Ortiz: "Manny had to Leave"

[a700hitter]

Sure you can. You deal only in absolutes' date=' Gom, so this won't make much sense to you, but there is a line that shouldn't be crossed with the honesty. That line is the threshold to the clubhouse door. Anything that could impact team chemistry, anything that could result in a clubhouse divide, should not come out to the media. Want to be honest about how much you hate (or like) the rival? Have at it. Want to let us know what a scumbag (or unfair scapegoat) a guy at the center of a leaguewide scandal is? We're all ears. But when an athlete crosses the line, he's stupid. The comment that they "probably" win with Manny isn't an innocuous bit of honesty. Manny Ramirez replaces only one player on that roster, Jason Bay. Does this comment help or hurt the relationship between Jason Bay and David Ortiz?[/quote']I think we tend to really over analyze comments by players. Bay knows that he is not Manny. Very few in the history of the game have been as good as Manny. I don't think there will be an Ortiz/Bay rift.

[BoSox21]

Maybe I didn't make myself clear. The fans...you guys...are the hypocrites. You want players to be honest and come clean' date=' and when they do, you guys rip them and [b']say they should shut up[/b]. Can't have it both ways.

 

I dont think anyone is saying they should shut up but just cause theyre honest, doesnt mean theyre immune to criticism

 

Rafael Palmeiro and Jason Giambi both took steroids. One lied about it and one was truthful about it, both are still ****bags for doing it IMO

[TheKilo]

I think we tend to really over analyze comments by players. Bay knows that he is not Manny. Very few in the history of the game have been as good as Manny. I don't think there will be an Ortiz/Bay rift.

 

While this is true, if making these feeling known to be public knowledge doesn't do any of the parties any good - then the comments probably were better left private.

[Dipre]

IMHO, he leaves the "We might have won with Manny line", and it's a perfectly good statement that doesn't harm anyone.

 

He simply peed outside the toilet with that last statement, but i think it's just being taken too seriously, people.

[a700hitter]

While this is true' date=' if making these feeling known to be public knowledge doesn't do any of the parties any good - then the comments probably were better left private.[/quote']These guys have mikes in front of their faces all the time. They get asked the same questions over and over. This Ortiz statement has probably gone unnoticed by everyone except a few reporters and people on forums. Was it better left unsaid. Most of what they are asked and their answers have no possibility of of doing any one any good, so by your standards, they should never say anything.

[Gom]

How is it being hypocritical when the comments by said athlete are not productive in the least? We don't have the right to be honest with our opinions on what they have to say? Can't have it both ways.

 

FTR, I think the way Ortiz handled this scenario is 100000000x better than the way Schilling handled it.

 

You guys...and I'm not pointing fingers specifically, just in general...you want players to be upfront and honest, and when they say something you don't like, you kill them for it. That's what I mean about you guys being hypocritical. Either expect them to toe the line, or to throw caution to the wind. You want them just to say what they are supposed to say? What's the point then?

 

I like how both of them, Ortiz and Schilling came out and voiced their opinions. They had the fortitude to come out and say what they think. Kudos to both of them.

 

Sure you can. You deal only in absolutes' date=' Gom, so this won't make much sense to you, but there is a line that shouldn't be crossed with the honesty. That line is the threshold to the clubhouse door. Anything that could impact team chemistry, anything that could result in a clubhouse divide, should not come out to the media. Want to be honest about how much you hate (or like) the rival? Have at it. Want to let us know what a scumbag (or unfair scapegoat) a guy at the center of a leaguewide scandal is? We're all ears. But when an athlete crosses the line, he's stupid. The comment that they "probably" win with Manny isn't an innocuous bit of honesty. Manny Ramirez replaces only one player on that roster, Jason Bay. Does this comment help or hurt the relationship between Jason Bay and David Ortiz?[/quote']

I don't deal in absolutes as much as you think, but I agree and disagree with you at the same time. I understand the need for team chemistry. I also realize a person's right to say what he wants. I also commend honesty. Now...all three of these things are not in concert very often, if ever. So a player decides what he says according to his view on morality, camaraderie, etc.

 

Schilling came out and tore Manny a new one. Good for him. Ortiz came out and said if they had Manny, they probably win the World Series. Good for him. Opposing views, but both should be valued and commended because they were honest.

 

I don't think Bay thinks he's as good as Manny. It wasn't a knock on Bay, just an acknowledgement that as a hitter, Manny is in a different stratosphere than Bay, and most players. Ortiz acknowledges that it was time for Manny to go, but that the team would have had a better chance winning the World Series with him. I couldn't agree more with what he says. I think Manny wanted out, and it was time for him to go, but I think if there was a way to get him to stay, you would have won back-to-back World Championships.

 

I think that you overestimate the value of his comments on his ability to be a good teammate of Bay.

 

My personal feelings...come out and say what you think and feel as a player. If they did that more often, things would be more interesting and honest, and baseball would be better off because of it.

 

Let me go off on a slight tangent. Lets assume that 15% of players cheat...steroids, amphetamines, etc. You know..if the other 85% came out and said "I'm tired of my hard work being looked at with skepticism and to have to play against players who cheat, and I want the Players Union to create a working drug testing program" you know what would happen? The game would get cleaned up. However, the players, the managers, the owners...they all say what they are "supposed" to say instead of what they "should" say.

 

That's why I like it when Hank speaks. Whether you like what he says or not is irrelevant. It's the fact that he comes out and says it. Good for him. People fail to realize that it was him, a baseball novice, who was right on Santana, and it was his "expert" GM Cashman, who was 100% wrong and had his youth movement completely blow up in his face. The funny thing, the Yankees are poised to spend more money this off-season than any team in baseball history, mainly because of how the "expert" GM Cashman f***ed up.

 

I like it when people come out and speak the truth. If it hurts, so be it. I don't believe in absolutes ORS, but if I had to choose between 100% honest and 100% company line, I go with honest.