Welcome to Boston, Daniel Nava

[Dojji]

yeah sure, and every bit of our discussion so far is predicated on the idea that the kid could disappear tomorrow but you have to admit he's intriguing. His minor league numbers are impeccable: This kid has ALWAYS hit. The question is whether there's a hole in his game big league scouts can exploit, and I for one am betting against it.

[jacksonianmarch]

So far, he has looked really good. But so did Shane Spencer a decade ago. The thing that makes me think Nava could stick as a big league regular is his swing. It is just beautiful

[example1]

yeah sure' date=' and every bit of our discussion so far is predicated on the idea that the kid could disappear tomorrow[/b']

 

Exactly... we aren't stupid enough to have this discussion without some context.

[Palodios]

I think it hangs entirely how the next wave of Red Sox prospects does. They will need an outfielder, a catcher, a corner infielder and two more bullpen arms. They'll fill whatever they can from within the organization, but they have 40 million for the rest.

 

The problem for Nava is that the biggest place the Sox can improve coming out of the offseason is in the outfield with two great options in Werth and Crawford. I could very easily see them having 5 outfielders, and rotating one into the DH spot, so Nava could work for a spot if he hits like he deserves it. But if they stick with 4, and pick up a DH, he could be the odd man out.

[Dojji]

So far' date=' he has looked really good. But so did Shane Spencer a decade ago. The thing that makes me think Nava could stick as a big league regular is his swing. It is just beautiful[/quote']

 

Not a good comp. Spencer's problem was he couldn't hit RHP's. Nava's a switch hitter.

[example1]

I think it hangs entirely how the next wave of Red Sox prospects does. They will need an outfielder, a catcher, a corner infielder and two more bullpen arms. They'll fill whatever they can from within the organization, but they have 40 million for the rest.

 

The problem for Nava is that the biggest place the Sox can improve coming out of the offseason is in the outfield with two great options in Werth and Crawford. I could very easily see them having 5 outfielders, and rotating one into the DH spot, so Nava could work for a spot if he hits like he deserves it. But if they stick with 4, and pick up a DH, he could be the odd man out.

 

Nava could be an ideal 4th OF. Switch hitter, can probably play LF or RF, good stick, minimal ego, high OBP. Check, check, check, check, check.

 

That said, I could see Nava's upside approaching that of Werth and Crawford without anywhere close to the cost and it is the exact type of Theo-Sox-Nation-Anxiety-Provoking move that would lead into next year with questions like "Is the Red Sox offense going to be enough with Daniel Nava as the starting OF? I don't think so."

[jacksonianmarch]

You could see Nava's worth approaching Werth or Crawford? Really? Wow. Getting ahead of ourselves a wee bit now arent we?

[yeszir]

I think Nava will be Werth a lot.

[Dojji]

You could see Nava's worth approaching Werth or Crawford? Really? Wow. Getting ahead of ourselves a wee bit now arent we?

 

"upside" not "worth," genius. There's a difference.

[Palodios]

Nava could be an ideal 4th OF. Switch hitter, can probably play LF or RF, good stick, minimal ego, high OBP. Check, check, check, check, check.

 

That said, I could see Nava's upside approaching that of Werth and Crawford without anywhere close to the cost and it is the exact type of Theo-Sox-Nation-Anxiety-Provoking move that would lead into next year with questions like "Is the Red Sox offense going to be enough with Daniel Nava as the starting OF? I don't think so."

 

The problem is that right now, Cameron is playing like a 4th outfielder. This team needs a 1st outfielder, and Crawford/Werth will be a guarantee that Nava won't be. This year, they skimped on an important offensive position and look how that turned out.

[Dojji]

It hasn't turned out yet.

[Palodios]

It hasn't turned out yet.

 

Not halfway into the season, and the team's top 4 outfielders are unavailable. I would say that counts as "turning out". There is as much a risk putting too much faith into a 37 year old as there is putting faith into a rookie.

[example1]

You could see Nava's worth approaching Werth or Crawford? Really? Wow. Getting ahead of ourselves a wee bit now arent we?

 

Yes. I'm totally ahead of myself, which is why this is a speculative discussion. Also, you clearly didn't read what I wrote. I said (or tried to say) that I could see his offensive upside (in terms of OPS, heavier on the OBP) approaching Werth or Crawford. At a fraction of the cost he would be worth a lot.

 

Do you not project Yankees players into the future? Do front offices not project into the future? We all do it, it is totally reasonable, and I'm looking at Nava and asking what happens if we project him forward with his minor league numbers.

[Youk Of The Nation]

Another solid performance by Nava. The kid just keeps holding his own.

[Dojji]

*checks*

 

yep, still good. .870 OPS , .380 OBP, lots of solidly hit line drive doubles. Pretty much the same way he's hit at every level he's played at. If he ever gets settled in enough to unleash a power swing a la 2008 age-29 Youkilis, look out.

[Palodios]

If he can hit like this till Ellsbury gets back, Hermida is getting traded.

[example1]

*checks*

 

yep, still good. .870 OPS , .380 OBP, lots of solidly hit line drive doubles. Pretty much the same way he's hit at every level he's played at. If he ever gets settled in enough to unleash a power swing a la 2008 age-29 Youkilis, look out.

