#1 WB v #4 Kilo

[yrtb]

NO MORE VOTING FOR YOURSELF. You can, however, post a message explaining why you think you should win

 

WB

 

C - Andrew Bogut

PF - Josh Smith

SF - LeBron James

SG - Manu Ginobili

PG - Darren Collison

 

C - Andrew Bogut ($11,000,000)

PF - Josh Smith ($11,700,000)

SF - LeBron James ($14,500,000)

SG - Manu Ginobili ($11,854,584)

PG - Darren Collison ($1,361,040)

 

C - JJ Hickson - ($1,528,920)

PF - Paul Millsap - ($7,600,000)

SF - Omri Casspi - ($1,254,480)

SG -Evan Turner ($4,602,720)

PG - Devin Harris - ($8,981,000)

 

C - DeAndre Jordan ($854,389)

SG - Corey Brewer ($3,703,472)

 

Kilo

 

Kilo

 

C - Al Horford/Zydrunas Ilgauskas/Marcin Gortat

PF - Pau Gasol/David West/Al Harrington

SF - Caron Butler/Carl Landry

SG - Anthony Morrow/JJ Reddick

PG - John Wall/Raymond Felton

 

C - Al Horford ($5,444,857)

PF - Pau Gasol ($16,452,000)

SF - Caron Butler ($10,561,960)

SG - Anthony Morrow ($4,000,000)

PG - John Wall ($5,144,280)

6th - David West ($8,287,500)

7th - Carl Landry ($3,000,000)

8th - Raymond Felton ($7,000,000)

BN - Zydrunas Ilgauskas ($1,352,181)

BN - JJ Reddick ($7,500,000)

BN - Al Harrington ($5,765,000)

BN - Marcin Gortat ($6,322,320)

[italstallianion]

First, I think that both teams here are very good and deserve to be in the final four. Here, we have 2 different styles of management, much like my matchup vs. Yankshater. WhiskeyBreath has the more talented team, but Kilo's team seems more balanced and versatile. I do like WhiskeyBreath's starting 5 over Kilo's because he has proven stars at spots 2,3,4,5 and Collison is a year more developed than Wall (albeit with less potential). Kilo's team, while having a very good frontcourt, has an overrated and seemingly old for his age SF, a good complimentary piece (albeit not a star) at SG, and a PG with the potential to be one of the best in the game, albeit with less experience than Collison. I'd take WhiskeyBreath at the 2 and 3 spots by a large margin, Kilo at the 4 by a small margin, a tie at the 5, and Kilo with a slight edge at the 1. Overall I'd give WhiskeyBreath the edge at the starting lineup. I'd rate WhiskeyBreath higher if he started Harris over Collison, but I'd still give Kilo the edge at the 1.

 

What really makes this decision easier is the bench. I'd take Harris (who I think should be starting) over Felton, as Harris is a complete player with defense, scoring, play making, vision, and 1 on 1 abilities. I'd also take Evan Turner over JJ Redick, which I'll admit I am biased against Redick, but I think that Turner has the talent to be more than a bench player, while I see Redick as a good 3 point option and free throw shooter, but of little other contributions. I'd give Kilo the edge at backup SF (Landry over Casspi) but I'd give WhiskeyBreath the 4 with Millsap over West, but that's because West is very soft at the PF position, especially on the defensive end. West is a good offensive piece, but I think that he can be handled by Millsap and Smith's defense, while I think that Mr. Glass West would fold trying to defend most PF's (except for Aldridge who might be the only softer starting PF in the NBA). Anyway, I'd give a slight edge to WhiskeyBreath there. For backup center, I'd give the edge to Kilo, because he has a good offense/defense set with Ilgausakas and Gortat, whereas I'm not a big fan of DeAndre Jordan and I think that Hickson is more of a PF and wouldn't adjust well to the C position. In total, I'd give Whiskeybreath the edge on the bench as well, winning the 1, 2, and 4 (slighty) spots, while Kilo takes the 3 (slightly) and the 5 spot.

 

I think that it's closer than the talent discrepency would say, but I think that WhiskeyBreath has the top team in the league for a reason, and that his team would beat Kilo's in a 7 game series.

[TheKilo]

I think the success of my team in this round, like the last round, will be because of my fromtcourt. Horford is a better player than Bogut and Gasol is the best big in the game and will eat Josh Smith for lunch on both ends of the court. Guarding Lebron is a nightmare but I think I have a solid rotation of guys to do it with.

