Sign These Free Agents?

[TheKilo]

Well, he doesn't throw runners out anymore.

[CrespoBlows]

Varitek has to be re-signed.

 

I'd go two years, $14 million. Then, go hard after Mauer.

[CrespoBlows]

Because the average is worth far more than the way he handles our pitching staff and his effectiveness behind the plate. Right?

 

I don't see it.

 

Varitek's CERA was dreadfully bad in 2005, and 2006. http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/players/stats?playerId=3760&context=fielding

 

In 2007, and 2008, it's way down. I wonder why that is.

[Dojji]

I'd go two years' date=' $14 million. Then, go hard after Mauer.[/quote']

 

 

Yeah, because the Twins are going to let Mauer walk. You know well as I do that if there's a single Minnesota Twin who will be in Minnesota past his arbitration it's Joe Mauer.

 

I'd go for Bryan Anderson of the Cardinals. Not much power but great OBP skills and a very nice K/BB ratio. St. Louis needs everything right now so I'm pretty sure we could work a deal.

 

http://www.thebaseballcube.com/players/A/Bryan-Anderson-1.shtml

[Jacoby_Ellsbury]

Hmm was everyone on vacation this time two years ago? When Varitek was lost and the entire pitching staff, no the entire TEAM, was in disarray because Varitek is the leader and captain?

[schillingouttheks]

The team was in disarray because it was killed by injuries. Not because Tek is the captain.

[BoSox21]

to give you guys an idea of the injuries at the end of 2006, here's the lineup from the August 28th, 2006 game

 

C Crisp CF

A Cora SS

M Loretta DH

K Youkilis LF

E Hinske RF

M Lowell 3B

J Lopez C

C Pena 1B

D Pedroia 2B

[Jacoby_Ellsbury]

The team was in disarray because it was killed by injuries. Not because Tek is the captain.

 

http://boston.redsox.mlb.com/stats/historical/player_stats.jsp?c_id=bos&baseballScope=BOS&teamPosCode=all&statType=2&sitSplit=8&venueID=&timeFrame=1&timeSubFrame=2006&Submit=Submit

 

 

All that was because of injuries to 2/3 of our position players? Or was it the lack of Varitek's leadership behind the plate due to injury that forced Mirabelli and Javy Lopez behind the plate to handle our pitchers and call their games to blame for the fact that our pitching was a disgrace in August, 2006? You tell me.

[schillingouttheks]

http://boston.redsox.mlb.com/stats/historical/player_stats.jsp?c_id=bos&baseballScope=BOS&teamPosCode=all&statType=2&sitSplit=8&venueID=&timeFrame=1&timeSubFrame=2006&Submit=Submit

 

 

All that was because of injuries to 2/3 of our position players? Or was it the lack of Varitek's leadership behind the plate due to injury that forced Mirabelli and Javy Lopez behind the plate to handle our pitchers and call their games to blame for the fact that our pitching was a disgrace in August, 2006? You tell me.

 

I'm of the mindset that most catchers can call a pretty decent game. I don't doubt that Tek is better in that area, but I don't believe that it's enough to justify overpaying for him and his abysmal bat.

 

I also won't take 2006 Schilling, Beckett, Lester, and Jason Johnson seriously. They all had their own huge issues over that entire season, never mind just August. David Wells seems to have done pretty well, eh? Besides, saying that Jason Johnson sucked because Tek wasn't the catcher is, itself, laughable at best.

[Jacoby_Ellsbury]

I agree JJ doesn't matter at all. Lose him.

 

Schilling had a pretty good year in 2006 IIRC. 15-7, 3's ERA, something like that. What was his issue? Beckett didn't have a good year by any means, but it all culminated when Varitek went down. I think you're severely underestimating Varitek's effect on our pitchers. His presence behind the plate is huge for them. It's a comfort thing. BTW yes, Varitek is far ahead of (most of) the rest of baseball in calling games. If it wasn't evident to people during that period in '06, I guess it won't be evident to you guys at all.

[schillingouttheks]

I agree JJ doesn't matter at all. Lose him.

