Reactions to Clemens on 60 Minutes

[Paradisecity]

Keep telling yourself that

 

"Read my lips. No Ne..."

 

"I did not have sexual relations with that wo..."

[CrespoBlows]

Keep telling yourself that

 

"Read my lips. No Ne..."

 

"I did not have sexual relations with that wo..."

 

CLEMENS: "I didn't do any of these things."

 

MCNAMEE: "Tell me what I need to do Roger."

 

CLEMENS: "Why would you tell everyone that I did steroids?"

 

MCNAMEE: "Tell me what I need to do Roger."

 

Now, I'm still not 100% convinced that Clemens is innocent, but these are fairly damning pieces of evidence to McNamee's character, and the truth of his statement.

[castigs850]

I'm with you crespo, as much as i think roger is a dick i cant help but start to sway toward his side.

When Mcnamee said "i'll do whatever, you want me to go to jail? what do you want me to do?"

The only thing i can think of that would keep Clemens from saying yes is that fact that the mans son is in a tough spot health wise.

 

i dont think anyone can be more than 10% from the middle on this because who's to say who is lying. im leaning towards roger being innocent.

[Paradisecity]

you want me to go to jail?-

 

to me that says- you want me to lie for you and go to jail?

 

clemens was very careful in what he said there.

[Thumper]

I still believe the "The bigger the lie, the more people will believe it."

 

However, if Clemens DOES indeed prove himself innocent I'll be the first one to apologize for not believing him. However, I still say he's a lying cheating bastard who's lied his way to Congress.

[castigs850]

you want me to go to jail?-

 

to me that says- you want me to lie for you and go to jail?

 

clemens was very careful in what he said there.

 

i guess the "go to jail" can go whatever way you want to hear it as

 

but the part about him being careful, im putting that on the fact that if he was taping the call he was nervous that the same deal could be going on on the other side. you're getting the same conversation either way but i can understand how that would make a person nervous.

 

"the bigger the lie the more people will believe it"

that is true. i just have no reason to believe mcnamee more than i do to believe clemens. in fact i trust canseco more than anyone that is open and talking about clemens' situation. and that's not saying much.

[Soxfan1]

What conference Crespo?

[He Hate Me]

What conference Crespo?

 

they replaying it right now on ESPNews

[Thumper]

i guess the "go to jail" can go whatever way you want to hear it as

 

but the part about him being careful, im putting that on the fact that if he was taping the call he was nervous that the same deal could be going on on the other side. you're getting the same conversation either way but i can understand how that would make a person nervous.

 

"the bigger the lie the more people will believe it"

that is true. i just have no reason to believe mcnamee more than i do to believe clemens. in fact i trust canseco more than anyone that is open and talking about clemens' situation. and that's not saying much.

 

I'll take anyone's word who's actually admitted to using steroids over those still denying for the most part. Maybe not 100% but Canseco sure has been right most of the time when pointing out the juicers. He's got nothing to lose so he may as well take others down.

[Paradisecity]

If I was innocent and didnt do anything I wouldnt be nervous I would have torn him a new one. I would have said- WHY DID YOU f***ING LIE ABOUT ME? TELL THE TRUTH.

 

Its pretty basic.

 

McNamee feels bad and nervous because he dropped a dime on his good friend. Clemens was nervous because he had to dance around the truth, I just hope McNamee stands by his word and doesn't pull a Pentangeli in court.

[He Hate Me]

ok i'm officially confused now.

[He Hate Me]

If I was innocent and didnt do anything I wouldnt be nervous I would have torn him a new one. I would have said- WHY DID YOU f***ING LIE ABOUT ME? TELL THE TRUTH.

 

Its pretty basic.

 

McNamee feels bad and nervous because he dropped a dime on his good friend. Clemens was nervous because he had to dance around the truth, I just hope McNamee stands by his word and doesn't pull a Pentangeli in court.

 

did you listen to the tape? ROger said several times I just want the truth.

[Thumper]

did you listen to the tape? ROger said several times I just want the truth.

 

He can't handle the truth. Really, he can't.

 

He won't be able to register the fact that his career, legacy, reputation, life, will be crushed when he's found guilty. He's nervously answering questions with other questions, beating around the bush. Like Paradise said, if he was seriously innocent, he'd be really mad, focused, and locked in on the subject. Not like he's looking now.

[He Hate Me]

He can't handle the truth. Really, he can't.

 

He won't be able to register the fact that his career, legacy, reputation, life, will be crushed when he's found guilty. He's nervously answering questions with other questions, beating around the bush. Like Paradise said, if he was seriously innocent, he'd be really mad, focused, and locked in on the subject. Not like he's looking now.