 

I think this once again comes down to philosophy. If you think it's important to draft talent and hope they mesh, go with WB. if you believe in chemistry and how a team works together, I think my team is the better choice.

[WhiskeyBreath]

Woah, there. Horford better than Bogut? Bogut is elite defensively. Horford is good on D but not on Bogut's level(btw, the only center better than Bogut on D is Dwight Howard).

 

This is one of those match ups where because of the big height advantage for Gasol over Smith(even though he can jump out of the building) a team would move Bogut onto Gasol and Smith to guard Horford.

 

My team is elite defensively. Bogut, Smith, and LeBron are perennial All-Defensive Team players and should be in the Top 10 for Defensive player of the Year.

 

Help me understand how you know for a fact that your team has chemistry but mine doesn't.

[italstallianion]

Team Chemistry is one of those things that you can't really prove or disprove, unless you have obvious lockerroom cancers on your team, and I don't think that any of the final 4 teams have them.

[YanksHater213]

Kilo.

 

I love the way his guys mesh together. He's got the best bench in the entire league. He's got a team that's built to stop LeBron. He's got six bigs there to defend the rim. Gasol may not be the best defensively, but he plays his heart out and leaves everything on the floor. David West is one of the best players that no one talks about, and Carl Landry might be the biggest steal in this whole thing. Kilo's bench is awesome, while WBs is pretty good, it seems more like a mess of talented guys who don't complement each other very well. His balanced attack will be too much for WB's one dimensional attack.

[yrtb]

I don't get the purpose of 6 big men...only two can be on the court at the time and only 3 or 4 will actually play big minutes. Big Z and Gortat are probably going to play like 5 minutes a game apiece

 

Anyways, I completely disagree with the idea that Horford is better than Bogut, Bogut is the 2nd best center in the NBA, and is significantly better on the defensive end. Josh Smith and JJ Hickson will shut Gasol down enough, I don't even think Kilo has better big men to be honest, I would take WB's over his

 

Caron Butler is not good defensively. Carl Landry is a PF who does not have nearly the athleticism to handle LeBron. LeBron is putting up 30 a night on this team in a 7 game series

 

John Wall is the best guard on either team 3 years from now, but Collison is dynamic on the offensive end and Harris is great on both ends of the floor, he's much better than Felton IMO. Ginobili complements Collison's explosiveness well with his great shooting and D, and Evan Turner is going to be a star.

 

WB's team and honestly, I don't think it is close

 

This whole team chemistry thing IMO is basically saying, yeah, you have the better team, but I somehow know that my players are going to mesh together better. It is IMPOSSIBLE to predict chemistry without actually seeing this happen in person.

 

I vote for WB

[YanksHater213]

Okay so you're pretty much admitting that you're voting based on a Fantasy Draft as opposed to an Anti-Fantasy Draft? If so, that's stupid. I've thought the voting has been retarded the entire time, so if that's the case it makes a helluva lot of sense.

[italstallianion]

I think that the voting here has gone A LOT better than the voting in the baseball redraft. Some of that voting was retarded.

 

Besides, I think different people are building their teams and voting in different manners. It seems that you and Kilo (and even Coco and Jacoby to an extent) are very similar in your ways of thinking, building a team, and voting, and then there are other methods of accomplishing this task, like the methods that WhiskeyBreath, Yrtb, Jbay and I took. There are even other ways to handle it, like the "when in doubt, draft everyone on my favourite team" method that boston22407 and Suns did.

 

My point is, and I think what WhiskeyBreath and Ytrb are trying to say is, while teamwork and meshing are important abilities to building a team, nobody has PROOF that the players would go well together, and it really does seem like a cheap cop out when your team isn't as talented as your opponents. I'm NOT saying that this is the case with your team YH or Kilo's team, but that's what it looks like. Unless the players have played together in the past (ie Stockton and Malone, Pippen and Jordan) then there really isn't any evidence to suggest that one team's players would mesh together better than anothers, with the only exception being the presence of locker room cancers. So that argument really doesn't have much weight.

 

It also seems like a pattern that the person who brings up teamwork, is the owner of the less talented team.

[italstallianion]

I'm wondering if there's a correlation between myself, WhiskeyBreath, JBay, and Ytrb all doing the baseball draft, and Kilo, Yankshater, Coco, and Jacoby all being new to the draft and draft voting.

[Jasonbay44]

I think that the voting here has gone A LOT better than the voting in the baseball redraft. Some of that voting was retarded.

