RedSoxRooter

Well..... if Pedro could last longer into games, Timlin wouldn't have the chance to blow it? Look, this whole "we already miss Pedro/he was the best EVERRR" thing is great and all, but you all should have started this thread after 2002.

Remember that NY game in 01 when Pedro said he wanted to shut it down and Duquett forced him to pitch? That bastard. I was at that game and Pedro only went like 5 innings or something. He went on the DL shortly after.

Well, it's official. Pedro just passed his physical. http://www.boston.com/dailynews/350/sports...on_deal_:.shtml

You can use this one as a placeholder until then ...

I still don't understand why, but I guess it's a good deal..... I guess Hanley is bait now. Dirtdogs is also posting this: "Meanwhile, Sox Getting Closer with Pitching Replacements - A.J. Burnett is Front and Center" Me excited!

I highly doubt it. I think he'll actually be very good in Shea. Just remember, he may be good at Shea in the NL, but he wouldn't have been as good at Fenway. And I totally agree with ahhchon -"it's over with, no need to keep bitching about pedro leaving."

The offseason's always a great time to be a Yankee fan. It's the postseason you have to worry about. :harhar:

If any of you enjoy reading conspiracy theories about the inner workings of the Boston Red Sox, you’ll probably love this. I’m cynical anyway, so I dug it. http://p086.ezboard.com/fsonsofsamhornbost...start=1&stop=20

... and if it's 90% torn, how in the hell does he pass a physical?

I'm more curious about this... "They know -- everybody knows -- Martinez has a tear in his labrum that's practically as wide as the San Andreas Fault. One informed estimate put that tear as 90 percent full." What does 90% full really mean? Is it 90% torn, or 90% healed with scar tissue???

So are you gay?

16-9, but 3-0 vs the Yanks.

I had no idea about the shoulder..... From ESPN.com They're going to have their chances to get me back in that uniform. If they don't get me, it's probably because they didn't try hard enough." -- Pedro Martinez, after his final game with the Red Sox ANAHEIM -- Oh, they tried. The Red Sox tried harder to "get" Pedro Martinez than many people in their organization wanted to try. They tried harder than Pedro will ever acknowledge they tried. Pedro Martinez's ERA ballooned to 3.90 last season. But hard as they tried, Martinez will never throw another pitch in that Red Sox uniform. We know that now. We know because on Monday, he said yes (at least tentatively) to the New York Mets, to an offer of $50 million over four years that is as close to a definition of insanity in baseball as we have witnessed since -- what? -- the Mike Hampton contract? The Red Sox were never going to guarantee this man four years. They weren't particularly excited about guaranteeing him three years. They know -- everybody knows -- Martinez has a tear in his labrum that's practically as wide as the San Andreas Fault. One informed estimate put that tear as 90 percent full. So there is a stupendous chance that one of these days, Pedro will go from being Omar Minaya's most famous acquisition straight to being the Mets' next Mo Vaughn. Minus the insurance, that is. We surveyed a half-dozen baseball men Monday, after word of Martinez's stunning I Love New York tune began to leak around the winter meetings. The question we asked was this: What are the chances of Martinez making it through four healthy seasons as a Met -- no muss, no fuss, no trips to the DL? And the unanimous answer won't surprise you: Zero. None. Nada. Pedro's clock is ticking. And the always-wary city of New York will be watching. We wish him the best, because it has always been a blast watching him perform his inimitable magical mystery tour on every mound in America. But the way he worked these negotiations, the way he misled the Red Sox on his way to exotic Flushing Meadow, will not go down as his finest hour. The complete details of this negotiation may never become clear. But this is how this deal went down, from what we know now: On Saturday night, the Red Sox were just about 100 percent sure he was coming back. He had asked them to guarantee three years. So grudgingly, they guaranteed three years and $38 million. He had asked them for perks and planes and privileges that Bronson Arroyo will never even envision, let alone ask for. But grudgingly, the Red Sox gave him virtually all that, too. That was supposed to be that. Instead, Pedro did nothing more but use that astounding offer to squeeze more out of the Mets. His agent, Fernando Cuza, met with the Mets on Sunday. He laid out what the Red Sox had promised Martinez. He asked the Mets if they were willing to guarantee a fourth year. Mets GM Omar Minaya mulled it over for a while. Then, on a Sunday night that changed everything, Minaya agreed to guarantee four years, about $50 million. Incredibly, Pedro still didn't say yes. Standard negotiating practice these days, according to two longtime baseball negotiators, is never to offer a deal-sealer like that fourth year without explicitly saying, "I'm only offering this if it means this deal is done." But it appears Minaya didn't attach that stipulation -- because after that, according to sources who had spoken with the Red Sox, Cuza went back to the Boston delegation one more time. He said Pedro was hurt and angry. Why would one team be willing to give him four years but the Red Sox wouldn't? Why wouldn't the Red Sox show him the respect he had earned after all these years? The Red Sox delegation didn't need to listen long. They had heard enough. They had done enough. They had done all they were going to do. So if Pedro could get all that from the Mets, he should probably go get it before the Mets changed their mind. And that was how it ended. Seven of the greatest seasons in Red Sox history. More than 200 trips to the mound. An astounding 117 wins -- vs. only 37 losses. Nearly 1,700 strikeouts in 1,383 2/3 innings. And no number that can measure the charisma, the genius, the sheer artistry of one of the great pitchers of his time. Or any time. The Red Sox won't be the same without him. There will be a little less buzz, a little less electric current surging through those Fenway nights, a little less reason to blow up an evening's plans to make sure you made it to the TV room for Pedro's starts. But it's a funny thing. As much as the Red Sox will miss all that, they won't miss the countless days he showed up late, the obligations he dodged, the special treatment he demanded. Martinez will have a challenge awaiting for him with New York fans. If he can get away with that in the city of New York -- where he has hardly been everyone's favorite baseball visitor, where they have reaped none of the joy he has spread over these last seven years -- more power to him. But we are trying to imagine the back page of the Post or the News after he opted not to show up for Game 6 of an apocalyptic League Championship Series, as he did this past October. The headlines might not fit on the page. In the end, he needed more rest and nonstop maintenance. He was still fun when he took the ball, or when he led those cheers from the dugout. But one baseball man who knows the Red Sox well predicted there would be no clubhouse uproar over this. Not a peep. "You'll be amazed how little you'll hear those players complain," he said. "I bet you'll never hear a word -- no matter how many games he wins." The Mets get a great pitcher -- on some nights, anyway -- and a great attraction for their new TV network. But don't ask for 120 pitches. Don't ask for nine innings. Don't ask for any emergency starts on short rest. And even regular rest may stop being quite enough. What the Red Sox get, mostly, is a huge challenge. They were sure they had Pedro. Then they didn't. They were sure they had Carl Pavano. Then he U-turned toward the Bronx to make his mother and father -- longtime Yankees fans -- happy. So now, instead of those two, they have David Wells, who turns 42 next May, and a giant hole in the rotation that Pedro was supposed to fill. They can use some of Pedro's money on Edgar Renteria, a tremendous player and more cost-effective purchase. But it appears they will take their time trying to find that last starter. Maybe Odalis Perez. Maybe Tim Hudson. Maybe some other creative Theo Epstein acquisition. They will still be good. They will still be must-see New England TV. They will still get to raise that World Series banner on Opening Day. But everything that comes after this will be filed under Life Without Pedro. He made their world more interesting every moment he was around. But he might very well have made their life a lot more peaceful just by deciding he had hung around long enough. Jayson Stark is a senior writer for ESPN.com.

