moonslav59

No doubt. Keeping Betts and the same 2020 budget, would have meant dumping what salary? (Sale, in hindsight, of course.)

Agreed. I asked about RF.

All he really has is the Schwarber deal. (McGuire, Shaw, Iggy and Robles were okay.) (Abreu might change the narrative, a bit.)

I guess we can argue about what average is, but from 2021-2022, there were 150 SP'ers with 130+ IP. Here is where Monty placed: 27th in IP at 336 (top 20% tier) 36th in fWAR at 5.9 (2nd tier and 0.1 away from top tier) 39th in xFIP at 3.66 (0.13 away from top tier) 54th in ERA at 3.66 (2nd tier and 0.43 from 30th) 55th in ERA- at 90 He looked like a very solid #2 tier pitcher in those 2 years- maybe even a borderline 1/2 tier. If you combine his last 3 years, he tilts to top tier (top 30,) to me. Above average, at least.

He also said, during his hiatus, he saw all he needed to see from the box scores.

If he hadn't signed Story to $140M and spent over $100M on Yoshida, it would be more understandable, at least for the last 2 seasons. I do wonder if the top brass was against signing any pitchers to 2 or more years and more than $10M per year, until Gio.

You prefer O'Neill in RF over Duvall? (It's a close call, to me.) I just hate pushing Duran to CF, FT.

One strong argument for not extending Betts and for dumping half-Price was the idea that we could maybe spend that money on 3-5 players that could come close to what we lost. We spent only a fraction of that money, as well as not spending the Porcello money lost. (BTW, nobody is complaining about not extending him, either.)

They did not "have to," but they did. In one breath you blsme JH not Bloom, then say there was no "impossible" budget situation (implied for building the roster back up.]. After 2019, we lost Betts, Price and Porcello from the budget and the roster and spent pennies on the dollar. The winter spending budget before 2021 did not come close to replacing those lost players, plus the ones lost after 2020. It seemed impossible, to me, although the 2021 team somehow did pretty well. With the Story signing, the budget situation was "not impossible," agreed. The expenditures for 2020: $11M for JBJ (avoided last arb) Other arbs: ERod, Barnes... $6M Perez $4.2M Pillar $2.8M Peraza $1.5M Lucroy All the rest were under $1M Obviously, the budget was a major obstacle to building that team to respectability. We traded away Moreland, Pillar and others, and let JBJ walk after '20. Here was our budget for '21: $10M Richards $8M Ottavino (trade) $7M x 2 Kike $5M Perez $3M Renfroe $3M Marwin (All others were below $1M) 2022 looked like a repeat, until the March signing of Story.

I totally agree. The budget was the biggest constraint, and if we somehow found a way to keep all 5, or even just Betts, Bogey and Nate, but still had the same budgets, the rest of the 40 man roster would have looked like crap, or worse. While I realize we need some stars to win, we also would have needed a strong base and feeding pattern than this: The 20 that was in serious need or upgrading, going into 2020 (Some may have forgotten just how bad the bottom of our 40 was, when DD departed.): Brian Johnson (5th SP) Ryan Brasier H Hembree Marco Hernandez Sam Travis DHern Cashner H Velazquez Ryan Weber Colten Brewer Josh A Smith, Lakins, Chacin, Shawaryn, Poyner, T Kelley, C Owings, Gorkys Hernandez The AAA team was basically this: Kyle Hart Daniel McGrath Teddy Stankiewicz Tanner Houck Domingo Tapia Jenrry Mejia Austin Maddox Zach Putnam Erasmo Ramirez Kevin Lenik C: Oscar Hernandez, Jake Romanski 1B: Ockimey & Witte 2B: Deiner Lopez 3B: Dalbec SS: CJ Chatham/ T-W Lin LF: Sturgeon/Brentz CF: Matheny RF: Rusney DH: Chavis Other top prospects below AAA: 3. Casas 6. Groome 7. A Flores (RIP) 9. Feltman 10. Mata 11. Howlett 12. Decker 13. Duran 14. D Diaz 16. Jimenez 17. Northcut 18. Scherff 19. D reyes 20. Schellenger Call it a roster full or mediocrity, and I won't disagree, but our 21-40 and farm, right now, look much better than the 21-40 + farm did at the end of 2019. We have more to do to become a consistent winner, for sure, but I like our depth better than before.

Hardly "impossible."

