4/20 vs New York - Fenway 100th Anniversary Game

[User Name]

Yes they have some injuries right now but they shouldnt suck this bad.Whats worse is that its again playoff caliber teams!!

 

Wait, what? Wouldn't it be worse if they were losing against scrubs?

[jung]

They are not playing scrubs. You are right UN which is why it is so frustrating to me to find them not playing smart baseball. They are not going to beat these teams on talent right now and may not beat them on talent alone at any time this season.

 

So here they have a golden opportunity to play smart, play like a team which is the only way in my view it is going to win particularly fielding what is kinda' weak for a lineup against strong teams and what do they do? Go about things like business as usual in Red Sox World. "f*** the rest of ya' this is he way I approach my plate appearances, this is what I do. I am not going to work with the rest of you to burn out the starting pitcher. You take care of yourselves and I will take care of myself."

 

Never mind that with this roster they are not strong enough to generate offense without getting to bull pens early and never mind that they may not be strong enough to do that at any time this season.

 

Nobody is going to care if they have not made the post season that they had a few injuries at the start of the season. They can't just put on their uni's and go out there with their heads stuck up their asses with the roster they have right now and just chalk up another lost game. Worse than that, they may not be strong enough to do that even when Ells and CC come back. So they better learn to work together and get it done as a team.

[a700hitter]

Despite today's HR Derby, I am not that down about Buchholz. All of the HRs were solo shots. I'd rather one or two or even three solo HRs in a game than was and big innings. Five was a little bit hard to swallow but he stayed away from walks.

 

What bothers me most about this team is the bullpen. To me that is a gaping bleeding wound that will make it very difficult for this team to play consistently well. I have been worried about the pen from day 1.

[jung]

I am sorry but I just cannot get that wound up about the pen when the pen never gets the ball with a lead.

 

The starting pitchers have given up 5 home runs twice in two weeks. That is hard to do in a whole season! Their location with the FB particularly has been abysmal.

 

However I still say the the one element that has disappointed the most is the offense because this team was constructed to win games with offense....not pitching.

 

They have a golden opportunity here to learn how to win games as a team even against teams with more talent and they are squandering it away and chalking up lost game after lost game in the process. I am already getting sick and tired of seeing them drag their asses up to the plate, make a stupid, plate appearance where they accomplish nothing only to see them back on the bench laughing and grinning like a bunch of idiots oblivious to what they are even doing.

[a700hitter]

I am sorry but I just cannot get that wound up about the pen when the pen never gets the ball with a lead.

 

The starting pitchers have given up 5 home runs twice in two weeks. That is hard to do in a whole season! Their location with the FB particularly has been abysmal.

 

However I still say the the one element that has disappointed the most is the offense because this team was constructed to win games with offense....not pitching.

 

They have a golden opportunity here to learn how to win games as a team even against teams with more talent and they are squandering it away and chalking up lost game after lost game in the process. I am already getting sick and tired of seeing them drag their asses up to the plate, make a stupid, plate appearance where they accomplish nothing only to see them back on the bench laughing and grinning like a bunch of idiots oblivious to what they are even doing.

They will start getting leads. The starters will start doing better, but the bullpen has no guns, no ammo.

[jung]

Are they going to rub some genie's magic lamp and suddenly pitch better in the rotation and make better plate appearances?

 

I would agree that they could hardly do worse but they are playing with their heads stuck up their asses and I don't see any indication that they have figured out that they are not talented enough to just toss their gloves out on the field and get a win.

 

Did you see how that Rays pen pitched?

 

Atch has pitched well. Morales has pitched well having simply been left in a game where he had no business being. Aceves has pitched well since figuring out that he must pitch and not just throw in the 9th. Tazawa pitched well today. Padilla has pitched well. This is not a pen that will respond well to being called upon in the 5th and 6th inning of every game but I do not know of a single pen that will or can survive that if you throw it at them every game.

 

Melancon has been a complete bust and it took some time for Aceves to figure it out. Thomas probably has no business being there and Albers has only had one good showing so far. Other than Melancon I think they have done pretty well.

[BornToRun]

Guys are injured.

The schedules rough

People are off to slow starts

 

I implore you all to remain calm. This team has been dealt a s***** hand but we need to hang tough until people figure their s*** out and guys return from injury. It's too early to say we aren't good enough when we know damn well that the talent is here. We'll get turned around. No one can honestly think we're gonna be in the dregs of the division.

