Roberto Alomar Misses HOF election by 8 votes

[The_Destroyah]

To me this is ********, Alomar was one of the best, I don't see how he can not be a first ballot HOFer.

[Cocos Disciples]

He'll get in eventually. I thought Dawson, Blyleven and Alomar all should have got in, but oh well.

[rhet]

Dawson and Alomar yes. But I really don't get the Blyleven love.

[bsox0407]

To me this is ********' date=' Alomar was one of the best, I don't see how he can not be a first ballot HOFer.[/quote']

 

one of the best catchers in recent time.

 

Wow brain fart i thought you were talking about Sandy.

 

Roberto is well deserving to.

[The_Destroyah]

I know he will, I just have always liked 2nd basemen being that that's where I played back in Little league and and Alomar was one of my favorites.

[Jasonbay44]

one of the best catchers in recent time.

 

Alomar was a 2nd basemen...

[bsox0407]

Alomar was a 2nd basemen...

 

Please read the edit. I had a brain fart.

[The_Destroyah]

Please read the edit. I had a brain fart.

 

happens to the best of us.

[Jasonbay44]

Please read the edit. I had a brain fart.

 

Happens to everyone.

[bsox0407]

happens to the best of us.

 

You just said Alomar and i instantly though of Sandy for some reason.

[a700hitter]

Dawson and Alomar yes. But I really don't get the Blyleven love.

Blyleven was a great pitcher for a long time. His stats compare very favorably with other HOFers of his era.

[rhet]

Blyleven was a great pitcher for a long time. His stats compare very favorably with other HOFers of his era.

 

He amassed a lot of innings and K's, and he was pretty good, never great. He made two all star teams in 22 seasons. He got Cy votes in only four of those 22 seasons. He was nothing more than a pretty good pitcher who lasted a long time.

[a700hitter]

He amassed a lot of innings and K's' date=' and he was pretty good, never great. He made two all star teams in 22 seasons. He got Cy votes in only four of those 22 seasons. He was nothing more than a pretty good pitcher who lasted a long time.[/quote']Except for 2 or 3 years, 1979 Pirates and 1987 Twins, he was on terrible teams... terrible. Those two teams mentioned were World Champions and he was an ace on the staff of those teams helping them win the Championship. His curveball was consistently the greatest that I have ever seen. It ranks with Gooden's curve in his rookie year. It was a better curve than Nolan Ryan's. He was a victim of lousy teams in small markets. His ERA and other splits were always very very good.

[a700hitter]

He amassed a lot of innings and K's' date=' and he was pretty good, never great. He made two all star teams in 22 seasons. He got Cy votes in only four of those 22 seasons. He was nothing more than a pretty good pitcher who lasted a long time.[/quote']Look at his career ERA, Hits/9, BB/9, whip, K's/9 and compare them to Hall of Famers like Phil Niekro, Jenkins, Sutton, Carlton, and Catfish Hunter and then tell me if you still think that he was just a pretty good pitcher that pitched a long time.

[italstallianion]

To me this is ********' date=' Alomar was one of the best, I don't see how he can not be a first ballot HOFer.[/quote']

 

 

 

Not as bulls*** as the 5 idiots who put in blank ballots. I mean seriously, what the f***? Those people shouldn't be allowed to vote.

[rhet]

Look at his career ERA' date=' Hits/9, BB/9, whip, K's/9 and compare them to Hall of Famers like Phil Niekro, Jenkins, Sutton, Carlton, and Catfish Hunter and then tell me if you still think that he was just a pretty good pitcher that pitched a long time.[/quote']

 

You could make a stats comparison to Niekro certainly. The others all have an edge in my opinion. But let's face it, Blyleven just wasn't the top pitcher in his league in any of his 22 years, nor was he even considered all star worthy in 20 of those 22 years. If I'm a voter, I draw the line at Blyleven. If Luis Tiant didn't get in, Bert Blyleven sure as hell doesn't deserve it.

[ORS]

I don't think he missed the HOF by 8 votes, but instead he missed, this time, by one loogy. He'll get in the next time around. The voters are very touchy about "1st ballot" inductees, and his lapse in behavior is likely the cause.

[Dipre]

IF your behavior wasn't angel-like during your entire time in the league, it's very difficult to get in on your first try. Alomar is the perfect example.

[Keeper]

He amassed a lot of innings and K's' date=' and he was pretty good, never great. He made two all star teams in 22 seasons. He got Cy votes in only four of those 22 seasons. He was nothing more than a pretty good pitcher who lasted a long time.[/quote']

 

I once heard that to be considered great you have to be good for a long time. Blyleven is a no-brainer. I also think you could make a strong case for Jim Kaat and Tommy John.

 

I wouldn't put too much stock in Alomar not getting in. As ORS said, the voters are touchy about 1st ballot. And Alomar had a 'tude problem. He'll get in for sure next time around.

