who to get

[Mr Crunchy]

i dont know of buerhles current contract

didnt he struggle last year and isnt he up for a new deal or did chicago sign him?

 

the sox dont have a huge buget and if hes not inked and theyre out of it??

[BSN07]

Guys this is completely random but Id thought id throw it out there for discussion sake.

 

Espn was talking about the Yanks being out of it and they might look to unload a little bit. One of the only guys without a no-trade clause(partial, he has a list of 12 teams that are ok) is none other then Damon. What about a reunion with Ol Johnny boy?

 

I for one wouldnt unless the deal was absolutely loopsided on our end, such as the yanks pick up a big chunk of his remaining salary and we only need to send a low level guy back(I know its horribly onesides, but thats the point).

 

If Lowell leaves at seasons end Youk could move to 3rd and maybe Damon moves to 1st? Just food for thought.......really thats it.......

[example1]

Guys this is completely random but Id thought id throw it out there for discussion sake.

 

Espn was talking about the Yanks being out of it and they might look to unload a little bit. One of the only guys without a no-trade clause(partial, he has a list of 12 teams that are ok) is none other then Damon. What about a reunion with Ol Johnny boy?

 

I for one wouldnt unless the deal was absolutely loopsided on our end, such as the yanks pick up a big chunk of his remaining salary and we only need to send a low level guy back(I know its horribly onesides, but thats the point).

 

If Lowell leaves at seasons end Youk could move to 3rd and maybe Damon moves to 1st? Just food for thought.......really thats it.......

 

No.... no. I don't think reuniting with Johnny Damon is the direction this team wants to go right now. His speed is lacking, his power has decreased, he still has no arm and isn't an actual 1B. If we hoped to move Lowell to get a bonafide power bat at one of the corners then Damon isn't that person.

[example1]

thats why i brought crisp into it and just added Bowden since Crisp has been struggling in Boston. My offer would probably come up short but i think its a decent start.

 

Jesus. When did we start 'just adding' Bowden to deals? Bowden is potentially a very, VERY good pitcher. I see no reason to move him at all until we know what we've got on our hands.

[example1]

Philly needs a closer, Hansen could audition... Hansen and Moss/WMP or whoever would get it done. Yeah, I know Ellsbury is waiting in the wings, but this is one of those "now" moves that basically completes an already well oiled-pwnage machine. Ellsbury is 23 years old, if he stays down for the remainder of this year, we get a look at him in ST and maybe he competes for a job maybe he doesn't is that so bad? It would be great to have that kind of luxury... he isn't going to be ready this year, but talking about his debut maybe mid-way through next year sounds fine to me. He is a high-ceiling talent, and has a lot of value and its a luxury to be able to not rush him and to wait on him while he develops. If we wanted to sit Crisp or deal him and bring in another CFer to take his place, I'd be all for it. Crisp can't turn on a fastball anymore, for whatever reason. He is having a hard time getting around on 92 MPH heaters. Thats pathetic. Major league hitters need to be able to catch up with a fastball and Crisp does not look like a major leaguer right now.

 

Granted Crisp's defense has been invaluable. He is +18 right now in CF... Andruw Jones's best season he was +15. He is getting great breaks on balls, and taking very good routes, he is worlds better than he was last year, but his hitting has gotten a lot worse. He has regressed to the point where a trip to the minor leagues might be best for him. But point is, he is helping us out and I don't think that there is anyone we could bring in from anywhere for any price that could give us what Coco is giving us defensively.

 

Rowand would do a lot for our chemistry though. He would go balls out every single day and he is really hitting well right now. I'm always wary of bringing guys over from the NL, but Rowand has done it with the White Sox too and I loved him when he was with Chicago. I had no idea why Theo let Rowands name escape his list of possible CFers after Damon left and I would be really excited to see him come to boston.

 

I don't like Rowand, for some reason. He just isn't a very exciting player to me for whatever reason.

 

As for getting a look at Ellsbury in ST, I got a look at him in ST this season and thought he looked ready. I expect he will need to go through the standard Pedroia-2-3 months of getting adjusted, but all-the-while he will be drawing some walks, stealing some bases and playing a ++ CF. I don't think we need to see anything else from Ellsbury, in my opinion. He is the CF of the future for this team, the question is how quickly the future arrives.

 

I also think Murphy and Moss have a right to get a shot, but Ellsbury's tools are too much to pass on.

[TheKilo]

We're discussing trading for Shea Hillenbrand? Really?????

[example1]

We're discussing trading for Shea Hillenbrand? Really?????

 

Jesus, what have I unknowingly walked into? We are?

