moonslav59

Nice to see you supporting all or players, No throwing anyone specific under the bus. Thank you for your optimism.

Well said. BTW, I do not think Bloom is averse to trading away prospects, even top ones, when the moment is right. The biggest Bloom bashers seem to be the ones that wanted us to go all in at the deadline, despite complaining about what a crappy team Bloom built. This was not the year or the deadline to go all in or even moderately "in."

We had some pretty amazing defensive CF'er and RF'er in those days.

We've gone over this enough. Wasn't moving him from RF to LF moving him around, too?

Thank God. Imagine Swi as our GM!

Agreed.

Bogaerts was extended, but the damn opt out got in the way. You are right. Pedey was the "last one," and maybe his example has scared the top brass.

I don't disagree, but I do think we might have to let one or two positions "slide,: if we are to significantly upgrade some positions or just stay even at SS. I do think catcher is a bigger need than 1B, but I'm assuming Casas will come through. Having Hosmer tilts the balance towards needing a catcher more. Which position of need do you see as being the highest to lowest priority for fixing (winter additions?) Here's mine (top listed first): 1. 2B/SS (whichever Story does not play): Arroyo & Valdez (Downs/Yorke/Lugo) 2. CF: Duran, J Davis (Rafaela) 3. Catcher: McGuire, Wong, RHern (Cottam) 4. SP 1/2: Sale/Paxton 5. RF: Dugo, Refsnyder (Abreu) 6. 1B/DH: Casas, Hosmer, Dalbec (Kavadas) 7. Pen (beyond Houck & Whitlock): Schreiber, Brasier, Taylor, Davis, Barnes, Sawamura, German, Danish (Ort/Feltman) 8. SP 5/6: (Whitlock?) Winckowski, Crawford, Bello, Mata, Seabold (Walter/Murphy) (One could make 9 slots with DH being #9 (Hosmer/Dalbec/Cordero/Granberg/Kavadas) How do you guys rank our 2023 need areas? Which do you think we fill from within, without any additions or minor ones?

It seems to me, and I could be wrong, again, that the biggest Bloom bashers are the ones who were cliff deniers, and maybe they are just pissed that 2021 made them feel they were right about there never having to be a cliff. Now, they are just frustrated and bitter. Just a theory.

I'm talking about when they played Arroyo in RF, instead of JBJ or Verdugo. Why not Dugo in RF and Arroyo in LF. Only those games.

. True, but maybe we can pass the O's. Ben had 3 last place finishes. I hope Bloom doesn't match that. I don't think he will. I'd like to add that I feel Ben was handed a better team, a better spending budget and a better farm than Bloom. Last place is last place. There is no sugar-coating it, but 2020 was one major cluster, that in my opinion, cannot be blamed even 33% on Bloom, let alone more than 50% (if blame is your thing.)

Verdugo had played RF, and in Fenway, before. Arroyo had not. Put the weaker defender in Fenway's LF. It's not rocket science. It's b een Red Sox strategy for over a century.

Or, some similar data/metric, perhaps of their own.

Or, he could be a 2B option, next year and beyond, as Story moves to SS. Or, he just becomes a utility/DH type player. Or, he never makes a dent in the bigs. The more choices you have, the better odds one or more come through. I would like to start seeing more quality over quantity, but the quantity method has merit, too, especially when you started out with a bottom 5 farm.

That's how I see it. We may squeak into the playoffs, and that would be awesome, but this team is not going to win a ring. I'd be thrilled to be proven wrong, but I'm much more optimistic about 2023 and beyond. To each, his own.

I don't know what you are talking about. I don't hold Vaz in disdain. I offer criticism of one aspect of his game, and you act like I'm saying he sucks, with this "yet another shot" crap. It's always been about just one thing with Vaz- not several different ones. If someone says Vaz sucked, I'd defend him and have, by pointing out his good aspects, namely offense for a catcher, blocking the plate and other areas. I don't take Bloom criticism personally, and I have criticized him, myself, many times. You seem to take issue with one criticism of Vaz. Maybe saying you are "thin-skinned" is going overboard, but you never fail to jump on that point being made and blow it into some some sort of vendetta against Vaz. I have 3 people on ignore- two are trolls, after going years without ever doing it. I disagree with a lot of posters, often, including you, but you are not unreasonable and don't make it personal and are respectful. I've never considered putting you on ignore, although I'm pretty sure, you could care less. I'm hopeful about McGuire, Pham, Hosmer and the prospects. I have no disdain for Vaz. I did for Diekman and Robles (this year.)