 

Besides, I think different people are building their teams and voting in different manners. It seems that you and Kilo (and even Coco and Jacoby to an extent) are very similar in your ways of thinking, building a team, and voting, and then there are other methods of accomplishing this task, like the methods that WhiskeyBreath, Yrtb, Jbay and I took. There are even other ways to handle it, like the "when in doubt, draft everyone on my favourite team" method that boston22407 and Suns did.

 

My point is, and I think what WhiskeyBreath and Ytrb are trying to say is, while teamwork and meshing are important abilities to building a team, nobody has PROOF that the players would go well together, and it really does seem like a cheap cop out when your team isn't as talented as your opponents. I'm NOT saying that this is the case with your team YH or Kilo's team, but that's what it looks like. Unless the players have played together in the past (ie Stockton and Malone, Pippen and Jordan) then there really isn't any evidence to suggest that one team's players would mesh together better than anothers, with the only exception being the presence of locker room cancers. So that argument really doesn't have much weight.

 

It also seems like a pattern that the person who brings up teamwork, is the owner of the less talented team.

 

I agree 100% with everything you just said.

 

Anyway, Im going to vote for WB.

 

I love the team Whiskeybreath put together and would honestly take his starting unit and bench over Kilo's. There is no proof that either team has better chemistry as almost none of these players have ever played together, so I don't think that is a good reason as to why Kilo's team is better. I think WB has the more talented team and would take them in a 7 game series so I am giving him my vote.

[yrtb]

Okay so you're pretty much admitting that you're voting based on a Fantasy Draft as opposed to an Anti-Fantasy Draft? If so' date=' that's stupid. I've thought the voting has been retarded the entire time, so if that's the case it makes a helluva lot of sense.[/quote']

 

In fantasy basketball, David Lee and Stephen Curry are top 10 players. Get a clue...fantasy is all based on stats, I'm not voting for every team that has a 20/10 guy to be the best team. I just think it is impossible to judge chemistry, and I think the roles on WB's team fit well together. In a playoffs series, I am also mainly about defense, and WB has dominant defensive players from the 2 to 5 players in his lineups

[yrtb]

Come on guys, other than yankshater the only teams voting are the top 5, don't stop voting just because you are eliminated

[italstallianion]

To your point Ytrb, if this was a fantasy team, RSFFL would have a top team, and defense would never be considered in voting.

[yrtb]

come on, can somebody else please vote?

[italstallianion]

You know, this would have been done if the teams can vote for themselves.

 

Anyway, WhiskeyBreath and Kilo can't vote, and ytrb, myself, jbay, and Yankshater already did vote, so that means there are only 6 or so people left that can still vote on this.

[yrtb]

Well, it would be nice if one or two of those six remaining teams would vote

[Flynnatic10]

ill get my vote in, i dont feel like retpying a paragraph that IE just erased.

[Jacoby_Ellsbury]

LeBron is the best player on either team, and a top 2 player in the game. A quick peek at recent NBA history should show you that counts for something. In three years, Evan Turner should be an allstar caliber shooting guard and an excellent second gun for LeBron, assuming Turner develops some semblance of an outside shot by then. Collison's three point stroke would be aces on a team like this, Bogut is the better center. Smith does concern me as a starting PF. If this were the mid decade Suns, okay. On a more traditional team in playoff basketball looking for a championship? I don't know. Regardless, Whiskey still has the personnel to get around this. He's got two perfectly fine PFs on his bench, and Jordan would be just fine as a backup center.

 

Kilo's team concerns me, meanwhile. Wall will be the guy in three years time, and be dominating the ball on offense. Butler is a scorer, and really is nothing special in any other facet of the game. On top of that, he's not great from 3 point range. Serviceable, but I think the events in Washington showed how useful he is in an off the ball shooting role. I like Morrow here, for obvious reasons. He is a bit short on backup backcourt players, though. Kilo's starting bigs are nice, but his bench bigs are a bit overrated. For one, only two are going to see meaningful minutes. According to his lineup, it's going to be West and Z with Landry at SF (don't know about that one). West is enormously overrated. He's a terrible rebounder at PF and has never been a particularly good defender. His only claim to fame is scoring, which in New Orleans is due to Chris Paul and the fact that he gets big minutes. Off the bench, his scoring opportunities will be cut, severely. Landry is not a SF. Z is an okay mid range shooter, decent rebounder and a crap defender. I'll ignore the others since they're apparently going to be on the end of the bench.

 

I'll take WB.

[boston22407]

WB

[italstallianion]

So it looks like WB will be in the finals (no surprise there)