ARod tested positive

[BoSox21]

I'm nearly done with this sport. Everytime you think the game is moving past steroids, a new and sad chapter begins.

 

I hope that all the names are published very soon.

 

The game has moved past steroids but it doesn't stop revelations of that past becoming known

[26 to 6]

Agreed, the admission really is an insult to our collective intelligence.

 

Has Anyone listened to WFAN? Mike Francesca is killing him and he's right..this was a huge opportunity for ARod to come clean and not make any excuses but he peppered his statement with comments that are very hard to believe. He did himself, MLB and the fans a tremendous disservice and it all goes to show that these guys can't get beyond their own pathetic shortcomings. Even Pettitte has largely been forgiven despite that he told half-truths each time he was pressed a little bit more.

 

PC you are right, the absolute best thing to do is spill it and make no excuses, leave no holes in your statements, etc. but these guys are dreadfully unable to see that.

Mike was right to kill him today. I didnt hear much of it today, only about 30-40 mins, including the spot with Al Leiter, but I'm so sick of hearing about it I couldnt bear any more than that.

 

Also, I wanted to point out an interestign point that Al Leiter made. There's a misconception that 104 players (including A-Rod) tested poitive in the 2003 survey testing. That's not in fact true. Most players were given multiple tests throughout the year and it's actually 104 positive SAMPLES. So a lot of them can be the same player testing positive 2 or 3 times. We would need to see the list of names to know for sure, but I figured I would just throw that out there. I found that interesting.

[26 to 6]

The game has moved past steroids but it doesn't stop revelations of that past becoming known

That would be the optimum goal. That was sort of the purpose of the Mitchell Report, to provide closure. Everyone should have known that having the 2003 results still under wraps would only lead to a situation like this at some point. They need to release every known name so everyone can move on and put this to rest.

[BoSox21]

yea but the problem with the Mitchell Report is that so many people refused to cooperate that there's no way it could be the last chapter in the steroid investigation

 

All the names will come out eventually but it will take years and years. Some names will leak out, some guys will confess after they've retired to sell some books, some guys' personal trainers will speak, etc.

[Dipre]

yea but the problem with the Mitchell Report is that so many people refused to cooperate that there's no way it could be the last chapter in the steroid investigation

 

All the names will come out eventually but it will take years and years. Some names will leak out, some guys will confess after they've retired to sell some books, some guys' personal trainers will speak, etc.

 

I don't think all the names will come out, but most of them will, and i think we might, after all of our suspicions, be surprised about SOME of the names that will appear as past or current steroid users.

[rician blast]

The game has moved past steroids but it doesn't stop revelations of that past becoming known

 

 

How have they moved past steroids? They implemented a PED policy which is still turning up new abusers and which doesn't test for HGH, which any realist knows many players are using.

 

IMO, they're not even close to moving past the PED issue.

[BSN07]

Anyone listen Bob Knight on Mike and Mike this morning? He had an interesting view. He was basically saying who decides what is a PED? In all fairness Gatorade can be considered a PED, or anything with electrolytes in it. I know theres a huge difference between gatorade and roids, but hopefully you can see the underlying point. I mean Mike Schmidt has admitted to using greenies. It was a common practice for them to be waiting for Football players in there lockers before games, to help get them up. I mean Red Bull for crying out loud is a PED.

 

 

We just need to get over comparing players from different generations. Truth is each generation has had more advantages then the one previous, we just insist on always trying to compare them on a level playing field, when in truth that's just not reasonable. Babe Ruth couldn't sniff the majors today, the sooner we all understand this, the sooner the game can move on and enjoy what's on the filed now.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Players are always going to be looking for an edge plain and simple, they always have, they always will.

[riverside sluggers]

http://www.nypost.com/seven/02112009/sports/yankees/report__3_say_orza_tipped_off_rodriguez_154576.htm

 

Report, 3 say Orza tipped off A-Rod in Sept 2004, while he was with the Yankees, about an upcoming drug test. There was concern that he was still on steroids

[TheKilo]

http://www.nypost.com/seven/02112009/sports/yankees/report__3_say_orza_tipped_off_rodriguez_154576.htm

 

Report, 3 say Orza tipped off A-Rod in Sept 2004, while he was with the Yankees, about an upcoming drug test. There was concern that he was still on steroids

 

How is this new? It's in the first post of the thread!

[rician blast]

From the article posted above:

 

"Alex used to tell me negative things about other players around the league who were suspected [of drug use]," Hicks told SI on Monday. "So it's ... I feel very betrayed."

 

This is important for a couple of reasons.

 

(1) If true, ARod broke the "code" and if word gets out to MLB players regarding WHO Rodriguez was bashing, there could be some significant fallout between he and those players.

 

(2) If this can get some legs with the media and grab the attention of many MLB players, perhaps other players who know more about ARod's use than he's told us will leak additional details of ARod's own PED history...a little payback perhaps.

 

Not only is ARod a cheater and a liar, he's a hypocrite and a backstabber too. What a douchebag.

