moonslav59

DD traded 20 prospects who had once been top 20 in the system. The fact that many never came close to expectations or had dropped in the rankings before being traded, does not take away from the fact that a ton of prospects were traded. Thankfully, he kept the one blue-chipper, Devers. I think only Matt Barnes was a prospect DD inherited and was still around when he left. I could be wrong, here. Players he added through the draft and IFA are shockingly promising: Houck & Crawford (graduated) Casas Murphy Rafaela Mata Wikelman Paulino Walter Perales

Ben might still be here had he signed Scherzer and not Pablito & HRam.

Yup, and Travis Shaw kinda sucked for us, then did better after the trade. Kinda like Downs was a decent prospect when we traded for him, but sucked for the Sox.

All true, and if dumping Bloom makes us better or would make us better, I'd be in the front of the line. The farm building aspect is all speculation, as it always has been. It looks good on paper to almost everyone but Law & his followers, but we all know there are countless examples of good farms not ending up so good, and vice versa. The DD farm situation is a prime example. Most felt he inherited a great farm and squandered it, but the ring won made it worth it. When you go back and look, many of the "studs" he traded away fizzled or got hurt, He kept the right one, in Devers, but the 5 year lull in farm help is a big reason for the team's decline. Then, DD was slammed for handing Bloom an empty and unpromising farm, but we've seen some promise nobody felt was possible. Half our best prospects and recent grads are DD's prospects. It does show, it's hard to know, but I feel better knowing many experts feel our farm has greatly improved. It's my biggest reason for having an optimistic view about the team and its direction.

Certainly true. That doesn't mean thinking there were several more options for trading Betts with half-Price out there has merit. Conflating that specific trade with JH could have spent more, to me, it total BS thinking, but maybe that's just me. I know I'm often in the minority and can be ornery at time.

I don't think Bloom is as good as you think I feel he is. I end up defending him against specific assaults that have very little to do with him. You can continue to think there was another fork in the road, but for someone who poo-poo's speculation more than anyone, you sure do your fair share.

This how you remind me of Swihart's Ghost. You seem to delight in some Sox player failures, if it supports your position.

soxprospects.com actually has Hamilton as the AAA SS. AAA 2B Valdez SS Hamilton 3B Koss AA 2B Yorke SS Ferguson 3B Lugo A+ 2B Bonaci (another ex SS) SS Mayer 3B Paulino A- 2B Liendo SS Romero 3B Salazar

Another unrelated, non answer.

Agreed, but it still seems like a select few posters really want to embrace his analysis, almost- and I stress the word almost- like they want the farm to fail, so we fire Bloom and maybe they can strut around saying, "I told you they were all just suspects."

Indeed, and I have a lo0ng list of "coulda done better" on Bloom that actually have merit.

I think you've said you would not be surprised to see Mayer in MLB, this year, so wouldn't he count as a proispect other GMs would want, badly?

How is this a rebuttal? I wanted Mookie to stay, and as far as I know, I'm the only one who would have given him 14 years? You keep equating the thinking that Bloom was forced to trade Betts, and probably got close the best he could for him as the same as wanting it to happen, thinking it was a good idea, or thinking it was a good trade. I have always wanted us to keep Betts and wish we still had him. What is the rebuttal? That our farm is full of suspects? (That seems to be your answer to every point made, no matter how unrelated.)

I'm not sure, if you are counting Lugo as a promising MI'er, but they moved him to 3B, too.

Why do I get the feeling some want to trust Law's ranking over the others?

When is the last time we even had 8 prospects or "suspects" beating on the MLB door, at the same time? We have over 10, now, and that's not counting Bello, Wink and Wong, who just graduated. I agree, none on this list, other than Casas & Mayer are close to sure bet contributors, but many have enough promise to be optimistic about, if you choose to be. Casas Mayer Rafaela Mata Walter Murphy EValdez Kelly That's a decent 8, with some fringy types like Abreu, Hamilton, RHern & Ort.

I'm not sure any team, other than the Dodger, would have also taken on half-Price's salary. I realize everyone knows this, but when you hear generalizations like, "BLoom could have done better," I wonder with what team? IMO, no other team takes $42M on without asking us to take a salary dump in return or to pay down more of Price's deal. I know there were a few guys, like 700, who felt the Dodgers wanted Price at that money, but I seriously doubt that to be true. It wasn't just trading Betts.

Talk about regurgitation.

fangraphs has the Sox 9th Prospects1500 has the Sox system 11th MLB.com 11th (Aug '22) si.com 11th (Aug '22) oddschecker 11th (Sept '22) Bleacher Reports 19th Quite a spread, but it looks like maybe we are middle 10 or maybe top 35-40%, at best. Not great. We only just graduated Bello, so we can't really use that as an excuse. I expected better. I still have hopes our system is better than what some of these guys think, but this is their business. They have been wrong before, and I'm hopeful they are wrong here. Personally, I think our farm is a lot better than it was 3 years ago. soxprospects.com Fall '19 1. Casas 2. Mata 3. Groome 4. Jimenez 5. Dalbec 6. Duran 7. Houck 8. Song 9. Chatham 10. TWard 11. Zeferjahn 12. A Ramirez 13. C Murphey 14. Lugo 15. Decker 16. Cannon 17. Bello 18. A Flores 19. Rafaela 20. M Wilson Others in the system not in top 20 back then: Walter, Perales, Paulino, Wikelman & Bonaci Bloom's Additions: Graduated (top ranking): 4. Whitlock 9. Winckowski 11. Wong 41. Ort On farm: 1. Mayer 3. Bleis 5. Yorke 7. Romero 9. Anthony 15. Jordan 17. E Valdez 18. Hickey 19. E R-C 20. Kavadas 21. Coffey 23. Drohan 24. Kelly 25. R Hern 26. Abreu 27. Bannon 28. Paez 29. Uberstine 30. Hamilton Seems like the whole league musta got better, if this isn't improvement.

He made $1.4M in 2022 and will make $2M in 2023. That's a $600K raise.

Wow! I now love Brasier and wonder if he should be our closer.

DHern cleared waivers by the O's and will be in their minors. The Dodgers have said they will not make trades to get under the tax line. (They seem to be about $5M over, now.)

Exactly. Counting it like a 12 get by the Dodgers has merit, but that does not mean we gave up 12 years of Betts. Also, how do we dump half-Price or full-Price, if we kept Betts? Casas, Bello & Price for Downs? Bogey and 3/4 Price for Downs and Wong? JD & Bogey for Verdugo, Downs & Wong? It's easy to just say, "Botch!" and anyone who brings up Price is just adding spin, but was an alternative plan? (I know, I know: "JH should have spent more money.")

How long do you think? It usually takes 4-6 years before drafted players make an impact- maybe 3, if you draft some polished college guys. We just graduated some of DD's guys after a 5 year stretch of getting just Houck: Bello Crawford Duran Dalbec We've seen some of Bloom's guys like... Whitlock Wink Wong Kelly The next guys coming up are a mix of DD and Bloom guys... Mata Walter Murphy Mayer Rafaela Valdez Ort Yorke Lugo Kavadas...

Underperform implies lofty expectations for team that was in serious decline and then cut the budget and had no farmhands ready to step in and even play at replacement levels.