Patriots stole Jet's signs?

[BSN07]

I'm not thrilled about this as a Pats fan. But i'm also sure we are not the first, but we got caught so now we must be dealt with.

 

But if we had been doing this for awhile wouldn't we beable to beat just about everyone if we knew there plays? Especially Denver LOL

[jacksonianmarch]

I think the point is that the pats didnt know every single play. But that their taping may have helped them with one play or two plays in one game, and who knows, they may have been huge.

[Mr Crunchy]

they cheated and got bagged

their brand of cheating makes steroid usage seem harmless im competetive comparisons.

 

f***ing disgraceful is what it is

1 way to stop it for sure is to make them forfeit

sure

its extreme but it will make them stop this nonsense

cheating against the jets is like cheating on your 4 year old kid in candy land

 

i think bb is the best coach in nfl history but he is also a victim of his own success and ambition.

[mtbykr]

I haven't weighed in on this yet, so i figure i will. This is the rule in question:

 

"no video recording devices of any kind are permitted to be in use in the coaches' booth, on the field, or in the locker room during the game." The manual states that "all video shooting locations must be enclosed on all sides with a roof overhead."

 

This is the rule the pats 'apparently' (no ruling from the NFL, so we'll see) broke. What they did wrong was use video equipment, they didn't "cheat" as so many hear would like to believe. Every NFL team out there watches the other teams coaches to see signs of what they are doing, tendencies, ect... The problem here is that the pats brought their own video to the field. Trying to steal signals is not illegal, using video equipment, tape, ect.. is not illegal.........but bringing their own onto the field is.

 

Every team has coaches who watch the other sideline and try to pick stuff up during the game (including the pats) but the video isn't used for that. There is no way to match up film from certain plays with the play itself in order to 'get an advantage'....just no way to do that in the 10 minutes at halftime. The pats use this film of the coaches for the next time they play. The other team (jets in this case) would have already changed their signals...the pats are just looking for tendencies in how they call the game. Again doing this isn't illegal, teams do it all the time on film...the pats just used their own camera instead which is against the rules.

 

 

 

A lot of people have been looking for a reason to hate the pats, and this gives them that reason. The competition committee blew this up from the beginning because they are tyring to get the 'more radio's in helmet' rule passed and this will give them the ammo they need. (they have been short 2 votes so far)

 

This wouldn't have gone anywhere if it wasn't the pats, period. Last year Miami was caught getting signals of Brady's audibles at the line. They bought a tape of it, and also mic'd up dlineman to use at a later date. There wasn't a big deal made of this because Miami sucked, and nobody cared. (if the pats did that last year, it would be just as big as this is now)

 

The pats broke the rule of bringing the video onto the field (apparently, no NFL ruling) so they should be punished accordingly. However the comish no doubt will want to make an example out of them with this...i guess we'll see.

[He Hate Me]

I haven't weighed in on this yet, so i figure i will. This is the rule in question:

 

 

 

This is the rule the pats 'apparently' (no ruling from the NFL, so we'll see) broke. What they did wrong was use video equipment, they didn't "cheat" as so many hear would like to believe. Every NFL team out there watches the other teams coaches to see signs of what they are doing, tendencies, ect... The problem here is that the pats brought their own video to the field. Trying to steal signals is not illegal, using video equipment, tape, ect.. is not illegal.........but bringing their own onto the field is.

 

Every team has coaches who watch the other sideline and try to pick stuff up during the game (including the pats) but the video isn't used for that. There is no way to match up film from certain plays with the play itself in order to 'get an advantage'....just no way to do that in the 10 minutes at halftime. The pats use this film of the coaches for the next time they play. The other team (jets in this case) would have already changed their signals...the pats are just looking for tendencies in how they call the game. Again doing this isn't illegal, teams do it all the time on film...the pats just used their own camera instead which is against the rules.