 

Even if he doesn't add a lot of HRs he'll be a very valuable hitter.

 

To me, the player he is most similar to is JD Drew. He's not a pure HR hitter, he drives the ball the other way very well and has a sweet, sweet swing that looks easy. Nava has the additional benefits of being a switch-hitter and being very cheap.

 

Does anyone disagree that Daniel Nava is a better hitter than Jacoby Ellsbury at this point? Ellsbury consistently looks overwhelmed at the plate (when healthy) and that's with a few years experience. Nava looks like he was born to swing a bat.

 

Ellsbury is obviously a better fielder and much more dangerous baserunner. I just wonder if Ellsbury will eventually become expendable, especially with a number of young OF prospects coming up in the next few years.

 

How about this lineup when all returns to normal:

 

Ellsbury

Nava

Pedroia

Ortiz

Youkilis

V-Mart

Drew

Beltre

Scutaro

[italstallianion]

Even if he doesn't add a lot of HRs he'll be a very valuable hitter.

 

To me, the player he is most similar to is JD Drew. He's not a pure HR hitter, he drives the ball the other way very well and has a sweet, sweet swing that looks easy. Nava has the additional benefits of being a switch-hitter and being very cheap.

 

Does anyone disagree that Daniel Nava is a better hitter than Jacoby Ellsbury at this point? Ellsbury consistently looks overwhelmed at the plate (when healthy) and that's with a few years experience. Nava looks like he was born to swing a bat.

 

Ellsbury is obviously a better fielder and much more dangerous baserunner. I just wonder if Ellsbury will eventually become expendable, especially with a number of young OF prospects coming up in the next few years.

 

How about this lineup when all returns to normal:

 

Ellsbury

Nava

Pedroia

Ortiz

Youkilis

V-Mart

Drew

Beltre

Scutaro

 

 

 

I like the names but I'm not sure about the order. Besides, it might be 2011 by the time all of those names are healthy.

[jacksonianmarch]

Nava looks like he'll end up as a .800 or lower hitter in the bigs. He's not fast enough to man CF, he doesnt have enough speed to be a basestealer and he doesnt have the power to be a starting COF in a big market. His eye and his line drive ability will make his hay, but I think his role in Boston is a 4th OFer, but his role in Pittsburgh or Washington would be as a starter

[italstallianion]

That description screams Brandon Moss.

[example1]

Nava looks like he'll end up as a .800 or lower hitter in the bigs.

 

What makes you say this?

 

HRs aren't the only way to get SLG and he doesn't seem to have any trouble getting 2Bs.

I think his OBP can sit between .350-.385 consistently.

 

I disagree with you about the OPS potential (I'm thinking he can be .830-860). However, I do agree with you that he could have tremendous trade value. In fact, if San Diego were ever interested in moving Adrian Gonzalez then I can imagine this is one of those guys that Hoyer might like more because of his "inside knowledge" of the franchise.

[example1]

That description screams Brandon Moss.

 

Except that Moss had a career .808 OPS in the minors and Nava has a career .979 OPS in the minors.

 

I'm not usually a "watch the games" kind of guy, but Nava looks comfortable at the plate and it shows in his results. Moss never looked good at the plate, and that shows in his results as well.

[italstallianion]

Except that Moss had a career .808 OPS in the minors and Nava has a career .979 OPS in the minors.

 

I'm not usually a "watch the games" kind of guy, but Nava looks comfortable at the plate and it shows in his results. Moss never looked good at the plate, and that shows in his results as well.

 

 

 

For the record, I'm not comparing Nava to Brandon Moss, I'm just saying that Jacko's description of Nava seems to describe Brandon Moss a lot more than it describes Daniel Nava, especially considering that he was a 4th OF here, and got shipped off to Pittsburgh and was a starter.

[jacksonianmarch]

What makes you say this?

 

HRs aren't the only way to get SLG and he doesn't seem to have any trouble getting 2Bs.

I think his OBP can sit between .350-.385 consistently.

 

I disagree with you about the OPS potential (I'm thinking he can be .830-860). However, I do agree with you that he could have tremendous trade value. In fact, if San Diego were ever interested in moving Adrian Gonzalez then I can imagine this is one of those guys that Hoyer might like more because of his "inside knowledge" of the franchise.

 

He wouldnt be the center of the package though. His age works against him a little there in that he wont develop any further in terms of size or strength

[example1]

He wouldnt be the center of the package though. His age works against him a little there in that he wont develop any further in terms of size or strength

 

I agree that he wouldn't be the center of the package, but he's a lot better, more "MLB ready" and potentially more offensively versatile than a lot of offensive pieces like Anderson, Reddick or even Kalish. I'd say he's one of their top offensive trade chips at this point. In one sense that is a shot on the whole system's offense, in another sense it says a lot about Nava because those guys listed above aren't total slouches. Nava is a good and unique player.

 

His age hurts him because he shouldn't develop much more. His age helps him because he's literally in his prime and he's still as cheap as any rookie in baseball.

[diony]

63 ABs

[Dojji]

Not as important when his performance conforms to a greater sample size.

[jacksonianmarch]

That makes no sense

[Spudboy]

:blink:

[Rdsxmbnt]

still doing his thing, .312/.384/.506/.890