moonslav59

Yeah, and I'm the "ignoarnt" one. I hope you're being sarcastic, but a significant percentage of injuries are from guys running to 1B in a straight line. It's really not even close. Football, Basketball and Hockey are much more physically demanding and in many cases involve violent collisions on a regular basis- not once every 5-10 games.

It would be his choice to weigh the risks vs the possible massive enjoyment of having a similar year to this one so far. The fact is, people here have said "I want him to retire". I'm wondering if BILL805 is on this site.

I played baseball, football, basketball and hockey maybe about 300 days a year until I was in my late 20's (mostly baseball and basketball after 21). I played some soccer, raquetball and volleyball as well, but I was talking about the 4 major sports when I said baseball was the "easiest". I guess I was assuming that was implied. Golf, car racing and other mentions are games or hobbies to me- not really sports, but I don't want to get into semantics or arguments about what we should call a sport or not. It's not even close: baseball is by far the easiest sport. Okay, maybe a couple positions are demanding and might be harder than being a placekicker in footb, and if you want to go down that road to prove I was wrong, feel free to go there. Overall, baseball is a cakewalk over any other major sport, especially physically, and that's what we were discussing with Papi and his feet. I never claimed MLB wasn't a mental grind. As much as I played baseball over my life, I never became a very good hitter. Hitting a round ball going 80+ mph with a rounded bat is an exercise in futility. I marvel at the skills of guys like Papi. I realize it takes work, but the work is not as physically demanding as being great at other major sports. Papi is not a pitcher or a catcher. When he does play in the field, he plays 1B- the second most easy position next to DH. I don't say this to try and minimize the pain Papi might feel just walking to the plate. It was meant to put his situation in perspective. Only Papi and his doctors know just how bad his feet are. Like I've said all along, if they are in that bad of shape, then the argument is essentially over, unless Papi chooses to continue to play through pain due to feeling the enjoyment of the game outweighs the pain. If his pain is as bad as many of you seem to think it is, then I guess he should have retired last year or the year before. This season is evidence that Papi enjoys the game enough to play one more season- at least. I don't understand why my position of wanting us to just offer him a tremendous offer and let him decide has been met with such ferocious opposition.

I totally get this sentiment, but I think even Papi might be surprised at having his best career OPS year (by 100 points!) at this point in his career. My guess is he probably expected some decline this year, and maybe that played a part in his decision to say he wanted to retire after this year. My point is that even Papi might be looking at his numbers, looking at how much fun it is to be playing this great, and thinking one more year might be more enjoyable than whatever pain he will go through physically. I just want the Sox to make him a fantastic offer and then respect his final decision. Worst case scenario: he says yes and has an awful season or a serious injury. That would be unofrtunate, but it would be up to Papi to weigh the risk of that ending vs the chance of having another season like this or even 75% of this.

I'm not sure why the Padres would need a replacement now, since they are toast, but if that's true, what about Kelly?

Right. It's not even close to ignorant.

Baseball is the easiest physical game in the world. DH'ing is the easiest position in the easiest physical game in the world. I never said there wasn't a mental grind, so assuming I meant that and am ignorant is a miscalculation on your part. I also mentioned that being a DH involved serious batting practice, but even that is not a big physical activity. I have no idea how much pain Papi is in, and how much going to bat and running the bases from time to time affects his feet. I have said if the pain is too great, then it's obvious what he would probably choose to do. We all know many players love the game so much, the enjoyment outweighs the pain of injury. That's Papi's call no doubt, but I see no harm or disrespect in asking, if he'd consider another year. In fact, I see it more as a sign of deep respect, if the offer is presented in the right way, and the dollar amount shows tremendous respect. Papi has said in the past that dollar offers relate to respect, so $25M for a 41 year old DH, is just about the ultimate show of respect. It's always been his call, and I'm not trying to say it isn't or shouldn't be, but again, I see no harm in asking.

I don't think management going to Papi and saying something like this as not respecting his decision, "We know you have stated you want to retire, and we respect your choice, but we'd just like to know, if you might be interested in playing one more year. We could offer you $20M, and we're willing to give you 2-3 days off a week, if you feel you need to allow your feet to rest as needed. If you say no, we totally understand and there will never be any hard feeling.