 

I'm no Clemens defender, but seriously unless you're living in a fishbowl and everyone's on your ass about everything (even if true), you really shouldn't dictate how someone should act.

[Thumper]

I'm no Clemens defender' date=' but seriously unless you're living in a fishbowl and everyone's on your ass about everything (even if true), you really shouldn't dictate how someone should act.[/quote']

 

I'm not saying that's how he HAS to act. I guess I mean is I'd be more convinced of his innocence if he acted like he was really into it. From a personal experience I was accused of theft when I was 15. Now that's a different matter than steroids, but when trying to prove my innocence, I fought hard, I got an attitude, I told truthful answers straight up when asked. I didn't beat around anything or act nervous, because I knew I was innocent. Long story short, the real thief turned himself in and I was let go.

 

My point is, if you really believe in something, such as your innocence, you'll fight for it to the bitter end. Not act reserved and uncanny.

[Paradisecity]

He Hate me- he was very careful- like I said- he never said to McNamee- STOP LYING. He said "I just want the truth out there" He never said STOP LYING, and Im pretty positive he didn't say "TELL THE TRUTH" when McNamee asked what he wanted.

 

Further, Clemens said he never provided his own injections if i heard correctly? If so, why wasn't he disputing this stuff from the get go- why wasnt he saying- i never provided Brian with ANYTHING? Why has he waited so long? Its because he needed to figure out every step very carefully for legal reasons.

 

Its much easier to step when you are innocent. You can say whatever whenever because its the truth so you are never in danger of perjury, witness tampering, or just flat out lying.

[Thumper]

Its much easier to step when you are innocent. You can say whatever whenever because its the truth so you are never in danger of perjury' date=' witness tampering, or just flat out lying.[/quote']

 

Pretty much what I was trying to say, thanks for getting to the point for me.

[Thumper]

"Do you think I played my career because I'm worried about the damn Hall of Fame?" he told a room filled with many potential voters. "You keep your vote. I don't need the Hall of Fame to justify that I put my butt on the line and I worked my tail off, and I defy anybody to say I did it by cheating or taking any shortcuts, OK?"

 

"I'm going to Congress and I'm going to tell the truth," Clemens said. "I'm going to tell everything that I know about the situations and steroids and anything else that I have knowledge about, which isn't a lot."

 

http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/news?slug=ap-steroids-clemens&prov=ap&type=lgns

 

He's pretty much following in Bonds's wake. Same "screw the Hall" attitude and "I will not lie" deal.

[Paradisecity]

Pretty much what I was trying to say' date=' thanks for getting to the point for me.[/quote']

 

 

No problemo Thump.

 

We aren't the only ones thinking it.

[rician blast]

I don't believe Clemens for a second. That said, I really thought he did an ok job in the press conference. He could have a career in film someday.

 

As for the tape? What a piece of garbage that was....that was like talking to my great aunt on the phone, a whole lot of nothing gets said and you can't wait to hang up the phone. My hunch is that it was a setup...he deliberately did not say much and was hoping that McNamee would say something that could be taken out of context and twisted around.

[Paradisecity]

Thats exactly what the tape sounded like.

 

And I agree, he did pretty well in the press conference.

[Taliesin]

The Rocket doth protest too much, methinks.

 

Lizard's leg, and owlet's wing,—

For a charm of powerful trouble,

Like a hell-broth boil and bubble.

 

Sorry, mixing Bill's metaphors and contrasting Plays.

 

This isn't the Zapruder tape. Isn't worth analyzing. He's a boob baseball player. A slime of almost incomprehensible proportion and willing to do anything to confuse the general populace and even the diehardcorefans. He has about 23 million he earned just from his 2 week heroic return like THE f***ING QUEEN waving from the balcony reminiscent of Eva Peron who didn't limp off the big stage from my recollection w/ a fake pulled groin. He can buy the best to twist his web and he's doing so quite impressively for those without brain function. I'll posit he has a few bucks to spend on some incredible spin. Impressive, but so was his sham career post 1997. Put him on the ticket in N.H. In a few weeks he'll be a martyr. I call liar, liar, pants on fire.

 

I predict a 70 percent approval rating in 2 months. Moo. He's full of s***, he said nothing, and nice using a sick kid ya prick.

 

I do believe him when he says he doesn't care about the H.O.F except what it's going to do to his endorsements and the cute ads he does w/ the long suffering Debbie and eventually with PAyton Manning. Sorry, had to get a dig into that horse face media whore while I was at it.

 

He also sounded a lot like me when I was a teenager and trying to convince my mom I wasn't drinking that night. I used the righteous indignation game as well. I did NOT have attorneys present, although that would have been great.

