Red Sox in discussions with Rockies about Helton

[TheKilo]

I don't think so. I think MDC or Bucholz, I think Theo really likes Hansen or else he would have never broken team policy to give him a major league contract. They really wanted him, I doubt they trade him. He coveted Lester and Papelbon, and we got offered a lot for them in a lot of different trades and nothing could pry them loose. I think Hansen might be the same way.

 

I can see why trading Bard might not be so bad. I'd prefer to keep a power arm like that and trade MDC. See what happens over the next year or so with Bard, but MDC is like 25-26 now, and he is still a question mark. Questionable control of his breaker and a flat fastball. I like what he does when he's on, but he has never been on consistently at the major league level. The Rox, by all accounts so far, consider him to be one of our elite prospects, I would deal him to get Helton before I dealt Bard because Bard has a higher ceiling.

 

 

I favor MDC to Hansen right now.

[He Hate Me]

The reason there at a stand still is it was reorted COL GM was out of town on family buisness and talks would resume Monday(today) or Tuesday. Helton wants a deal either done quick or he will veto it. He doesn't want any distractions leading up to ST. So the deal either gets done this week, or it won't get done at all.

 

1.Lugo

2.Drew/Helton

3.Papi

4.Manny

5.Drew/Helton

6.Youk

7.Tek

8.Crisp

9.Pedroia

 

That looks so pretty...:thumbsup: But if the deal falls threw like it has a big chance of doing I still think we have a good lineup going into 07.

 

Absolutely no way Helton would ever bat second in this lineup.

[rician blast]

I know he signed an extension with the Nats in early 2006, but I'm still surprised we never hear anything about the Sox looking at Nick Johnson. He's had some trouble staying healthy (back problem, bruised heel, broken leg at end of '06 I believe) but Johnson has a great OBP, is only 28 and plays a solid defensive 1B.

 

I really doubt the Nats GM (Bowden) would move Johnson considering he has him for about $5.5m per year for three years, but you'd think a rumor or two would be floating out there, no?

 

As for Helton, agree with Hate, he's not a #2. His presence, though, would allow Drew to hit in the 2 hole, where his OBP might be huge for the Sox.

 

BTW, are we sure Helton's power outage is truly due to an intestinal problem? Or is it 'roid withdrawal? Gotta stay open-minded, you know.

[jacksonianmarch]

I know he signed an extension with the Nats in early 2006, but I'm still surprised we never hear anything about the Sox looking at Nick Johnson. He's had some trouble staying healthy (back problem, bruised heel, broken leg at end of '06 I believe) but Johnson has a great OBP, is only 28 and plays a solid defensive 1B.

 

I really doubt the Nats GM (Bowden) would move Johnson considering he has him for about $5.5m per year for three years, but you'd think a rumor or two would be floating out there, no?

 

As for Helton, agree with Hate, he's not a #2. His presence, though, would allow Drew to hit in the 2 hole, where his OBP might be huge for the Sox.

 

BTW, are we sure Helton's power outage is truly due to an intestinal problem? Or is it 'roid withdrawal? Gotta stay open-minded, you know.

 

from the sounds of it, he may have had an inflammatory bowel condition. My father had that when he was in his thirties. He had Crohn's, but they thought he had another form of inflammatory bowel disease called ulcerative colitis. That is something that is controlled, never cured. They never used the word infection I dont think. I kept hearing bowel "condition". Oh well, medical mumbo jumbo is something I am vaguely familiar with, oh well. Past that, I know nothing.

[adam123]

hopefully he can get healthy .. but i am not sure wana take on that contract .. hes been on decline for last 2 yrs ..and thats in colorado ..maybee we get him for right price

[ImissPedro]

Isnt age a factor here as well, Helton's closing in on 34, Why would they want a player that old, even if it is Helton? I thought this team was on the right path with a youth movement, this move says otherwise.