Totally agree. $10M a year is nice.

Think they would have taken Owens, Johnson and Dubon?

Didn't Vazquez and Swihart get some time with Wright in the minors? I'm not sure why they keep Hanigan with Wright.

Wow, the CWS only have to pay $27M out of $56M left! They gave uo 26 y/o Johnson- no biggie and 17 y/p SS prospect Fernando Tatis. He could be a great one, but he's a long way from the bigs. Gotta think DD just wasn't that interested. I trust our scouts know more than we do.

I think Rodney has yet to let up a run all year in over 20 IP.

Not sure how BJ and Rodney came to the table but both are having a solid season as far I recall. Kind of like how we had to give up AGon to dump CC and Beckett. The Padres are toast this year. They'd like to cut salary this year and going forward. Dumping Shields and Melvin and their big contracts without taking back Castillo would certainly lessen the return prospect cost, so maybe that's the route to take, but we also don't want to tie our hands financially next year as we lose Papi, Koji and Taz. I added Rodney, since we really need pen help, and we have the prospects any team drools over. I agree that Swihart and Devers is too steep. I do think we can find the right package to land these three. The reason I added Melvin was to replace Swihart in LF and provide salary relief to the Padres. Paying $25M next year for Upton and Young seems hideous, especially when you figure we have Moncada and/or Benintendi near ML ready, but maybe we can find a way to deal them next winter.

It's not about them wanting Castillo. The rumors have the Padres willing to pay part of Shields' contract. They'd probably pay part of Upton's contract as well to get rid of him and his $16.5M 2017 contract. I'm sure the Padres would rather take Castillo than just pay $40M to someone to take these two guys. Castillo still has upside potential. Then, adding Swihart is a great get for the Padres. Adding Devers to get Rodney might be too steep, so maybe we could downgrade my offer to Swihart, Owens AND Johnson plus throw in someone like TBall or Stanki for the three of them.

True. Maybe pitching's a grind to the arm. SS's do a lot of running, even on balls not hit right to them. Even if you look at standing at a position waiting for a ball to be hit to you as a grind, the DH doesn't even have that to deal with. He has batting practice, batting 4-5 times a night, and occasional running or jogging of the bases. I'm not trying to downplay the position to a point where I'm arguing no matter how much pain Papi is in, he should not retire because the job is too easy. I have said over and over, it's up to him, but it seems like some here are implying that I am calling him a wuss for retiring from a cush job. I'm not. I'll totally respect any choice Papi makes, but as a Sox fan, I'm never going to "hope he retires" until he shows me he looks like he can't do it anymore. Could he drop off a cliff and look like an embarrassment next year? Perhaps, but I think that's highly unlikely. Is Curt Schillings 2008 season making $8M to never play the defining moment of his career? Does anyone really think any less of him for thinking he had one more year in him after his nice 2007 season at age 40? He went 3-0 in the playoffs, and all the memories are still good. BTW, Curt had serious foot issues (bloody sock and all) as well and played a much more demanding position for the feet. He was also a big man.

Agreed. Certainly, if his doctors are telling him that playing one more season may cripple or severely hamper his mobility going forward, then he should totally choose what's right for him. Maybe that's the case, but even if it is, his love for the game might lead to choose taking that risk with the idea that the enjoyment he would get out of one more year might outweigh that risk. It's his choice. Maybe offering much more money would not be that much of an enticement, but I do recall him complaining about his contract in the past. Maybe offering a possible part-time job is not enticing either. My point is why not make a cushy offer and let him decide? Some players still enjoy the game even as they play through pain. It's his choice. Us fans have no say, but I certainly do not "want him to retire".