 

Schilling had a pretty good year in 2006 IIRC. 15-7, 3's ERA, something like that. What was his issue? Beckett didn't have a good year by any means, but it all culminated when Varitek went down. I think you're severely underestimating Varitek's effect on our pitchers. His presence behind the plate is huge for them. It's a comfort thing. BTW yes, Varitek is far ahead of (most of) the rest of baseball in calling games. If it wasn't evident to people during that period in '06, I guess it won't be evident to you guys at all.

 

Schilling's problem was that he got tired down the stretch. In '05 he was being used as the team's closer during the middle of the year after destroying his ankle and rehabbing for the sake of 2004. He hadn't been pitching off the mound consistently since 2 years prior, and with his increasing age, I believe arm fatigue was a big deal and explanation for his August performance.

 

It's not that it isn't evident. I understand that, and agree that he's one of the best at calling a game. My concern is that I think you are using it as a reason to justify keeping Varitek around despite some other huge flaws. He can't hit consistently, his bat speed is slower than a grandmother driving, and he doesn't throw out base runners anymore. I think those outweigh the reasons for him to stick around. That being said, as long as he isn't overpaid, I wouldn't have a problem keeping him around. I also don't think that he needs to be back.

[Dojji]

to give you guys an idea of the injuries at the end of 2006, here's the lineup from the August 28th, 2006 game

 

C Crisp CF

A Cora SS

M Loretta DH

K Youkilis LF

E Hinske RF

M Lowell 3B

J Lopez C

C Pena 1B

D Pedroia 2B

 

And who can forget the sterling rotation of Josh Beckett, Kyle Snyder, Kason Gabbard, Julian Tavarez and Kevin Jarvis?

[Dojji]

I agree JJ doesn't matter at all. Lose him.

 

Schilling had a pretty good year in 2006 IIRC. 15-7, 3's ERA, something like that. What was his issue? Beckett didn't have a good year by any means, but it all culminated when Varitek went down. I think you're severely underestimating Varitek's effect on our pitchers. His presence behind the plate is huge for them. It's a comfort thing. BTW yes, Varitek is far ahead of (most of) the rest of baseball in calling games. If it wasn't evident to people during that period in '06, I guess it won't be evident to you guys at all.

 

Actually, you wanna know something funny? As a team the 2006 Sox even at their worst were a .500 ballclub or so with Doug Mirabelli catching. The problem there wasn't so much the absence of Tek as it was the presence of the corpse of Javy Lopez (the catcher, not the refreshingly adequate lefty)

 

Getting .500 ball from your backup catcher is fine, and I really doubt we're going to pick up anyone who has the defensive issues Lopez had, so I don't see the problem. In all likelihood the guy who eventually replaces Tek, the FO is going to be careful doesn't represent that much of a step down from the vaunted staff-handling skills.

[CrespoBlows]

Yeah, because the Twins are going to let Mauer walk. You know well as I do that if there's a single Minnesota Twin who will be in Minnesota past his arbitration it's Joe Mauer.

 

I'd go for Bryan Anderson of the Cardinals. Not much power but great OBP skills and a very nice K/BB ratio. St. Louis needs everything right now so I'm pretty sure we could work a deal.

 

http://www.thebaseballcube.com/players/A/Bryan-Anderson-1.shtml

 

Mauer is going to get a massive contract. He'll be the best catcher in baseball, and he'll still be in his prime. Why wouldn't you test the FA market?

 

I don't think Minnesota pays him the $16-18 million, he'll probably fetch.

[CrespoBlows]

I agree JJ doesn't matter at all. Lose him.

 

Schilling had a pretty good year in 2006 IIRC. 15-7, 3's ERA, something like that. What was his issue? Beckett didn't have a good year by any means, but it all culminated when Varitek went down. I think you're severely underestimating Varitek's effect on our pitchers. His presence behind the plate is huge for them. It's a comfort thing. BTW yes, Varitek is far ahead of (most of) the rest of baseball in calling games. If it wasn't evident to people during that period in '06, I guess it won't be evident to you guys at all.

 

Correlation does not always equal causation.

[das11209]

I agree JJ doesn't matter at all. Lose him.

 

Schilling had a pretty good year in 2006 IIRC. 15-7, 3's ERA, something like that. What was his issue? Beckett didn't have a good year by any means, but it all culminated when Varitek went down. I think you're severely underestimating Varitek's effect on our pitchers. His presence behind the plate is huge for them. It's a comfort thing. BTW yes, Varitek is far ahead of (most of) the rest of baseball in calling games. If it wasn't evident to people during that period in '06, I guess it won't be evident to you guys at all.