[BSN07]

http://www.nypost.com/seven/02112009/sports/yankees/report__3_say_orza_tipped_off_rodriguez_154576.htm

 

Report, 3 say Orza tipped off A-Rod in Sept 2004, while he was with the Yankees, about an upcoming drug test. There was concern that he was still on steroids

 

:shock:....Not really.....

[BoSox21]

How have they moved past steroids? They implemented a PED policy which is still turning up new abusers and which doesn't test for HGH, which any realist knows many players are using.

 

IMO, they're not even close to moving past the PED issue.

 

I didn't say anything about the game being past HGH or PEDs in general cause I think that's still a major problem but I don't think steroid use is nearly as rampant as it used to be, in part because it's become obsolete and in part because of the drug testing.

 

But sports in general has a PED problem and the only reason baseball is in the spotlight is because there is no sport whose records are as treasured as baseball's and the biggest offenders are knocking down baseball's treasured records.

[BSN07]

From the article posted above:

 

"Alex used to tell me negative things about other players around the league who were suspected [of drug use]," Hicks told SI on Monday. "So it's ... I feel very betrayed."

 

This is important for a couple of reasons.

 

(1) If true, ARod broke the "code" and if word gets out to MLB players regarding WHO Rodriguez was bashing, there could be some significant fallout between he and those players.

 

(2) If this can get some legs with the media and grab the attention of many MLB players, perhaps other players who know more about ARod's use than he's told us will leak additional details of ARod's own PED history...a little payback perhaps.

 

Not only is ARod a cheater and a liar, he's a hypocrite and a backstabber too. What a douchebag.

 

Arod's guilty of protecting his own ass, which makes him all those other things you listed.

 

 

But I'm sure there is plenty of other douchebags waiting in the shadows to see if there outed.

[TheKilo]

Tom Hicks is an idiot.

[BSN07]

I didn't say anything about the game being past HGH or PEDs in general cause I think that's still a major problem but I don't think steroid use is nearly as rampant as it used to be, in part because it's become obsolete and in part because of the drug testing.

 

But sports in general has a PED problem and the only reason baseball is in the spotlight is because there is no sport whose records are as treasured as baseball's and the biggest offenders are knocking down baseball's treasured records.

 

Hit the nail on the head. The only reason this is such a big issue is because of the records. Which is honestly kind of dumb. I mean there numbers, that's it, records for a kids game, played by adults.

[rician blast]

Tom Hicks is an idiot.

 

 

That may be true, but IMO he's thrown something out there, deliberately, for other team's, for players and for the media to now run with.

 

You know someone in the media is going to now try and run with the comments and find out who ARod was ratting on...and if they can turn anything up, what kind of support will ARod get from his MLB brethren then?

[BSN07]

That may be true, but IMO he's thrown something out there, deliberately, for other team's, for players and for the media to now run with.

 

You know someone in the media is going to now try and run with the comments and find out who ARod was ratting on...and if they can turn anything up, what kind of support will ARod get from his MLB brethren then?

 

Not sure. I think if players start finger pointing, they'll be opening a pandora's box. I think the union knows this, so I'm sure they will express that they feel like it would be best for everyone to stay quiet and not get caught up in this bee's nest.

[BoSox21]

Hicks is just launching a pre-emptive strike against all the criticism that would have eventually come his way seeing as how so many guys who have already been outed played for his organization

[BSN07]

Hicks is just launching a pre-emptive strike against all the criticism that would have eventually come his way seeing as how so many guys who have already been outed played for his organization

 

Agreed. Every controversy needs a whistle blower, who's calling out everyone else to protect his own back side.

[TheKilo]

http://joeposnanski.com/JoeBlog/2009/02/10/a-something-part-ii/

 

Think about this. Let’s play a simulation game. Put yourself in the Alex Rodriguez war room. The steroid story breaks. You’ve got to minimize the damage on this. How would you do it? You could deny … but it’s true. And denying the truth — especially truth that is out there — is bad, bad PR.

 

You could tell him to come clean, and reveal all sorts of facts that are not already out there.

 

OR … you could come up with a theme. A campaign. Something for people to believe in. I’m going to sound exceedingly cynical here — and I’m not a cynical person — but I honestly don’t see how anyone could have watched that absurd A-Rod performance without having all sorts of cynical feelings. Imagine the three guys in the war room batting it out:

 

So, what’s the pitch? Do we say that this was a one-time thing?

 

No. Won’t fly. It worked for Pettitte, but not this time.

 

So what do we have?

 

How about A-Rod as victim?

 

Hmm. Has promise.

 

But how do you make a victim out of the man with the biggest contract in baseball history?

 

Tough one. Tough, tough one.

 

Unless …

 

Maybe it was the CONTRACT that made him the victim.

 

You mean?

 

Yes. He was trapped by the contract. He felt this deep sense of pressure, expectation, he had so much he had to live up to. That’s why he turned to steroids.

 

So he started in 2001.

 

Exactly. He started right after the contract.

 

Not bad. Nobody cares about his Texas time anyway.

 

Think about this. It’s hot in Texas. He had a lot to live up to. He wanted to be thought of as one of the greatest ever. Yadda yadda yadda.

