule should mean more than 1 additional home game in the playoffs. The argument that it is more important to set up your pitching for the playoffs than to win the division will no longer hold any water.