 

That was 2 years back - why you live in the past? Apart from being bad in all departments in the game - his game calling sucks in 2008. I will not sign him unless it is free.

 

Let me try to be Varitek. 0-2 count - give me that eye high fastball. Just because I strike out in that pitch - so all MLB hitters also will.

 

Edit - He gets so much credit that he develops young pitchers. Why not credit him for Buchholz,Hansen, Meridith, Delcarman, DiNardo also? I can go on and on - but game calling is the most overrated skill (obviously it is intangible). Like ML pitchers need a baby-sitter everytime they go on the mound. Give me a catcher with good offensive and defensive skills with good arm - I will take him over any game-caller.

[BoSox21]

Varitek calls spots, what the hell is he supposed to do if Delcarmen, Buchholz and Hansen miss their spots by 2 feet?

[das11209]

Varitek calls spots' date=' what the hell is he supposed to do if Delcarmen, Buchholz and Hansen miss their spots by 2 feet?[/quote']

 

My point is he does not contribute positively or negatively to pitchers as advertised.

[schillingouttheks]

Varitek calls spots' date=' what the hell is he supposed to do if Delcarmen, Buchholz and Hansen miss their spots by 2 feet?[/quote']

 

Why should Varitek get credit if the pitchers hit their spots? To me, people give credit to Tek for the pitchers placing the ball where they're supposed to. It's almost like the parents who give their kids an allowance for making their bed or brushing their teeth...

[Gom]

SOTK...I can't believe you actually posted that.

[BoSox21]

Varitek calls pitches and spots. Varitek is known to be pretty damn good at that but in the end, its up to the pitcher to hit that spot

[Dojji]

Mauer is going to get a massive contract. He'll be the best catcher in baseball, and he'll still be in his prime. Why wouldn't you test the FA market?

 

I don't think Minnesota pays him the $16-18 million, he'll probably fetch.

 

But here's the thing -- Minnesota WILL pay top dollar to resign two or three core players at a time. You know that, I know that. Maybe they choose to keep Liriano and Morneau and drop Mauer, but I strongly suspect that they'll throw a ton of money and creative deals in his path to get him to stay in Minnesota.

[BoSox21]

Morneau is the most underrated player in baseball, Minny will keep him

[Dojji]

Morneau is the most underrated player in baseball' date=' Minny will keep him[/quote']

 

They signed Santana and Hunter both at the same time, I expect them to also keep at least two of this generation. My money is on at least two of Mauer, Morneau and Liriano landing big-money deals.

[Paradisecity]

I also think two will bolt, with one of them being Liriano.

 

From the organization's standpoint he's suceptable to injury and not as solid an investment as an all star position player. From a player standpoint he's been treated like s*** by the organization.

[Dojji]

I also think two will bolt, with one of them being Liriano.

 

From the organization's standpoint he's suceptable to injury and not as solid an investment as an all star position player. From a player standpoint he's been treated like s*** by the organization.

 

That makes it really easy then. The Twins drop their money on Morneau and Mauer and sign them both to 7 digit salaries until they're on the wrong side of 30.

[soxfan17881]

Sabathia is getting 20+ mil a yr from someone. I have a feeling that the sox may try and negotiate with Beckett before they set a team precedent for what Beckett should exceed.

 

I have to agree (as much as it pains me to do so) with jm, here. Whatever you sign CC. for you have to match or more likely exceed when you negotiate with Beckett. So, unless the Sox are prepared to have $90 million teid up in two starters ove the next 4 - 5 years, I think you stay out of serious talk about Sabathia. Maybey sheets, too.

 

As much as I'd enjoy seeing Millar or Loretta back in Boston, it would only be for sentimental reasons...the novelty of it. If you took the names away and went by career and recent numbers, I don't think picking them up really makes sense.

[TheKilo]

Varitek calls pitches and spots. Varitek is known to be pretty damn good at that but in the end' date=' its up to the pitcher to hit that spot[/quote']

 

So why does Varitek get credit for pitchers being good?

[schillingouttheks]

So why does Varitek get credit for pitchers being good?

 

Thank youuuuuuu.

[Gom]

Varitek is good at calling games, not great.