 

Plus it was a steroid circus back then.

 

And he was young and naive?

 

Absolutely. Young and naive and under immense pressure.

 

OK, so when did he stop?

 

Well, he had to stop in 2003. We can’t have this leaking over to the Yankees.

 

Why would he stop in 2003?

 

Good question. He had an awakening.

 

How?

 

He hurt his neck. Remember? Had to miss a couple of weeks of spring training.

 

The neck thing scared him straight?

 

Exactly. He was lying in bed during spring training and had this moment of inspiration.

 

Yes. That could play.

 

Also have him mention GNC a couple of times to confuse people.

[Keeper]

Babe Ruth couldn't sniff the majors today

 

Pure speculation. Besides, didn't you just say we should stop comparing players from different generations...

[BSN07]

Pure speculation. Besides' date=' didn't you just say we should stop comparing players from different generations...[/quote']

 

Yes, The reason to stop comparing them is because Ruth couldn't sniff the majors.

 

 

Of course it's speculation. But if your reasonable in anyway this shouldn't be that hard to consider. Most guys that lived on beer and hot dogs couldn't play at an elite level in today's game.

[Keeper]

:thumbdown Most guys. Babe Ruth isn't "most guys." I'm sorry, but this is retarded. Ruth wouldn't dominate like he did in his day, but you can't tell me with a straight face that Jerry Hairston Jr. is more talented than Babe Ruth. Mickey Mantle didn't take care of himself. Dick Allen didn't take care of himself. Guess they're obsolete as well. For Christ's sake, look at David Wells or C.C. Sabathia or Cecil Fielder.

[BSN07]

:thumbdown Most guys. Babe Ruth isn't "most guys." I'm sorry' date=' but this is retarded. Ruth wouldn't dominate like he did in his day, but you can't tell me with a straight face that Jerry Hairston Jr. is more talented than Babe Ruth. Mickey Mantle didn't take care of himself. Dick Allen didn't take care of himself. Guess they're obsolete as well. For Christ's sake, look at David Wells or C.C. Sabathia or Cecil Fielder.[/quote']

 

I wouldn't have a problem saying Harriston is a better athlete over Ruth. To argue otherwise is dumb. David Wells, CC and Fielder all had some sort of training regiment, there bodies might not indicate as much, but I bet you anything they put a lot more work into their bodies the Ruth ever even thought of.

 

 

I'm not saying these guys weren't great in their days. But to think they could compete with todays athletes is absurd. How hard of fastballs where they throwing back in the day? How many different pitches did they see compared to today? How many Black pitchers did Ruth face?

 

Maybe you need to see it in terms of other sports, anyone know the avg 40 yard dash for guys in the 20's and 30's? How about the 100M, Usain Bolt 9.69(current WR), in 1912 it was 10.6(almost a full second, might not sound like alot but its huge), 1921 10.4, 1930 it was 10.2 so on and so forth.

 

I'm just saying Athletes are better trained, have more knowledge, more money, significantly more advantages to players of previous generations.

 

 

You wouldn't say the US military of WWII would have any chance against the military of today would you?

[TheKilo]

I wouldn't have a problem saying Harriston is a better athlete over Ruth. To argue otherwise is dumb. David Wells, CC and Fielder all had some sort of training regiment, there bodies might not indicate as much, but I bet you anything they put a lot more work into their bodies the Ruth ever even thought of.

 

 

I'm not saying these guys weren't great in their days. But to think they could compete with todays athletes is absurd. How hard of fastballs where they throwing back in the day? How many different pitches did they see compared to today? How many Black pitchers did Ruth face?

 

Maybe you need to see it in terms of other sports, anyone know the avg 40 yard dash for guys in the 20's and 30's? How about the 100M, Usain Bolt 9.69(current WR), in 1912 it was 10.6(almost a full second, might not sound like alot but its huge), 1921 10.4, 1930 it was 10.2 so on and so forth.

 

I'm just saying Athletes are better trained, have more knowledge, more money, significantly more advantages to players of previous generations.

 

 

You wouldn't say the US military of WWII would have any chance against the military of today would you?

 

Given the changes in military technology, probably not. But that's a pretty awful example.

[rician blast]

I'm just saying Athletes are better trained, have more knowledge, more money, significantly more advantages to players of previous generations.

 

 

Plus more supplements and the occasional PED as well.

[bobjenz]

A-Rod is a douche that is clear.

[26 to 6]

A-Rod is a douche that is clear.

Great post. Thanks for the insight.

[TedWilliams101]

I think he went wrong when he responded to the question "So you lied to Katie Cuoric". "I was lying to myself, even then. How could I be honest with Katie and everyone when I wasn't even being honest with myself?". I almost vomited when he said that. Peter Gammons should have ripped him after saying that.

[26 to 6]

He went wrong a lot of places in that interview, including that question. Aside from the first two minutes of the interview where he said "yes, I did it" the whole thing was ridiculous. Made me sick, especially having to see it 300 times on SportsCenter within a 24 hour period.