[26 to 6]

I agree Alomar got snubbed, but I'm not too upset about him not getting in on the first ballot. He'll get in next year which is fine. Blyleven needs to be elected already though. He's running out of time and is very deserving, IMO.

[rhet]

Being just pretty good 22 years is not enough to qualify for the HOF. I'm glad the voters haven't lowered their standards that far. Yet.

[a700hitter]

You could make a stats comparison to Niekro certainly. The others all have an edge in my opinion. But let's face it' date=' Blyleven just wasn't the top pitcher in his league in any of his 22 years, nor was he even considered all star worthy in 20 of those 22 years. If I'm a voter, I draw the line at Blyleven. If Luis Tiant didn't get in, Bert Blyleven sure as hell doesn't deserve it.[/quote']I don't know what numbers you are looking at, but his numbers for ERA, WHIP, Hits/9, K's/9 and K's to Walk ratio are all there with HOFers Phil Niekro, Jenkins, Sutton, Carlton, and Catfish Hunter. Also, it should be taken into account that those pitchers pitched for several years with the higher mound (that wasn't lowered until 1969), and pitched more years before the DH than Blyleven who pitched most of his career in a DH league. His career ERA is better than Niekro's and Jenkins. It's only .05 behind Sutton who pitched three quarters of his career in the NL and .09 behind Carlton who pitched virtually his entire career in the NL. Pitching 19 of 22 years in the AL (16 of those post DH) would account for more than that difference. He was an outstanding pitcher who suffered by playing almost his entire career in small markets with little publicity for under.500 teams. If you didn't see him pitch, you can't understand how good he was. If you are going to judge him solely on the numbers, then you need to put his numbers in the proper context and compare them to the HOFers of his generation. His numbers compare quite favorably with those HOFers.

[rician blast]

Is it just me or does anyone else not care in the slightest if any of these guys ever make it?

[rhet]

You make some good points about the mound and the DH that make his comparison a bit better. However, I did see him pitch. And if I ever bring my son to Cooperstown and after seeing Blyleven's plaque, he says to me... "Dad, did you actually see Bert Blyleven pitch? Wasn't he awesome?", I'm just going to have to tell him he was above average for a long time. That he was one of the 20 best pitchers in baseball for two decades. And that he never did anything memorable.

 

Then I'll go to the next section and tell him about the great Randy Johnson, the dazzling Pedro Martinez and the amazing Greg Maddux.

[Dipre]

You make some good points about the mound and the DH that make his comparison a bit better. However, I did see him pitch. And if I ever bring my son to Cooperstown and after seeing Blyleven's plaque, he says to me... "Dad, did you actually see Bert Blyleven pitch? Wasn't he awesome?", I'm just going to have to tell him he was above average for a long time. That he was one of the 20 best pitchers in baseball for two decades. And that he never did anything memorable.

 

Then I'll go to the next section and tell him about the great Randy Johnson, the dazzling Pedro Martinez and the amazing Greg Maddux.

 

Honest question, seeing as i'm much younger than you guys:

 

Would you say the same thing about Blyleven had he won 300+ games instead of 287?

 

I didn't see him pitch, so it's simply curiosity.

[rhet]

Honest question, seeing as i'm much younger than you guys:

 

Would you say the same thing about Blyleven had he won 300+ games instead of 287?

 

I didn't see him pitch, so it's simply curiosity.

 

I think I would. Some of the guys he's being compared to here weren't all that great either.

[riverside sluggers]

Blyleven was a great pitcher for a long time. His stats compare very favorably with other HOFers of his era.

 

He finished 5 votes shy.... just so happened there were 5 blank ballots:thumbdown

 

And who the #$%^ gave David Segui a vote?

 

1456 games, 1432 hits, 139 homeruns, 17 SBs. His last 4 seasons he played a total of 193 games

[a700hitter]

Is it just me or does anyone else not care in the slightest if any of these guys ever make it?

It's probably not just you. My wife doesn't care either, but she doesn't care about the Hot Stove Season either, so what's your point?

[a700hitter]

I think I would. Some of the guys he's being compared to here weren't all that great either.

So then you don't think 300 game winners like Sutton or Niekro belong? The problem is that they are already in as are Jenkins and Catfish Hunter among others. These were Blyleven's peers for part of his career. He should be compared to them. If they are in, he should be in.

[Emmz]

Bert Blyleven was an elite pitcher for many years, how he isn't in the hall of fame is beyond me. He's every bit the pitcher Phil Niekro was. 3,700 K's and near-300 wins. If he has the 300, he's be in easily, and long ago. Look at his run from 1970-1978. His highest ERA was in his rookie year, '70, at 3.18 in that span. From 71-77 he had a run of no ERA's over 3. That's pretty impressive. How he's not in the HOF already is a travesty. They're snubbing one of the best pitchers of the 70's and 80's.