[jacksonianmarch]

Clemens is doing all he can to try and make it look like he didnt do anything. Thing is, his good buddy wrote his admission letter. Once Andy confirmed that this guy gave him HGH, he signed Clemens' destruction.

[Paradisecity]

 

He also sounded a lot like me when I was a teenager and trying to convince my mom I wasn't drinking that night. I used the righteous indignation game as well. I did NOT have attorneys present, although that would have been great.

 

 

LOL so true.

 

he definitely used the sick kid too. I feel so bad for that kid being brought into the middle of this while he's sick.

[Thumper]

LOL so true.

 

he definitely used the sick kid too. I feel so bad for that kid being brought into the middle of this while he's sick.

 

Clemens doesn't care about anyone but himself. He proved that with a wild pitch to his son last year in the minor leagues.

[26 to 6]

I'm not saying Rog didn't do it, but it's worth pointing out that in the phone conversation, everytime Roger asked McNamee why he lied, he never once responded "I didn't lie" or "you did do it." He never acknowledged that what he told the Mitchell investigators was the truth, he just wanted to "make things better."

 

And as for people saying he isn't doing enough to defend his innocence, just because he didn't hastily jump into things and initially released statements through his representatives, he has come forth, spoken publicly, agreed to testify before congress, filed suit against McNamee, answered questions, however vaguely. There is no doubt ROger has knowledge of steroids, even Canseco acknowledged that in his book, while also saying he didn't know if Roger did or not, so that would explain IF HE WERE INNOCENT why he's beating around the bush a little in the interviews, because any slight implication regarding him and steroids, even if just doing research, would hurt his case. And also a good point is that while steroids may enhance one's performance, even in their later years, it wouldn't prolong one's career, in fact it would probably shorten it, and as best to my knowledge Roger was pitching this past season at 45. And whether he did or didnt do it, fact of the matter is he's still one of the greatest pitchers of all time. He did win Cy Young's both before and after (2004) he allegedly used steroids. So again, I will reserve my judgement one way or another until this whole thing plays out. And I know because of my admiration for Roger throughout his career, particularily since originally joining the Yankees back in '99, that some of you guys probably think that I'm being biased and oblivious, but I don't want to jump the gun on anything. I havent given my opinion one way or another, frankly because there isn't enough EVIDENCE (McNamee's allegations are just words, no evidence; same with Roger's denials) to prove or disprove he used steroids, and to just be fair about it.

[26 to 6]

Clemens doesn't care about anyone but himself. He proved that with a wild pitch to his son last year in the minor leagues.

That was in Spring Training the year before, and he didn't throw a wild pitch, he just threw up and in,f***ing around with him. How could he "throw a wild pitch to his son" last year in the minors considering he never pitched a game in the same league as Koby last year, and as for the season prior, they played on the SAME TEAM in Lexington. What you just said doesn't make sense.

[Thumper]

That was in Spring Training the year before' date=' and he didn't throw a wild pitch, he just threw up and in,f***ing around with him. How could he "throw a wild pitch to his son" last year in the minors considering he never pitched a game in the same league as Koby last year, and as for the season prior, they played on the SAME TEAM in Lexington. What you just said doesn't make sense.[/quote']

 

Last year as in, 2006. Sorry, still thinking 2007.

 

Still it doesn't matter if it was "up and in" it could have gone to his son's head. It doesn't matter if he was f***ing with his son. It goes to show how little concern he has for anyone.

[ARod2212]

The thing that jumped out at me, and the big difference between Clemens and Bonds- Bonds did not file a defamation lawsuit. The suit opens Clemens up to cross examination and allows the defense to pry into his personal life. If he has something to hide, it'll come out in court for the defense.

 

Defamation lawsuits are no joke. For a statement to be defamatory it needs to be specific, untrue, published to a third party, and most importantly- the prosecution needs to prove damages.

 

I studied a lot of 1st amendment law last year, and the fact that Clemens has filed the lawsuit carries a lot of weight. Most celebrities never do it in something scandalous. Kobe was found not guilty of rape, which was a pretty damning charge the girl put forward. It cost him hundreds of millions of dollars in endorsements and killed his reputation. Kobe never filed a defamation suit because then the burden was on him to prove the girl was lying.

 

Same situation now. If Clemens used steroids, he's to have a hell of time proving he didn't to a jury. The burden is going to be on Clemens to prove McNamee was lying, and it'll be interesting to see how far this progresses.

 

To quote my professor- the ultimate, unbeatable defense to slander and libel is the truth. A case like this, the one that proves to be telling the truth wins.

[arbitrary]

Clemens doesn't care about anyone but himself. He proved that with a wild pitch to his son last year in the minor leagues.

 

What happened now?

 

EDIT: Nevermind, I didn't read the whole thread through.