 

 

 

A lot of people have been looking for a reason to hate the pats, and this gives them that reason. The competition committee blew this up from the beginning because they are tyring to get the 'more radio's in helmet' rule passed and this will give them the ammo they need. (they have been short 2 votes so far)

 

This wouldn't have gone anywhere if it wasn't the pats, period. Last year Miami was caught getting signals of Brady's audibles at the line. They bought a tape of it, and also mic'd up dlineman to use at a later date. There wasn't a big deal made of this because Miami sucked, and nobody cared. (if the pats did that last year, it would be just as big as this is now)

 

The pats broke the rule of bringing the video onto the field (apparently, no NFL ruling) so they should be punished accordingly. However the comish no doubt will want to make an example out of them with this...i guess we'll see.

 

good piece of justification there. I'd do the same if it was my Giants.

[mtbykr]

Wade Wislon was suspended for 5 games for PEDs when he isnt even playing' date=' he's a frickin coach. This is active cheating as a coach and should be dealt with more severely than what Wilson got. Either a boatload of draft picks and a monstrous fine or Belichek should get a half season suspension. This should not be treated lighter than a coach taking roids since a coaches physique does nothing toward game outcome.[/quote']

 

I don't think he should have gotten that suspension because it didn't affect anything...they guy has diabetes. However he should have been smarter and gone through a doctor.

 

 

 

worse than steroids in terms of competitive balance. The Jets should get a 2nd round and a 5th rounder for this.

 

The JETS won't get any pics...if the pats lose them they are just gone. This isn't worse that roids which give you an obvious advantage on the field. The pats use this video before the next time they play them to see if they can find a tendency in how they call the game. Every team does this (which isn't illegal), the pats just shouldn't have used their own camera. (which is illegal)

[mtbykr]

good piece of justification there. I'd do the same if it was my Giants.

 

I'm not trying to justify anything....just sticking to the facts. If they broke that rule, then punish them...but let's not pretend stealing signs is illegal. If the pats are the only team that does it, why does everyone cover their mouth when they talk on the headset, or have 3 coaches giving signals (one of whom is the actual one).....they do this because everyone does it, the pats broke the camera rule (apparently) and should be punished accordingly

[mtbykr]

I think a fair punishment would be forfeitureof their 2nd, 4th and 6th round picks along with a $1M fine.

 

Guy in the Post also had a novel idea. Move the Pats Jets game in Foxboro to Giants stadium. That probably would make more sense than forfeiting the game.

 

A guy in the post, you mean a NY guy thinks that's fair:rolleyes: The camera incident didn't affect this game one bit..it's impossible to match up the video from that camera with the pics from each play......and do it all in the 10minutes at halftime.

 

Let's also not forget that this camera was confiscated in the 1st quarter, so the pats never had a chance to see it....so the JETS just got beat, deal with it. As I have mentioned before the pats used this tape for future games to see tendencies, nothing more.

[He Hate Me]

I'm not trying to justify anything....just sticking to the facts. If they broke that rule' date=' then punish them...but let's not pretend stealing signs is illegal. If the pats are the only team that does it, why does everyone cover their mouth when they talk on the headset, or have 3 coaches giving signals (one of whom is the actual one).....they do this because everyone does it, the pats broke the camera rule (apparently) and should be punished accordingly[/quote']

 

I'm not bagging on you for it. it was a well thought out post. I don't necessarily think the thoughts are correct but like in school where the teacher gives you points for getting the process right but the overall answer wrong, I feel it's the same way with your post

[mtbykr]

Not sure if I sai this before' date=' not only does the cheating on it's own principle upset me, but it's the obviousness of how they got caught, they did the same exact thing they did in Lambeau to a T. [b']The guy even stuck out if you watched the game again, he was wearing dark green and khacki shorts among yellow-vested cameramen and stuck out like a sore thumb, the ace in the hole here is the pats side of the story, i will withhold any judgement until then[/b].

 

 

No that's not the guy. ESPN has been running this for a while now and that's not the guy. The guy in question was on the pats sideline not the jets. Not that it makes a difference, just pointing it out

[He Hate Me]

A guy in the post, you mean a NY guy thinks that's fair:rolleyes: The camera incident didn't affect this game one bit..it's impossible to match up the video from that camera with the pics from each play......and do it all in the 10minutes at halftime.