But Pedro wasn't on the FA market when we got him either. I guess my point is, however optomisticly ******** this sounds, that the Sox can still upgrade - even after losing Pedro. 17.5 million can go a long way if spent correctly. I have faith in Theo. It may not go to pitching this year, but maybe next year when something really good comes along.

So you think the Cards will offer more?

True. Then look who we picked up to replace Clemens. The cycle will repeat.

I don't know. I think the Sox final offer was right around that. 3 years/40 million. To be honest, I think one reason Pedro left was that he needs to be known as the Ace and treated like a superstar, neither of which are garanteed in Boston.

Pedro's always had poor run support though. It used to frustrate the hell out of me when we first got him. The fact that he's out of the game before the Sox can feast on the other teams bullpen kinda sums things up for my previous statement.... And please don't get me wrong. I will forever love the guy and I'm sure as s*** happy about him not staying in the AL or going to the Yankees. I just don't see him pulling a Roger out of his ass and winning 4 more Cy Youngs. And for 14 million/per, he should be able to.

Well, that is a big IF... And by back on track I assume you mean being able to pitch 9 innings again - or even 8 with some regularity if he had to. I'll agree that 2002 and 2003 he didn't get the wins he could have because the bullpen sucked - but that's part of the problem with Pedro. If he's out by the top of the 6th or 7th, then he will get some NDs or lose some close ones. But again, that's also why he's not worth 56 million over 4 years (what the mets think). I do believe Pedro, in the NL, will be a great pitcher. At least for a couple more years. New to the league, no NY Yankees to face (or Red Sox), no DH. I think Pedro will pitch just fine there. But I won't be upset about it.

Agreed on Tek. I don't think the sox should even be offering as much as they had. As for Pedro, yes, he has been the most dominant pitcher for the last 7 years (total). But that's living large off of '98-mid 2001. Since then he has not been the most dominant pitcher in the league. Maybe a top 5, but not the most dominant. And last year he wasn't even the most dominant pitcher in his own rotation. On top of that, he gets spanked by the Yankees 50% of the time he faces them, which hurts us more because it's a 2 game swing in the standings. And finally, I think the Sox were overpaying for Pedro. It's just that the Mets REALLY overpaid.

BTW, ESPN will have the Pedro scoop in 2 mins after the commercial.

Reports from MLB.com have the RED SOX backing out of negotiations after the new Mets offer. Not Pedro.

We may get Hudson now. I do not understand this whole Renteria thing? Why are we going after such a big named SS? I guess we'll be using Hanley as trade bait now.

I think the DUI and the "Nomar will need only 1-2 weeks to recover" kinda sealed his fate.