moonslav59

I’m glad someone at least described their plan rather than just criticizing mine. I don’t think our pitching only needs an ERod re-sign or replacement. I think significant upgrades are needed every year, or you end up going backwards. We are losing a lot of innings from 2021, and counting on Seabold and more innings from Houck, Whitlock and others is pushing our luck.

Change Barnes to Perez, and I’m listening.

I’m for spending just about the whole winter budget on pitching. I’m taking nothing for granted. I’m not paying big time for a closer, so to me, our best bet is to keep Houck in the pen and maybe Whitlock, too. Hope one can be the closer. Spend on starting pitcher(s).

Indeed, but answer my question. Would you rather have Scherzer or Raul IGLESIAS and some other $15 M RPer? Remember, adding a SPer slides Houck into the closer slot at no cost. Give me some names and numbers you add to Schwarber’s cost.

This really exposes how the problem is at the top of the food chain.

I’m pushing it when I say we might have $40M to spend, and that’s assuming nothing changes on the system. I’ve said, if we can spend significantly more than $40M, I’m all in on Schwarber. I’m not ever for spending large on RPers, and if can show me how we can get 3 solid RPers, a utility IFer and Schwarber for under $40M, I’m listening. In short, Whitlock and Houck will fill the two holes in the rotation, but who fills their pen holes plus the Ottavino one? Starting pitcher free agents seem like surer bets than signing RPer FAs, right?

Smooth.

Not telling you what to do, but try taking the long view next time you feel like basing Cora.

That’s why I mentioned “new ones.”

First time an AL team made the ALCS 5 years in row. Wonder if they found a new way to cheat.

Like music to my ears.

Funny how the GM you have bashed shamelessly, ended up “proving you right.” I, on the other hand, felt a cliff was coming and would last longer than a year, but once we hired Bloom, I projected 86 wins “before we signed any free agents,” while you projected 70 at most, and somehow you are always proven right. I admit I was wrong. It’s not as hard to do as you might think.

I feel the same, but I’m tired of people acting like Bloom just got lucky, because this guy was a bum.

Master of spin. We sucked in 2020, and you predicted gloom for 2021, and you call yourself “right.” LOL! You just didn’t call it a cliff. I’ve admitted I was wrong, and it seems you really enjoy bringing it up over and over. Bring it on. No need to ease up. I can take the criticism without going into name-calling. You should try it sometime.

A couple days ago, the talk was we have 1 SPer. I said, if we use both Houck and Whitlock as SPers we’d need 3 top RPers. I even provided a chart with both alternatives.how much will signing 3 of the best 5-7 RPers cost plus a utility man. Subtract that from $40M and that’s what you can pay for Schwarber.

True, but it just seems like the Stros and CWS deserved a prime time game or two.

Robles can throw very hard, so those type of RP'er are often picked up, in hopes they can control it for a couple months. Robles has had more than just a couple nice streaks in his career. He's also had some horrific stretches, but let's not short change the hot streaks: It wasn't long ago, either... 2018: 2.97/1.297 with LAA in 36 IP to end the season after getting traded. 2019: 2.48/1.018 with LAA in 73 IP! That's no short stretch! He only pitched 16 innings in 2020, so I'm not sure how much weight you can give that season. With MN, this year, he started out badly. He then had this run: 1.75 ERA/.676 OPS Against in 26 IP from April 22 to June 21 From June 22 to Aug 6th (including 3 games with the Sox): 11.66/1.157 in 15 IP Aug 7 to end of season: 2.08/.575 in 22 IP So, since the end of 2018, he's had 1/2 good season Full good season bad shortened 2020 season bad start to 2021 good middle to 2021 bad stretch around the trade Great ending to 2020 Kinda like most decent RP'er in MLB. The IP in 2018 and 2019 far outweigh the bas stretches in 2020 and 2021. Add the good stretches of 2021, and he's been good many more IP than bad. Not all that surprising he had a nice stretch- just as it would not have been surprising had he sucked and been DFA'd by us.

DD traded a lot of guys with similar MOs as Dalbec and Houck- not just highly sought after prospects. He deserves credit for holding onto the 3 guys that turned out better than just about everyone he traded, except maybe Moncada and Kopech.

I agree that JD does not opt out. If we don't trade him, the answer to Schwarber should be no, IMO. The Bogey extension is important, but may not be addressed over the winter. Of course, if this is something Bloom thinks needs immediate attention, this choice has to be made before we can look at other choices- agreed. (Let's say we trade Bogey for a pitcher and sign Iggy to play SS, then bringing back Schwarber's bat makes more sense, since we drop a lot of offense at the SS position.) I doubt we address Devers, this winter, but that is just my opinion. Either way, no matter what we do with JD, Bogey and Devers, our great need to improve pitching does not change. The amount of money we have to spend, might change, and another priority need might arise, if one is traded, but nothing changes with the pitching, unless we trade open of these guys for a pitcher. Extending Raffy without adding some pitchers means we are worse, next year.

