Maxbialystock

Since we are second guessing Cora. I think Nunez and Kinsler are both over the hill. Holt especially deserves 2b tonight. I also question Vazquez in for Leon because Porcello has pitched well (ERA 2.25) in 24 innings against the Yankees this year and I think Leon caught all 24 innings.

For the record: well done on the game thread last night. You were the right guy.

Completely agree. But in general terms I think most managers are evaluated on wins and losses and whether those exceed or fall short of what was reasonably (or unreasonably) expected. Specifically, if Boone had made better moves last night, the score might well have been closer, but a loss was a pretty sure thing. Severino stunk. Eovaldi was very much on his game. And once again the vaunted Yankees bullpen could not have turned the tide. See game 1 when they did 6 scoreless innings and the Yankees still lost. Going into this ALDS was I was sure the Yankee bullpen would make a difference because theirs is so much better than ours. But so far it hasn't. Granted, a small sample size, but that's the nature of the playoffs.

Interesting about last night and Vaz. I entirely agree all Sabathia needs to do is 4 good innings. But guess what? In games 1 and 3 neither Happ nor Severino could do that. Same goes for Price in game 2. So 4 good innings would seem to be a rather lofty goal. Porcello has pitched against the Yankees several times this year for a total of 24 innings and 6 earned runs--an ERA of 2.25. Not too shabby. Just one dinger, also not too shabby. But I think all 24 innings were with Leon behind the plate. So you could have a point.

This. Someone else said it too, but it's right. A win tonight means Sale leads off vs. the Astros. My goodness, but to me the the world just turned upside down. These huge wins are real hard on us pessimists. I will say again one more time. All three games have been won by one team's starting pitcher--Sale, Tanaka, and Eovaldi--who was each time much better than the other starter--Happ, Price, and now Severino. I think the Yankees have a much better bullpen, but so far they have not made a difference (but came close in game 1). I also think the Yankees have a better lineup, but it was the Sox who destroyed Happ and Severino who very recently shut our guys down. Stories about how dumb Boone was last night, but his team lost 16-1 so that's kind of hard for me to see. On the other hand, I really have to give Cora a ton of credit. Going into this series the Yankees had the hot bats and the world class bullpen. We should have had the edge in rotations, but I expected Happ to outduel Sale based on the evidence of September when Sale was struggling to recover from the shoulder or whatever and Happ was just great. On the other hand I hoped Price would outpitch Tanaka, which absolutely did not happen. So Eovaldi, who did pitch well against the Yankees is last 2 times--0 runs in 14 innings--needed to come thru against Severino. that he did so was a complete surprise to me. To me Cora has made the right moves, pure and simple. He changed the lineup for last night, but he won game 1 with the old lineup of Leon, Nunez, and Kinsler. In game 1 he brought in exactly the right guy, Brasier, who promptly gave up a single that led to 2 runs, both charged to Sale and made the score 5-2. From then on it was the perils of pauline, including that opposite field dinger by Judge off Kimbrel's knuckle curve to make the score 5-4 in the 9th.

Exactly right, especially your last sentence. I was dead wrong in my pessimism after the first two games, but still cling to this part of it: don't underestimate the Yankees based on last night's game. They still have great hitting and one of the best bullpens around. Our two wins were both led by great starting pitching against a very hot Yankees lineup.

Amen. If we have learned nothing else this year, we should have learned how important the catcher is for the overall defense because of his effect on the pitching. Swihart is easily the best athlete of the three and probably the best hitter, but Leon and Vazquez are better at the essential task of defensive catching. They both have positive DWAR's and his is negative. More than that, it is more and more apparent that the pitching staff is more comfortable with the other two behind the plate. I agreed with bosoxmal in the OP--that it was time to give Holt and Devers a shot. I would have done so vs. Tanaka, but also think Cora knows a lot more than I. Last night showed that Vazquez can catch a pretty good game and maybe get a hit now and then which Leon seems increasingly unable to do. That's why Vazquez was the regular catcher before his injury.

Sorry, but to me it's hard to blame a score of 16-1 on the manager. This was in fact the third straight game in this ALDS in which the team with the better starter won, pure and simple. It also ignores the effectiveness of Eovaldo in shutting down the Yankees lineup. These are the guys who set the MLB record for dingers in a season and who were playing in the most hitter-friendly park in MLB. Boone might have kept things closer, but this was a debacle from the beginning.