[TheKilo]

Jesus' date=' what have I unknowingly walked into? We are?[/quote']

 

i

4. pick-up Hillenbrand for a low ranking prospect to replace Willy Mo as the right handed bat on the bench. i dont see who else is available to fill the role.

 

 

I mean, what?????

[Cocos Disciples]

Holy f***ing s***. Shea Hillenbrand?????? He has a .577 OPS. That is terrible. Absolutely terrible. In 164 at bats. He's been playing most of the year. And he is making $6.5 mil. I wouldn't wany those numbers if he was making league minimum.

[Beckett95]

who else fills our other bench spot??

 

Alex Ochoa??

 

My guess is Shea gets let go and as of now, i dont say many better options to use on the bench. He hits lefties well and thats almost all he'd be used for.

 

You have to read my whole post to understand why i said him. Cause if Willy Mo stays with the team as a bench player, there is no way in hell id want to pick up Hillenbrand. But, IMO, hes better to have than Alex Ochoa or whoever else we'd call up (Jeff Bailey, Ed Rogers, Joe McEwing??, could keep going but will stop there).

[schillingouttheks]

Add to the list of who to get:

 

Someone who can play well against the Yankees.

[Beckett95]

id like Posada just so he cant play against the Sox

[TheKilo]

Didn't Ochoa get released?

[seabeachfred]

Add to the list of who to get:

 

Someone who can play well against the Yankees.

 

Right Schill---and that's why I was so stubborn about Dustin Pedroia all this time. Last September I saw the kid really come into his own against the Yankees at the Stadium, taking RJ off the wall, winning a game with a key hit the next day and playing well. Of course, when the series was over he was back being platooned. Dustin showed that he can and likes playing against the Yankees. I think Ellsbury is in the same class. I really believe he is ready now and if he performs ably the next week or so why wait??? And when are we going to get Lester back on our team and into the rotation. Wakefield is fast becoming a black hole there and we could use another good starter.

[schillingouttheks]

Right Schill---and that's why I was so stubborn about Dustin Pedroia all this time. Last September I saw the kid really come into his own against the Yankees at the Stadium' date=' taking RJ off the wall, winning a game with a key hit the next day and playing well. Of course, when the series was over he was back being platooned. Dustin showed that he can and likes playing against the Yankees. I think Ellsbury is in the same class. I really believe he is ready now and if he performs ably the next week or so why wait??? And when are we going to get Lester back on our team and into the rotation. Wakefield is fast becoming a black hole there and we could use another good starter.[/quote']

 

They won't take Wakefield out of the rotation. They just won't.

 

And oh, I was really frustrated when I made that post obviously lol. The Yankees had been raping out pitching and I was just getting fed up.

[TheKilo]

lol @ Wakefield becoming a black hole.

 

The guy led the league in ERA for April.

 

The knuckler is inconsistent by its nature. He's in the middle of a tough stretch, it just sucks that two of those games came against the Yankees.

 

Schilling's been awful against the Yankees too. Does that mean we can take him out of the rotation?

[seabeachfred]

They won't take Wakefield out of the rotation. They just won't.

 

And oh, I was really frustrated when I made that post obviously lol. The Yankees had been raping out pitching and I was just getting fed up.

 

Schill, if Wakefield doesn't rebound quickly the Red Sox would be fools not to replace him in the rotation. He has lookee horrid the past three weeks and I reall think he is starting to lose his effectiveness. Not only is he having trouble controlling his floater but is getting hit and hit hard.

[Cocos Disciples]

As many have said, it will all even out. Wakefield isn't supposed to be a dominant pitcher. Hell, he isn't even supposed to be consistent. He has times where he's great, he has times where he's s***. When it's all said and done, he'll have a .500 Win percentage and a mid 4 ERA. That's better than anyone else who would supposedly replace him if he were to get the boot from the rotation. His numbers against teams other than NY are great. He was great in April. Why are we all calling for his head?

[example1]

As many have said' date=' it will all even out. Wakefield isn't supposed to be a dominant pitcher. Hell, he isn't even supposed to be consistent. He has times where he's great, he has times where he's s***. When it's all said and done, he'll have a .500 Win percentage and a mid 4 ERA. That's better than anyone else who would supposedly replace him if he were to get the boot from the rotation. His numbers against teams other than NY are great. He was great in April. Why are we all calling for his head?[/quote']

 

I don't hear many calling for his head. Personally, I am fine with Wake for this season. I just think the Sox will want the flexibility that not having to carry mirabelli brings with it and that they have people who can pitch above .500 next year and from then on.

[seabeachfred]

I just don't want to see Wakefield open up another three game series with the Yankees. That's like giving them the game. He cannot pitch effectively against them anymore and I think that is evident to just about everybody on board. Well, almost everybody.