 

Let's also not forget that this camera was confiscated in the 1st quarter, so the pats never had a chance to see it....so the JETS just got beat, deal with it. As I have mentioned before the pats used this tape for future games to see tendencies, nothing more.

 

I read it was confiscated at halftime when he tried to enter the Pats locker room.

[mtbykr]

I read it was confiscated at halftime when he tried to enter the Pats locker room.

 

I heard the first quarter...8 minutes into the game. Either way they weren't using it for that game.

 

 

Here's an interesting take from "the best damn sports show"

 

[youtube=best damn]6IngYS0Tkqg

[mtbykr]

NFL Live:

 

[youtube=NFL Live]6IO90vc3d9E

[ARod2212]

Belichick should be suspended for the rematch in Foxboro. I think that'd be the most appropriate punishment. I also think the NFL will take draft picks away to discourage this in the future.

[schillingouttheks]

Suspending Belichick for the game against the Jets would be a fair punishment.

 

Let's see how Belichick responds to this. I'm eager for his explanation. I'm not as irritated as I was when I first heard about this because it definitely seems like it's something that every team in the league would do. I was listening to EEI this morning and Dennis and Callahan were grilling the Pats for this, but kept it in perspective. They talked about how so many teams aren't saying anything because they all do it...when the Packers escorted the cameraman out of Lambeau last season, they didn't confiscate the tape and send it to the commissioner because they knew that they did it as well.

 

We'll see what happens. All in all it's not really that big of a deal in that there could have been a much worse rule that the Pats could have broken. It doesn't take away from any of their accomplishments in the past, and it certainly doesn't take away anything from this past Sunday's game. The Jets were outplayed in every facet of the game. Randy Moss out-running a triple team for the TD wasn't because we knew what signs they were showing. It's because he's a hard-working, fast receiver with great hands and has a quarterback that can put the ball in the right place more often than not.

[redsoxrules]

Suspending Belichick for the game against the Jets would be a fair punishment.

 

Let's see how Belichick responds to this. I'm eager for his explanation. I'm not as irritated as I was when I first heard about this because it definitely seems like it's something that every team in the league would do. I was listening to EEI this morning and Dennis and Callahan were grilling the Pats for this, but kept it in perspective. They talked about how so many teams aren't saying anything because they all do it...when the Packers escorted the cameraman out of Lambeau last season, they didn't confiscate the tape and send it to the commissioner because they knew that they did it as well.

 

We'll see what happens. All in all it's not really that big of a deal in that there could have been a much worse rule that the Pats could have broken. It doesn't take away from any of their accomplishments in the past, and it certainly doesn't take away anything from this past Sunday's game. The Jets were outplayed in every facet of the game. Randy Moss out-running a triple team for the TD wasn't because we knew what signs they were showing. It's because he's a hard-working, fast receiver with great hands and has a quarterback that can put the ball in the right place more often than not.

 

oh, so the fact that they would of won anyways the cheating part dosent matter? thats like me saying " it didn't matter that he took steroids , he didn't hit many HR anyways"

[schillingouttheks]

oh' date=' so the fact that they would of won anyways the cheating part dosent matter? thats like me saying " it didn't matter that he took steroids , he didn't hit many HR anyways"[/quote']

 

You're twisting what I'm saying. If I really thought the cheating didn't matter, then I wouldn't have said that suspending Belichick for the Jets game is a good idea.

 

They could have cheated in so many other ways. Yeah, they should pay the price for it, but they beat the Jets because they were the better team, with or without the camera. Besides, I genuinely believe that the players had no idea that it happened. All they're aware of is going out onto the field to do a job, and they kicked the Jets' asses. They outplayed them mentally, and they outplayed them physically. Physically is the key part here, because a camera isn't going to help you. Look, I play football. Other people who have also played football will tell you that the game is won in the preparation (conditioning, training, etc...working your ass off in the weight room). Even if I know what's coming, I still have to be strong and conditioned enough to beat my guy physically. The Pats did that.