There has been a long line of one year deals, since the Bogey, Sale & Nate signing/extensions. Only 3 have been longer than 2 years: Whitlock, Story & Yoshida: Kike $14M/2 (brought back for $10M/1) Sawamura $3M/2 w option (gone before year 3) Barnes extension $18.8M/2 w option (gone before year 3) Diekman $8M/2 (gone before year 2) 1 year plus option Martin Perez (re-signed for 1 more w option that was declined) Moreland (traded before year 2) Garrett (team declined option) Andriese (team declined option) Paxton (Paxton took 2nd year option)

Posters are longing for the days of Betts & Bogey and the rest, and no doubt, we all wish they were still here. That foundation of 8 players was awesome. It's hard to imagine that core winning, however, with that bottom 20 on the 40, and even less dollars to spend on improving it, as keeping Betts, Price, Porcello (or the like,) Bogey, JD, ERod some of the supporting cast was impossible under the budget circumstances. Plus, keeping JBJ, Price, Porcello, Moreland, Holt and several others would not have helped us win after 2019, anyway. A big change to the 40 man roster was inevitable, but man o man, it still looks so shocking: Devers & Dalbec is it.

Actually, a semicolon.

Better D in CF should help, but that will likely not be enough to get us to the playoffs. It would make watching the games more enjoyable. I think Grissom will be more than adequate, on D by season's end The Wong-McGuire combo needs to improve, but are nearing the ages where, historically, many do.

That could be a plan. To me, why not just spend on pitching and see what Duran can do for us at a low cost. This fixation with LF/DH types is driving me nuts. Duran is fine in LF, to me. Okay, he hits lefty, but he has speed that can help us win in different ways. Just roll the dice with Rafaela, Abreu and Ref (Yoshi, at times) as the 3rd OF'er and use the resources available to get the best SP'er the budget allows. I'd be happier with Lauer and Duran than Soler or Duvall and maybe Cabrera (for Duran.)

In your head.

It's crazy to look at the 40 man roster seniority ranking (date added to the 40, not time in the Sox system.) Devers, of course, is #1 (added 7/24/17 right before his call-up) Bobby Dee is #2 (added 11/20/19 to avoid Rule 5.) #3 is Nick Pivetta! WOW! (Added 8/21/20) Houck, Mata, Wong and Whitlock were added after Sept 15, 2020, and Duran is #8 by being added in the summer or 2021. That's some serious roster turn-over. Here was the 40 Man Roster to end 2019: The 12 Man Foundation: Betts, Bogey, JD, Devers, JBJ, Beni, Vaz Eovaldi, Price, ERod, Porcello (Sale on IL) The Supporting 8 Holt, Moreland, Leon, Marco Hernandez Workman, Barnes, Josh Taylor, Walden The 20 that was in serious need or upgrading, going into 2020 (Some may have forgotten just how bad the bottom of our 40 was, when DD departed.): Brian Johnson (5th SP) Ryan Brasier H Hembree Marco Hernandez Sam Travis DHern Cashner H Velazquez Ryan Weber Colten Brewer Josh A Smith, Lakins, Chacin, Shawaryn, Poyner, T Kelley, C Owings, Gorkys Hernandez The AAA team was basically this: Kyle Hart Daniel McGrath Teddy Stankiewicz Tanner Houck Domingo Tapia Jenrry Mejia Austin Maddox Zach Putnam Erasmo Ramirez Kevin Lenik C: Oscar Hernandez, Jake Romanski 1B: Ockimey & Witte 2B: Deiner Lopez 3B: Dalbec SS: CJ Chatham/ T-W Lin LF: Sturgeon/Brentz CF: Matheny RF: Rusney DH: Chavis Other top prospects below AAA: 3. Casas 6. Groome 7. A Flores (RIP) 9. Feltman 10. Mata 11. Howlett 12. Decker 13. Duran 14. D Diaz 16. Jimenez 17. Northcut 18. Scherff 19. D reyes 20. Schellenger I wasn't kidding, when I said Bloom had about 20-22 slots to upgrade before 2020 and a tiny winter budget to do it. (On top of that, we lost Betts, Price and Porcello to trades and free agency and ERod & Sale to injury or COVID.) But, of course, context is just excuse-making.

Orioles confirm sale of team. Watch what kind of profit these guys make from what they bought the team for.

It's not a big concern, at all. If it were up to me, he'd play 1B 159-162 games. Cora is not likely to change his ways on resting everyone 8-10 games. (I hope he does.) There is not much else to talk about, but it is a curiosity, as of now.

Strong up the middle on D might not be enough. If Duran is part of the "middle," I'm not sure we can say that, either.

Agreed. It would force Yoshida or Soler to play LF just about every game. That forces Duran to CF and O'Neill to RF. It makes no sense. It may move the needle for me, but in the wrong direction!

The first thing I looked for on him was, does he play 1B, too. Nope.

Hey, according to one poster, reading the box score counts as an "eye test." I could never bring myself to stop watching, but I don't blame you for the choice.

It would not be much different than the Turner or Duvall signings, last year. It would actually make me more suspect about the team's ability to identify their highest need area and fill it accordingly.