[IHATEYOU]

Despite today's HR Derby' date=' I am not that down about Buchholz. All of the HRs were solo shots. [/quote']

 

It's hard to hit five three-run homers off a pitcher.

 

Seriously, this Red Sox team is in a lot of trouble. They have the the third best rotation at best in the AL East (4th if you like the Jays rotation) and a terrible bullpen. The Red Sox have to hit a ton if they are going to have a shot. Do you disagree?

[BornToRun]

It's hard to hit five three-run homers off a pitcher.

 

Seriously, this Red Sox team is in a lot of trouble. They have the the third best rotation at best in the AL East (4th if you like the Jays rotation) and a terrible bullpen. The Red Sox have to hit a ton if they are going to have a shot. Do you disagree?

 

Yes. The bullpen will be at least middle of the pack and the rotation is gonna be one of the better ones in the AL. Lester, Beckett, and Clay when he gets his s*** together will anchor doubront and bard who have both looked quite impressive so far. I dont see how a NY rotation of CC, kuroda, nova, Hughes, and Garcia/pettite is so much better.

[SoxSport]

Smoltz said Buchholz isn't there yet with his heat, and the straight stuff he threw down the middle was easy to hit because of it. He said he should have his heat back in a couple of starts, and he'll be OK.

 

I read Cook and Ohlendorf are pitching well in Pawtucket. That's a hell of a team they've got there-- a lot more interesting than the Sox right now. They just swept a 4 game series. I think Lucchino has to get some of them up to Boston. His team looks lifeless. The core of Pedey, Papi, AdGon and Youks are surrounded by mediocrity, and the pitching staff needs a transfusion.

 

The sensible thing to do right now is to move Bard to closer, Aceves to setup. And fill the two starter spots with Cook, Ohlendorf, Padilla, Doubront, etc.

[BornToRun]

Smoltz said Buchholz isn't there yet with his heat, and the straight stuff he threw down the middle was easy to hit because of it. He said he should have his heat back in a couple of starts, and he'll be OK.

 

I read Cook and Ohlendorf are pitching well in Pawtucket. That's a hell of a team they've got there-- a lot more interesting than the Sox right now. They just swept a 4 game series. I think Lucchino has to get some of them up to Boston. His team looks lifeless. The core of Pedey, Papi, AdGon and Youks are surrounded by mediocrity, and the pitching staff needs a transfusion.

 

This also helps. We have tons of depth in the pitching staff. Are they grade A options? No but one or two have to be worth something. The offense is gonna hit, the rotation will be a strength, and we can get by with a middle of the pack pen which is what I think we will have at the very last when things settle down and fall into place. Aceves is fine, padillas been alright, morales has been good save for one horrid inning, tazawa has potential, hills on his way back, bailey we be here at some point. We can't go throwing money at random FAs every time we hit an injury or ineffectiveness bug. The bullpen looked decent until bailey went down and mark surprised us by how awful he could be. We gotta work with what we have until things get set straight. We didn't plan on getting absolutely ass raped by injuries and inconsistency but we have to work thru it. Plus, it's April 20th for the love of god. The season isn't over by a long shot.

[SoxSport]

He could be a very positive addition. He was just starting to blossom when he blew out his arm.

 

Tazawa looked better than Buchholz--for sure. Buchholz isn't ready yet.

[jung]

What....what has Salty ever done to suggest he is a "talented" catcher? Youk has gotten progressively slower each season and clearly has tried to bulk up which looks like an effort to fully turn himself into a 240-250 batting average power hitter. That seems to have backfired. The king of walks no longer generates walks. When you are getting slower and bigger each season at some point you just run out of seasons.

 

Just like we made a bunch of assumptions that have so far not worked out to well, we are assuming that Ells and CC will just come back and be fine. Maybe they will, maybe they won't. Even if they do, this team does not appear as strong as last year's team. As for those two...Ells has suffered a big joint injury, not a small joint injury. He will likely come back slowly this season. CC will come back under tremendous pressure as soon as he steps on the field. We know how well he responds to that now don't we.