Sink or swim, I see us starting the year with Dalbec as our FT 1Bman. We don't sign anyone to back him up, unless the utility guy we sign can play first. We count on Casas to be ready, if Dalbec struggles for a long time. We may bring Schwarber back, and have him work out at 1B over the winter, but I don't think the money is there for that luxury. I'd be fine trading JD, if it meant we could sign Schwarber, as long as we don't end up paying more than $3-6M of JD's deal. That might bring the cost of Schwarber to about the same as what JD makes, next year. Adding Iggy would make me feel a lot better about Arroyo at 2B and having a strong back-up at SS (over Arauz). To me, it's about pitching, pitching, pitching and if possible, improving the defense (Iggy). SP1 _____ SP2 Eovaldi SP3 _____ (ERod?) SP4 Sale SP5 Pivetta SP6 Seabold RP1 Houck RP2 Whitlock RP3 _____ RP4 Barnes RP5 Taylor RP6 Brasier RP7 DHern RP8 Sawamura/Davis/Valdez OR SP1 _____ SP2 Eovaldi SP3 Whitlock SP4 Sale SP5 Pivetta SP3 Seabold RP1 Houck RP2 _____ RP3 _____ RP4 Barnes RP5 Taylor RP6 Brasier RP7 DHern RP8 Sawamura/Davis/Valdez 3 Solid pitchers needed- minimum.

You really thought I've been claiming we are in decline and heading towards a cliff?

I'm not saying there is no merit to having both Schwarber and JD on the 2022 roster. Yes, we can create some complex chart whereby we can play Schwarber, JD, Dalbec, Verdugo, Renfroe, Kike and Arroyo 8-9 out of 10 games to accommodate keeping Schwarber at a cost that will surely cut into what we can spend on pitching, and I ask why do that? Some things have changed since we added Schwarber at the deadline: 1) We went from having 4-5 SP'er we could basically count on to 1 or maybe 2, now that ERod stepped up. 2) We lose Richards, Perez, Ottavino and maybe ERod from this roster and have a winter spending budget that necessitates adding 2-4 pitchers. 3) We thought we needed a 1Bman, when we traded for Schwarber. We may not need one after what Dalbec showed us after July 30th. 4) We had doubts about Verdugo and JD on July 30th. Both were sub .700 for an extended period of time, when we traded for KS. Both look more solid, now and don't look like we need to hedge our bets on for 2022. 5) Kike and Renfroe only solidified their hold on FT roles for 2022, after the KS trade. 6) Only Arroyo remains a doubt for 2022, but almost everyone wants to keep Kike in CF, next year, even if it means bringing back Iggy or signing a 2Bman, this winter. So, Kike in CF means platooning Verdugo/Renfroe or squeezing them out of OF playing time, so Schwarber can get some games in there. Sure, it's great to hedge our bets with a deepened bench, but I don't want any of these guys sitting on the bench, unless it's their regularly scheduled day off- maybe 5 games a year. The only exceptions might be Arroyo and Dalbec vs a few RHPs. Of course, I'd rather have Scharbers bat in the line-up over Dalbec and or Arroyo, but taking away low cost capable players away from the line-up comes at a heavy financial cost. It's not just answering the question, "Is the gain worth it?" The overriding question, IMO, is WHERE can we spend a limited winter spending budget to bring the most bang for the buck? All our starting pitchers are healthy, and before yesterday, we were all agreeing we have but one SP'er we can trust. For the love of God! I'm sorry for getting overly dramatic, but for the life of me, I'm thinking every penny, save maybe a couple for a utility IF'er like maybe Iggy, should and needs to be spent on pitching. Just bringing back ERod will add $10M out of maybe $40M Bloom will have to spend- and that just keeps that one rotation slot even. Much is being said of expanding the roles and IP'd by Whitlock and Houck, and how that can fill much of our winter pitching needs, and I don't disagree, but let's face it, we are not adding 2 new pitchers with those two. At best, we are adding maybe 150 IP combined from 2021 to 2022. That's like adding one solid pitcher. If we keep them both in the pen, a possible scenario, we won't be adding much more than 50-100 IP from the two combined. IMO, we need an ace or a very solid #2, and with Eovaldi's deal up after 2022, I'm leaning towards an ace. That's $25-30M right there. That's it- the whole budget: $27M SP'er +$10M ERod $3M Iggy We can't even replace Ottavino's innings. How do we squeeze $15-18M a year for Schwarber into $40M and upgrade the staff like we need to? Don't offer ERod a QO? Don't sign an ace? Move Houck and Whitlock to the rotation and pray that works, while filling 3-4 pen slots with the $18M left over after signing Schwarber and Iggy? Maybe. I'd prefer to spend on pitching. I'd love to have Schwarber back, and if Henry okays us spending close to $55M, this winter, then count me in.

More importantly, to me, he chose to keep Devers, Dalbec & Houck.

The Houston area is very upset with the game times.

2022 End of Team Control Ottavino Richards (no on option) Perez (no on option) Robles Santana Shaw (Marwin, Iggy & Andriese already gone) QO? ERod Opt Out? JD (no?) Schwarber (yes) Again, that's a lot of money off the books and only Schwarber and maybe ERod needing serious consideration for replacement by addition to the roster. Let's say 7 slots become open (Schwarber plus the 6 FAs). We replace 5-6 with Rule 5 protection players: Bello Santos Winckowski Downs Maybe 1 or 2 from Feltman, Crawford That leaves room for 1-2 outside additions before you have to start trading or DFA'ing bubble players players: 1 from Plawwecki, Hernandez/Wong Davis Potts Rosario Arauz Cordero Sawamura