[He Hate Me]

from the sounds of it' date=' he may have had an inflammatory bowel condition. My father had that when he was in his thirties. He had Crohn's, but they thought he had another form of inflammatory bowel disease called ulcerative colitis. That is something that is controlled, never cured. They never used the word infection I dont think. I kept hearing bowel "condition". Oh well, medical mumbo jumbo is something I am vaguely familiar with, oh well. Past that, I know nothing.[/quote']

 

if he had ulcerative colitis, then I'm positive he would test positive for steroids since that's the most common treatment for it. maybe Barry should develop that also na dthen claim his tests being tainted lol

[Cityofchampions33]

Rockies owner said he needs prospects (note the "s") to get this deal done. Per boston.com

 

I definately don't want to deal 2 prospects, I wasn't even sure about 1.

[mar_022]

just a note...Helton's home/away splits can be partly attributed to two things. Obviously coors boosts his home splits, but the rest of the NL west parks he plays in hurt his away split. In fenway you should be able to expect something in the middle, if not slightly higher, plus you have to factor in the other hitters in the sox lineup and how they'd help him

[SuperManny]

Absolutely no way Helton would ever bat second in this lineup.

 

Helton's only real spots would be 2, 5, or 6. Given his drop in power I don't think the #2 spot is that bad acutally. His insanely high OBP would be awesome in front of Papi and Manny. I think he would bat either 2nd or 5th, and Drew has a higher SLG % which you want in the 5th spot.

[He Hate Me]

Helton's only real spots would be 2' date=' 5, or 6. Given his drop in power I don't think the #2 spot is that bad acutally. His insanely high OBP would be awesome in front of Papi and Manny. I think he would bat either 2nd or 5th, and Drew has a higher SLG % which you want in the 5th spot.[/quote']

 

I think Manny and Ortiz would much rather have Drew at #2 than Helton. The OBP won't help him if he's batting ahead of Manny and Ortiz since you know they gonna be feeding him strikes. Too patient hitters who take borderline strike 3 with Ortiz on deck aren't going to last too long in Boston. I can see Helton batting 5th or 6th.

[TheKilo]

Rockies owner said he needs prospects (note the "s") to get this deal done. Per boston.com

 

I definately don't want to deal 2 prospects, I wasn't even sure about 1.

 

What if the prospects were Edgar Martinez and David Pauley?

[SuperManny]

I think Manny and Ortiz would much rather have Drew at #2 than Helton. The OBP won't help him if he's batting ahead of Manny and Ortiz since you know they gonna be feeding him strikes. Too patient hitters who take borderline strike 3 with Ortiz on deck aren't going to last too long in Boston. I can see Helton batting 5th or 6th.

 

Mark Bellhorn used to have a decent OBP batting in front of Papi and Manny so I really wouldn't worry about Helton. Helton and Drew both takes lots of walks anyways so I don't really understand your argument. Whatever you think about Helton would apply to Drew and Youk as well. Drew had a higher SLG last year which is why I would rather have him #5 although I could see the argument that Helton is a better hitter career wise and should bat there. Keep in mind Helton also hits over .300 every year so its not like hes up there taking strikes.

[Cityofchampions33]

What if the prospects were Edgar Martinez and David Pauley?

 

Well the owner gave the Sox a list of the 5 prospects they liked. The list included Bucks, Bard, Ellsbury, DelC, and Hansen. However, now I'm reading other reports that they just want one prospect.

[SuperManny]

Well the owner gave the Sox a list of the 5 prospects they liked. The list included Bucks' date=' Bard, Ellsbury, DelC, and Hansen. However, now I'm reading other reports that they just want one prospect.[/quote']

 

I don't think Bard can be traded anyways as he was just drafted so who knows how accurate that list is.

[Cityofchampions33]

I don't think Bard can be traded anyways as he was just drafted so who knows how accurate that list is.

 

Actually he can. This came up awhile ago, I think ksoosh answered that one.

[example1]

Rockies owner said he needs prospects (note the "s") to get this deal done. Per boston.com

 

I definately don't want to deal 2 prospects, I wasn't even sure about 1.