 

Sure, they used a f***ing camera to tape some signals. They were caught, they should be punished. But for f***'s sake, everyone in the league does it, and it's not like the whole team pulled a Rodney Harrison.

[redsoxrules]

You're twisting what I'm saying. If I really thought the cheating didn't matter, then I wouldn't have said that suspending Belichick for the Jets game is a good idea.

 

 

I know.... but you always add "we would have won anyways"... to me it dosent matter wheather the pats won or they woulld have won anyways . the cheating part is the subject here

[mtbykr]

I know.... but you always add "we would have won anyways"... to me it dosent matter wheather the pats won or they woulld have won anyways . the cheating part is the subject here

 

Please realize that even if the pats wanted to try and use that tape sunday it was confiscated at the beggining of the game.........so it had no impact on the outcome of the game. In addition (as i have mentioned) this tape would have been used the next time the pats play the jets to study their tendency's and how they call the game.

[ACL BoSox]

This has to be the most over-rated topic in sports right now. Fine the pats, suspend Belicheck a game or two, and move on.

 

It happens all the time, the Patriots were just unfortunate to get caught. Punish them and move on. There's no need to make a federal case out of this.

 

MOVE ON

[mtbykr]

Here's the pic that everyone thinks was the pats guy:

 

http://img409.imageshack.us/img409/9494/patscameraff5.jpg

 

It's not the pats guy, the pats guy was on the pats sideline. What's hilarious about this is now (just heard on the news) it's coming out that the guy in the pic is a JETS employee with JETS credentials. (cameragate was a pats guy with pats credentials) He's on the sideline with a camera and not part of the camera crew. So where's the outrage over this? Again, this is a big deal becuase it's the pats.

[Cityofchampions33]

No that's not the guy. ESPN has been running this for a while now and that's not the guy. The guy in question was on the pats sideline not the jets. Not that it makes a difference' date=' just pointing it out[/quote']

 

Yeah, just found out it was a doctored photo, didn't hear he had Jets crudentials and was a jets employee.

[He Hate Me]

Again' date=' this is a big deal becuase it's the pats.[/quote']

 

just curious, but how do you feel about Barry Bonds?

[mtbykr]

just curious' date=' but how do you feel about Barry Bonds? [/quote']

 

come on;)

[TheKilo]

Here's the pic that everyone thinks was the pats guy:

 

http://img409.imageshack.us/img409/9494/patscameraff5.jpg

 

It's not the pats guy, the pats guy was on the pats sideline. What's hilarious about this is now (just heard on the news) it's coming out that the guy in the pic is a JETS employee with JETS credentials. (cameragate was a pats guy with pats credentials) He's on the sideline with a camera and not part of the camera crew. So where's the outrage over this? Again, this is a big deal becuase it's the pats.

 

No, this is a big deal because the Patriots got caught breaking the rules. That's the big issue.

[He Hate Me]

come on;)

 

lol

[Cityofchampions33]

http://www.patriotsdaily.com/2007/09/pat-hetic/ just for the sake of defending the Pats

[ARod2212]

http://sports.yahoo.com/top/news?slug=ap-f1-spycase&prov=ap&type=lgns

 

$100 million dollar fine for spying in another sport. I think the precedent has been set, Roger.

[riverside sluggers]

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2007/football/nfl/09/13/belichick/index.html

 

Goodell has ruled out forcing the Patriots to forfeit their 38-14 W over the Jets. Instead its looking like the league taking away a first day draft pick (possibly 1st rounder) and a suspension of Belichick for 2 or 3 games. He would be banned from all games including practice and would not be paid. That sounds good to me, let that be a lesson to him

[Cityofchampions33]

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2007/football/nfl/09/13/belichick/index.html

 

Goodell has ruled out forcing the Patriots to forfeit their 38-14 W over the Jets. Instead its looking like the league taking away a first day draft pick (possibly 1st rounder) and a suspension of Belichick for 2 or 3 games. He would be banned from all games including practice and would not be paid. That sounds good to me, let that be a lesson to him

 

thatd be an overreaction IMO