 

As for playing smart and playing like a team, Agons swings at just about anything they throw up there....runners on...no runners on...does not matter. Never met a first pitch he did not like. So even when the team needs to pull together because it is not strong enough to make any headway offensively especially with these injuries without getting into bull pens there is AGons hackin' away as usual. Even Pedey made a mental error at the plate today and since he is so damn good and really about the only guy with a history here that makes you confident that he will bring it every day, every time he makes any sort of mistake it sticks out like a sore thumb. If not for his play, this team would look laughable.

 

Ross has played well or at least as well as was expected and Ortiz has been the absolute star of the show at the plate.

 

and then..... There is Baseball Genius V who has already made more mistakes from the managers perch in two weeks than you would have expected in half a season.

 

Myself this was game 1 of my 10 game Sox watch. If the black holes in this line up are still black holes by game 22-24 fully 15% of the season in, I think they will have to make some serious changes. That is about as much time as I am willing to give them.

 

Joe G gave Salty a break today bringing in that scrub pitcher in the 9th allowing Salty to get a seeing eye single. Had that been Mariano, Salty would have gone down in flames again.

 

But absolutely none of this excuses this team for playing stupid, selfish baseball. I don't see a team with enough talent even with CC and Ells to do that.

 

I can tolerate just about anything except for stupid selfish baseball. Pedey needs to get these *******s in a room and set them straight....if he knows how and can.

[SoxSport]

This also helps. We have tons of depth in the pitching staff. Are they grade A options? No but one or two have to be worth something. The offense is gonna hit' date=' the rotation will be a strength, and we can get by with a middle of the pack pen which is what I think we will have at the very last when things settle down and fall into place. Aceves is fine, padillas been alright, morales has been good save for one horrid inning, tazawa has potential, hills on his way back, bailey we be here at some point. We can't go throwing money at random FAs every time we hit an injury or ineffectiveness bug. The bullpen looked decent until bailey went down and mark surprised us by how awful he could be. We gotta work with what we have until things get set straight. We didn't plan on getting absolutely ass raped by injuries and inconsistency but we have to work thru it. Plus, it's April 20th for the love of god. The season isn't over by a long shot.[/quote']

 

In retrospect, they shouldn't have traded for Bailey--or at least made him the setup guy and moved Bard to closer. I still think they were cutting corners moving Bard to starter--figuring they could avoid signing an expensive free agent. Their thinking has been let's fix the holes without spending any money. Nice try. Too bad Bailey found his injury so early.

[jung]

Ya but it is hard to call the Bard experiment a failure at this point. It does look like they are getting a legitimate 5th starter and maybe more out of Bard. Just cannot underestimate what is happening with Bard in that starters role. In fact Doubront and Bard at 4 and 5 are looking like the plus signs in this rotation as they have every possibility of being regularly better than the 4's and 5's they will face.

 

The uncertainties are in 1, 2 and 3 in that Lester has never proven to be a legitimate 1. He certainly did not last year when that was expected of him. Beckett is likely a solid 2 but he is not better than that and Buch looks like a blend of a 3 and a 4, that is if he makes it through a season....finally.

[a700hitter]

This also helps. We have tons of depth in the pitching staff. Are they grade A options? No but one or two have to be worth something. The offense is gonna hit' date=' the rotation will be a strength, and we can get by with a middle of the pack pen which is what I think we will have at the very last when things settle down and fall into place. Aceves is fine, padillas been alright, morales has been good save for one horrid inning, tazawa has potential, hills on his way back, bailey we be here at some point. We can't go throwing money at random FAs every time we hit an injury or ineffectiveness bug. The bullpen looked decent until bailey went down and mark surprised us by how awful he could be. We gotta work with what we have until things get set straight. We didn't plan on getting absolutely ass raped by injuries and inconsistency but we have to work thru it. Plus, it's April 20th for the love of god. The season isn't over by a long shot.[/quote']I agree with most of your post with the exception of the bullpen. Without Bailey, I don't think they approach the middle of the pack. Aceves will probably be solid. Morales is talented, but I am not sure if he will be consistently reliable. Albers is a horror show. Padilla could be very key, but he has been injury prone in recent seasons. The rest are nothing special. I do think Tazawa could play a big role, but we just don't know what he is yet.