[ORS]

I just don't want to see Wakefield open up another three game series with the Yankees. That's like giving them the game. He cannot pitch effectively against them anymore and I think that is evident to just about everybody on board. Well' date=' almost everybody.[/quote']

Fred, he's 50/50 in QS over the last 3 years, which is pretty much the expectation rate in any given start. I think you tend to overreact to the most recent example far too often.

[jacksonianmarch]

every time we play you guys, it is like a softball game. So taking guys out when you face us or when we face you is not prudent. If Schill or Wake get shelled by the hapless offense of the A's, then maybe.

[schillingouttheks]

every time we play you guys' date=' it is like a softball game. So taking guys out when you face us or when we face you is not prudent. If Schill or Wake get shelled by the hapless offense of the A's, then maybe.[/quote']

 

Don't laugh. Dan f***ing Johnson killed us in the two game series.

[seabeachfred]

Fred' date=' he's 50/50 in QS over the last 3 years, which is pretty much the expectation rate in any given start. I think you tend to overreact to the most recent example far too often.[/quote']

 

Red, I'm not talking about the last THREE years; I'm talking about his work against the Yankees the past ONE year. His ERA against them is 10.63 now; that is a s***** number no matter how to try and Clintonesque it with soothing words. He is also our fourth starter (fifth he should be and even sent to the pen); you don't start your fourth starter with a 10.63 ERA against a team he hasn't beaten in the last half-dozen tries in the opener of such an important series. Sorry if you cannot see that but that's how I see it. I will tell you something else ORS. If Francona is stubborn enough to start him in a series opener against the Yankees the next two times we face them we will lose--simple as that.

[ORS]

Red' date=' I'm not talking about the last THREE years; I'm talking about his work against the Yankees the past ONE year. His ERA against them is 10.63 now; that is a s***** number no matter how to try and Clintonesque it with soothing words. He is also our fourth starter (fifth he should be and even sent to the pen); you don't start your fourth starter with a 10.63 ERA against a team he hasn't beaten in the last half-dozen tries in the opener of such an important series. Sorry if you cannot see that but that's how I see it. I will tell you something else ORS. If Francona is stubborn enough to start him in a series opener against the Yankees the next two times we face them we will lose--simple as that.[/quote']

Listen, I know it's hard for you to comprehend, but your idea is rife with stupidity. You don't start the 4th starter? Who do you pitch then? The just as inconsistent 5th starter? The gas-can 2nd time through the order Snyder? Those were the only other options on regular rest. No, you go with whoever's turn it is in June. September and win or go home? Different story.

 

Now, don't get your panties in a bunch because I'm not questioning your loyalty, but I don't think you pay much attention to the goings on of this team. Wakefield has 3-5 game stretches where he sucks against everyone, and predicting when they start is close to impossible, just like predicting which way that knuckleball will dart next is. He's been horrible in all 4 of his last starts. No location and leaving the ball up. It just happens.

 

As for the next time against the Yankees, check the gamelogs from '05. They torched him in the early part of the year - when he was going bad - but he turned in an 8 IP, 12 K, 1 R performance in September. Unfortunately he lost that game, but you can't blame him for that. The point is, he goes through stretches where he looks bad against them and stretches where he looks good. Of course, he does that with everyone else too.

 

With Wakefield, you have to take the good with the bad. He's a crap shoot every time he takes the hill, and when he's bad you don't really have much of a shot unless you are just teeing off on the opposition, but when he's on, he can shut down the best of lineups, like just about every knuckleballer to play the game as long as he has.

 

If his spot in the rotation comes up to start a series in August against the Yankees, Tito will do what he should do. He give the ball to Wake and have a 50/50 shot at a good pitching performance like he does when he sends him out against all the rest.

[rician blast]

Fred:

 

I look at it another way. Prior to his most recent start, Wake had 10 starts. His IP were:

 

6,7,7,6,5 1/3, 7,7,7,5,7

 

He averaged about 6.5 IP per start prior to the 3 2/3 debacle against the Yanks. Can you honestly say there's anyone waiting in the wings who'd have done better?

 

As average/inconsistent as he's been, he gives the Sox a 50/50 shot and more importantly he isn't killing the BP start after start. To me, in May'June...that's what counts right now.

[seabeachfred]

Listen, I know it's hard for you to comprehend, but your idea is rife with stupidity. You don't start the 4th starter? Who do you pitch then? The just as inconsistent 5th starter? The gas-can 2nd time through the order Snyder? Those were the only other options on regular rest. No, you go with whoever's turn it is in June. September and win or go home? Different story.