 

So Kason Gabbard and Abe Alvarez are too much?

 

I think we should start with a select group of prospects and young players who are off limits and work from there:

 

Lester

Pedroia

Hansen

Delcarmen

Buchholz

Bowden

Bard

Ellsbury

Masterson

Cox

Kris Johnson

Kottaras

Jason Place

 

That's my rough list of 13 players who I would have some hesitation in giving up. I would refuse to give up Ellsbury, Bowden, Buchholz, Lester, Pedroia and probably Hansen. After that, Bard, Masterson and Cox would be hard to part with but negotiable if the deal were sweet enough. I don't see what all the fuss is about trading Delcarmen. I like the guy, a lot. I think he has starter potential and good stuff. But he isn't the prize of the group. If we lost him for Helton then c'est la vie. No big deal.

[Beckett95]

Talks seem to be slowing down

 

 

What's left to be resolved in the Todd Helton trade talks?

Just about everything.

According to multiple sources involved in the talks, the Rockies haven't offered the Red Sox enough relief of Helton's $90.1 million contract to even consider a deal at this stage. In addition, the teams aren't close to resolving which prospect or prospects would go to Colorado in addition to Mike Lowell and Julian Tavarez.

Sources have indicated the Rockies would offer to eat at least 50 percent of the contract, but another source indicated the Rockies haven't reached anywhere near that level in what they have currently proposed to Boston.

The Rockies initiated the talks some time ago, but since then they have not been serious about closing the deal. The source also said the Red Sox aren't pleased that details of the talks were leaked out by the Rockies including the names of Lowell, Tavarez and the prospects.

While the Red Sox love the thought of Helton in their lineup, they're prepared to go without if the tenor of the talks don't change soon.

[example1]

Talks seem to be slowing down

 

I don't think so. There is never accurate information on these things. Remember the day before the Matsuzaka posting was announced: "NY Wins!". From what I've read there is Hansen AND Delcarmen, Hansen OR Delcarmen, Ellsbury as deal breaker, they're willing to take Jon Lester, the Sox are interested, the Sox are not interested, the talks have died, the talks are progressing. Who knows?

 

If any of the Delcarmen or Hansen stuff is true then the Sox have a lot of thinking to do. I mean, who wouldn't do a deal that was essentially Todd Helton + 50 million (Matsuzaka's posting fee) for hansen, tavarez and Lowell? You lose Lowell's contract, get half of Helton paid for (which is the same as the posting fee) and add a hitter who, in my opinion, is going to age pretty well as a 1B with tremendous hand-eye and OBP skills.

 

the more I think about it the more I think Helton is exactly what this team could use. The problem, of course, is the length of the contract, not the player. 5 years from now Helton will not be anything special, though I think 3 seasons are not out of the question. If the Rockies are paying half of helton's contract perhaps the Sox would be willing to pay more of it now (say, 2/3) and less of it later, so that colorado will pay 4m, 8m, 8m, 12m, 18m in each year of the contract. By 2011 the Sox would be paying a couple of million, plus the buy-out of his contract. It doesn't seem absurd if 50m is what they're looking at, and if Hansen or Delcarmen are all that's asked with those other throw-away guys then I'm all for it.

[riverside sluggers]

Very true example. Also remember when the Matsuzaka deadline was looming, we started to see reports that talks were dying down and it wasnt looking good for the Sox?

[exsubmariner]

Lowell, Tavarez and Hansen would be ok. Delcarmen would be off limits, because unlike Hansen he has shown that he can do it at the big level. I personally think Hansen will never be consistent in the bigs.

[Quinny]

Talks seem to be slowing down

 

How long ago did talks seem to "slow down" ?

[mar_022]

the hold up is on the money. the sox want more money for a prospect, but the rox dont want to kick any more in, yet they still want a spect.

 

linkie:

 

http://www.denverpost.com/sports/ci_5112213

 

i realize this may just be a rumor, but it would make sense