[IHATEYOU]

Yes. The bullpen will be at least middle of the pack and the rotation is gonna be one of the better ones in the AL. Lester' date=' Beckett, and Clay when he gets his s*** together will anchor doubront and bard who have both looked quite impressive so far. I dont see how a NY rotation of CC, kuroda, nova, Hughes, and Garcia/pettite is so much better.[/quote']

 

I couldn't disagree more. First of all Buchholz is terrible. He is your Phil Hughes. Good velocity and no idea where the ball is going. Trust me there are Yankee fans who believed, and some of those same idiots still believe that Hughes will amount to something more than a back of the rotation starter. The Yankees have a better rotation. I believe it isn't even close, but even if it is, the Yankee bullpen so far outperforms the Red Sox pen its not even funny. You can make the argument that the Yankees boast three relievers (Mariano, Soriano, and Robertson) who are light years better than anyone the Sox have. With the best rotation in the AL East belonging to Tampa, the Sox are looking at a dogfight for 3rd place with the Blue Jays. The Yankees have two good young pitchers under 25 in Nova and Pineda, and with a solid Sabathia and one year wonders in Pettitte and Kuroda, the Yankees are in much better shape not only this year but for years to come.

 

I said this before on Yankee boards. Carl Crawford will be your Pavano. Just for more money and more years.

[SoxFanForsyth]

I couldn't disagree more. First of all Buchholz is terrible. He is your Phil Hughes. Good velocity and no idea where the ball is going. Trust me there are Yankee fans who believed, and some of those same idiots still believe that Hughes will amount to something more than a back of the rotation starter. The Yankees have a better rotation. I believe it isn't even close, but even if it is, the Yankee bullpen so far outperforms the Red Sox pen its not even funny. You can make the argument that the Yankees boast three relievers (Mariano, Soriano, and Robertson) who are light years better than anyone the Sox have. With the best rotation in the AL East belonging to Tampa, the Sox are looking at a dogfight for 3rd place with the Blue Jays. The Yankees have two good young pitchers under 25 in Nova and Pineda, and with a solid Sabathia and one year wonders in Pettitte and Kuroda, the Yankees are in much better shape not only this year but for years to come.

 

I said this before on Yankee boards. Carl Crawford will be your Pavano. Just for more money and more years.

 

Well then. If all of the best case scenarios work out for the Yankees and all of the worst case scenarios work out for the Sox, then this would be an accurate thread.

 

We should definitely dismiss Buchholzs 255 innings of 2.90 ERA baseball prior to this year and say that he now sucks. Same thing for Crawford.

 

Oh wait....

[Station 13]

Buchholz got 3 swing and miss of 103 pitches thrown. Keep throwing those fastball and cutters without a reliable breaking ball.

[BornToRun]

In retrospect' date=' they shouldn't have traded for Bailey--or at least made him the setup guy and moved Bard to closer. I still think they were cutting corners moving Bard to starter--figuring they could avoid signing an expensive free agent. Their thinking has been let's fix the holes without spending any money. Nice try. Too bad Bailey found his injury so early.[/quote']

 

Well, in all fairness, Bard requested to be in the rotation.

[BornToRun]

Buchholz got 3 swing and miss of 103 pitches thrown. Keep throwing those fastball and cutters without a reliable breaking ball.

 

It seems like you really hate Buchholz man.

[BornToRun]

Well then. If all of the best case scenarios work out for the Yankees and all of the worst case scenarios work out for the Sox, then this would be an accurate thread.

 

We should definitely dismiss Buchholzs 255 innings of 2.90 ERA baseball prior to this year and say that he now sucks. Same thing for Crawford.

 

Oh wait....

 

Don't argue with idiots. Clay's coming off an injury and he seems to be a routine slow starter. He had a great 2010 and was good last year before he went down. I'm not very concerned about him. And with Carl, most signs point to him having a rebound year.

 

Props though, Yankee fan, you saying Clay is Phil Hughes required every last bit of my inner strength to stop from pissing all over myself with laughter.

[Station 13]

It seems like you really hate Buchholz man.

 

I don't hate him. Hate what I saw out of him. He need to work on his breaking ball otherwise everyone will teed of his fastball.

[User Name]

Well' date=' in all fairness, Bard requested to be in the rotation.[/quote']

 

It's his regular routine. He makes up his own facts and adjusts them to his opinion.