 

Now, don't get your panties in a bunch because I'm not questioning your loyalty, but I don't think you pay much attention to the goings on of this team. Wakefield has 3-5 game stretches where he sucks against everyone, and predicting when they start is close to impossible, just like predicting which way that knuckleball will dart next is. He's been horrible in all 4 of his last starts. No location and leaving the ball up. It just happens.

 

As for the next time against the Yankees, check the gamelogs from '05. They torched him in the early part of the year - when he was going bad - but he turned in an 8 IP, 12 K, 1 R performance in September. Unfortunately he lost that game, but you can't blame him for that. The point is, he goes through stretches where he looks bad against them and stretches where he looks good. Of course, he does that with everyone else too.

 

With Wakefield, you have to take the good with the bad. He's a crap shoot every time he takes the hill, and when he's bad you don't really have much of a shot unless you are just teeing off on the opposition, but when he's on, he can shut down the best of lineups, like just about every knuckleballer to play the game as long as he has.

 

If his spot in the rotation comes up to start a series in August against the Yankees, Tito will do what he should do. He give the ball to Wake and have a 50/50 shot at a good pitching performance like he does when he sends him out against all the rest.

 

Stupidity????? First of all it WASN'T Wakefield's turn to pitch; it was Julian's. Taverez has beaten the Yankees twice this year and would have won a game against them last September in his only start against them if Pena had been able to catch a fly ball. Fortunately he got a ND instead of a loss. As for goings on, check you damn facts before you question mine. In 2005 in the home opener against the Yankees Wakefield beat them 7-2 with seven strong innings of pitching, so that paradigm you outlined goes out the window. I agree with his hot and cold spells but I think Taverez would have done better because he has done better against the Yankees this season, and if you want to test your theory of 50-50 let's you and I put up $100.00 dollars on the next time Wakefield opens a series against the Yankees; you take him to win it, I take him to lose it. I know you wouldn't take such a bet and I know why and you know why. Look, all I'm saying is that Francona has to work his rotation that Wakefield doesn't open a series against the Yankees again this year. I have the stats to back up my case; you have only hope and percentages that have not worked this year. Man, we really can work up a lather on this, can't we? Don't take it personal, though. We are on the same side.

[jacksonianmarch]

you play with fire if you try to get past the yankees with a s***** pitcher for the third time. Wake has had stretches of utter dominance against the yankees and he is just as likely to dominate again as he was to bomb out. And with Tavarez, if you looked closer, you'd have seen that his starts in NY had more than met the eye. The last start he made, the outs were hit VERY hard. He wasnt fooling anyone. Timely DPs and at-em balls made his line look better than he actually pitched. His first start against us, he really had us by the balls. So we showed improvements our second time through. Would you really want to see what we could have done a third time around against a second tier pitcher in Fenway? Wake's line would have been a blessing. You can only parade him out there so many times before teams catch on. He's a serviceable 5, but you dont want to throw him out there when you dont have to.

[ORS]

Stupidity????? First of all it WASN'T Wakefield's turn to pitch; it was Julian's. Taverez has beaten the Yankees twice this year and would have won a game against them last September in his only start against them if Pena had been able to catch a fly ball. Fortunately he got a ND instead of a loss. As for goings on' date=' check you damn facts before you question mine. In 2005 in the home opener against the Yankees Wakefield beat them 7-2 with seven strong innings of pitching, so that paradigm you outlined goes out the window. I agree with his hot and cold spells but I think Taverez would have done better because he has done better against the Yankees this season, and if you want to test your theory of 50-50 let's you and I put up $100.00 dollars on the next time Wakefield opens a series against the Yankees; you take him to win it, I take him to lose it. I know you wouldn't take such a bet and I know why and you know why. Look, all I'm saying is that Francona has to work his rotation that Wakefield doesn't open a series against the Yankees again this year. I have the stats to back up my case; you have only hope and percentages that have not worked this year. Man, we really can work up a lather on this, can't we? Don't take it personal, though. We are on the same side.[/quote']

But, Fred, look at his outings in May and June from that year. Clearly, by Fredlogic, they had figured him out and were a sure bet to rough him up in September. This is the way we are supposed to analyze the data according to you. Don't backtrack now, Fred.

 

No, I won't put up $100 on Wakefield to win the game, but it's got nothing to do with who he's facing. I'm only putting my money up when I feel there's a strong likelihood I'll win, and that's never when Wake is starting (unless it's in a dome).

 

I know it was JT's turn, which is why I listed him as an option. I just have no faith in him being able to repeat his previous performance against that team. With JT against a good team, you take a good start and say a novena hoping he doesn't have to go against them again.

[schillingouttheks]

Actually, if we kept the rotation normal, Beckett wouldn't have pitched in the series. Wakefield would have, then JT, then Schilling.