I'm responding to those who are saying... ...he's doing the right thing, IMO ...I hope he retires. ...I say let Ortiz retire on top. Regression is not always linear....players like Papi aren't always going to give you exactly 1-.5 less WAR per year, rather he's just going to fall off a cliff one year. It could have been this year, maybe it would be next, or maybe it would be in 3 years but at 40 years old it would be coming sooner rather than later. I hate seeing players get pushed out of the game because they stink, and I think the offense will survive without him. Invest in pitching and let Ortiz ride into the sunset on top of his game. He deserves that. ...i Dont think you will even get close to his production hes having this year, next year. Sox fans need to just let this guy ride into the sunset at the end of the year and move on. Nobody is saying we should try to force him not to retire, but it seems like several posters here don't even want us to try to entice him to come back. It's like the want him to retire rather than maybe give us an .850 OPS over 100 games next year. I'd take him back with open arms ( no one would not) but minimizing the guy's plight seems unfair to me. That's a fair argument, and like I said, if his pain is too great (greater than I imagine it is), then of course I have no issues with him going off into the sunset without us even trying to bring him back. I'm thinking the Sox have a good idea what he's going through, pain-wise, and will act accordingly. My position is that I feel Papi still has a lot in his tank, and we should offer- not force- a cushy deal for him to return. If he says no, then so be it. If being a DH is too much for his feet to withstand, I'm more than fine with him retiring, but nobody is ever going to convince me that being a DH is a "grind".

All the more reason to think he may have another year in him. He can get a limo ride right to the plane door, right to the hotel door, and right to the stadium gate. He takes some batting practice, takes a whirlpool, gets a massage, sits on the bench for 3 hours a day surrounding 4-5 times he has to walk to the plate and swing a pice of wood a few times. Every now and then he may have to choose to hustle and run fast for 90 or 180 feet. I get that this may be extremely painful for him and reason enough to retire, but where's the harm is giving him a very strong incentive to return for another year- even if at part time.

Where have I ever said that if Papi is in that much pain, he still shouldn't retire? You guys are constructing arguments against a position I do not even hold. All I'm saying is that we should roll out a hundred mile red carpet for this legend and let him decide. It's shocking to me, so many here think that's a bad position to have.

I was talking more about the 20 years of playing baseball, but yeah, 45 games playing 2B, CF or P is harder than 324 playing DH. No, I never had to go on long road trips and walk to the airport gate and hotel room before and after each game. That must be very tiring. Yeah, you guys are right, being a DH is tough these days.

Then walking to the kitchen and dropping a large can of Cream of Mushroom soup on your foot is going to be rough for Papi once he retires. LOL

I was just using his words back at him. It was he who invalidated my opinion. Being a DH is a cakewalk. I've played enough baseball to know that's a valid opinion. Yes, the long road trips and practices and workout sessions are time consuming, but Papi is never forced to be on his feet longer than working as a check-out clerk at Walmart. Sorry, I'm not buying the "grind" argument. I'm not calling anyone a clown for thinking it's way more difficult and for thinking it's a hard and physical demanding job, but I strongly disagree with anyone who thinks such. It's more mentally challenging to be a DH than Physical. Papi seems to have mastered that aspect of the game.

I think your missing my point. Of course 162 games of MLB is more than any rec league baseball schedule, but the guy is a DH. Compared to any other sport, a DH is cush. I'm not saying what a DH does can't inflame foot issues, and I totally would understand if his foot pain and prognosis overrides his will to keep playing the game he so loves and excels at. I'm sorry, but being a DH for 324 games a year is less of a grind than 324 long walks in a park with a few small hills. I have said it's up to him. I don't get why so many here seem to feel rolling out the red carpet for him to return- IF HE WANTS- is such a bad idea.

Replacing him in kind will be costly as well. I know Moncada and Benintendi might be very cheap options by next year, but why pressure them to fill Big Papi's shoes. One (or both) can play LF (Benintendi) after we trade Swihart. One can split time at DH, 1B and 3B (Moncada). The timing works out perfectly, if Papi retires after 2017. Ultimately, it's his call. I hear the talk of foot pain, so I totally understand the notion of him choosing to go out on top of his game, but the guy is currently 100 points above his career high OPS, so maybe he's thinking he loves the game too much to retire with so much production still left in his tank. It's clear he loves playing, so maybe the love will out weigh the pain, and he'll change his mind. Maybe not. Why not roll out a red carpet and make Papi feel like he's never been more appreciated than now. Come back, if you want. We'll reward you with $20+M and days off whenever you want. Free massages and foot treatments. Anything. We love you Papi and we don't want to end the ride just yet.