Kinda what I was thinking.

Eventually, some players doing well in the minors actually do well in the bigs. I'm not sure why some seem to be against adding good prospects. While increasing potential value might amount to nothing, isn't that the way farms are supposed to be improved? Is there some other way to do it I'm not aware of? Sure, talk the talk of developing pitchers in better ways, identify draftees in better ways, and other areas, and all we can hope for is that we are trying to and actually improving in those areas, but adding promising prospects should be viewed as a good thing. BTW, we've had some recent successes with pitching prospects: Houck, Whitlock, Wickowski, Crawford and some flashes of promise from Bello.

lmao!

Arroyo has done pretty damn well, when he's healthy. There was no way he was going to play 2B, 3B or SS, unless there was an injury, so I can't blame Cora for trying him in the OF. The best spot would have been LF, but we already had too many LF'ers on the team. Again, I go back to Dugo. Why not play Dugo in RF and Arroyo in LF? Now that JBJ is gone, suddenly Dugo can play RF. I'm still puzzled.

It's no secret I've never been Vaz's biggest supporter, but I have never called for his removal as our primary catcher. I think he has been a net plus, over the years, despite some down offensive seasons, here and there. I know many of you feel CERA-related data is hocus pocos, and that's fine, but I feel it needs to be pointed out after hearing all the Oooing and fawning over what a great player and clubhouse leader Vaz has been. I wish he was still on the team, but I think we got better after the deadline- both in 2022 and going forward. Bash away, if you must. It's become a habit for you. The thing I find funny, is how you, and others, bash away at so many Sox players, the manager and the GM then seem so thinned-skinned when someone criticizes just one aspect of a player you hold in esteem.

People just looked at Vaz being traded and lept to the conclusion we were giving up. In many ways, we were "buyers and sellers," something I suggested was a real possibility. In a rather remarkable way, the Sox seemed to get better for 2022 and beyond, at the same time. Catcher: looks like they got worse for 2 months of 2022 but better or deeper for 2023 and 2024. Giving up Diekman, alone, was a plus, by itself. 1B: They improved immensely in 2022, at no financial cost. They improved in 2023 and 2024, at least in 1B depth and choices. They gave up Groome, so the future might have taken a hit, if he amounts to anything. OF: Pham was certainly an improvement for 2022, and he has an option for 2023: win-win. Who the PTBNL is might hurt the long term. Farm: We lost Groome, who might not have been protected, next year, anyway and the PTBNL for Pham. We added Valdez, Abreu and Almonte- all doing very well, this year: Enmauel Valdez 1.017 OPS in 2022 1.043 AAA WOR (29 AB) .907 AAA Sugar Land (159 AB) 1.112 AA (168 ABs) 25 HRs and 89 RBI in just 458 ABs Wilyer Abreu .842 in '22 .858 AA CC (329 ABs) .648 AA POR (27 ABs) 15 HRs and 56 RBI in 356 ABs Abraham Almonte .942 in '22 .1.037 AAA WOR (56) .913 AAA NAS (184) I'd say the future looks much brighter, while the here and now is, at worst, the same. For this, not surprisingly, Bloom has taken a lot of criticism, mostly from fans who have bashed this team as being losers almost from day one. Again, not surprisingly.

It was actually the most unproductive hits I've ever seen. Only the Sox can fail to score from 3B on a single. (That has to be rarer than a no-hitter.)

I think they figured returning pitchers from the IL were like team additions. Of course, the Sale injury occurred beofre the deadline. BTW, I thought, when we signed Paxton, he was due back in July or August.

I forgot the date, I said that your team would begin a pitching slump. My guess is, I got lucky and your team has a significantly worse ERA and FIP after that date that took on a life of its own on this discussion board.