Definitely.

Gotta hit the sack. What an amazing win.

Really?

This ump is easily the worst I can remember. At least he is bad for both sides, but that don’t make it right.

Eovaldi vs. Severino Both righties, edge to Severino, but on August 4 and Sep 18 Eovaldi went 14 innings and gave up 0 runs--and the latter game was in the Bronx. Severino is back, no question--he was terrific in the wild card game. But I expect our pitching to be pretty good, including the bullpen. The starters won/lost the first two games and that could well be the case tonight. Betts RF Benintendi LF Martinez DH Bogaerts SS Devers 3b Pearce 1B Holt 2B Vazquez C Bradley CF Cora rolls the dice with three new faces--Holt @ 2B (long overdue), Devers @ 3B (a gamble made easier by Nunez horrible defense in game 2), and Vazquez at C. I like this lineup and I even like the bullpen after Saturday's game. Time to win one for a pretty darn good fan base, especially the ones on this site. Max

And it almost perfectly describes my perspective. I became a Sox fan in 1949 and so endured 55 years of the 86 year curse, so I claim to come by my pessimism honestly and am all the more delighted when I am wrong. That said, the more recent discussion on this thread is a heckuva more interesting than my moaning and groaning. In fact, you said something especially apt--this is now a 3 game series, pure and simple.

No need to apologize for a knuckleballer because the darn thing works. Wright can in fact throw a fast ball in the 80's and has a big sweeping knuckle curve. But he sticks to the knuckler almost exclusively because it works. If you throw out just one game, that horrendous start in June when he gave up 10 runs in 3 innings and promptly went on the DL, Wright went 50 innings and 19 games this year and gave up 6 runs for an ERA of 1.08. In September he gave up 1 ER on 13 innings. But clearly the knee is a problem.

Agree on the talent. Five tool player, sort of. Great arm and skill in playing right field. Hit and hit with power. Baserunning only OK. But I never liked him because he never played enough.

Speaking for the pessimists, I have to say I like the very strong rebuttals by the optimists here and on the game thread. Well done. It's just one game. Sox will sweep in Yankee Stadium when we bring out our righty starters. This is the same team that won 108 games, most in Sox history. We lost the ALDS in 2016 and 2017 because of Farrell, no one else, and now we have Cora. The only thing missing is that hit song from Damn Yankees--You Gotta Have Heart (all you really need is heart).

Wow. I have to ask just why you are so optimistic when the Sox are playing exactly the way they played in the last two ALDS's, when Price once again got hammered in the postseason (where he is now 0-10), when the Yankees bullpen remains so dominant, and when their lineup is so relentless? As the OP says, forget last night, it happens. The scary game was Friday night when we won after Sale had a great start--his longest since July 27--and JDM hit a 3 run dinger and the Sox should have been off to the races. Nope. Enter our woebegone bullpen and the Yankees lineup which had us Sox fans on the edge or our seats until the last out in a 5-4 win. Now we are headed for Yankee Stadium where the Sox are 3-6 for the year. I agree it's not over. Not in baseball. Not after being down 0-3 to the Yankees in the 2004 ALCS and 1-3 to the Guardians in the 2007 ALCS. There is always hope. But let me tell you something loud and clear. If you aren't worried, you aren't paying attention.

Not much to say. The Yankees just look like the better team. Their hitting and their bullpen for sure--way, way better then ours. And we knew all of this last month. Plus even their defense looks better than ours. To add insult to injury, Tanaka completely outpitched Price last night. Friday night was the harbinger. Sale pitched a gem, JD Martinez got the huge 3 run dinger, and the Sox barely won because our bullpen stinks, the Yankees' doesn't, and the Yankees hitters are relentless. I think most or all of this falls on DD. He spent like a drunken sailor on starting pitching and for guys like Price, Porcello, and the late, great Pomeranz. But, except for Kimbrel, he didn't do much about the bullpen. He did fix the lineup however with JD Martinez. That's how come the 108 wins--the Sox also scored the most runs in MLB (but only barely because the Yankees were gaining on us).

OK, OK. Good no-sub for Nunez.

I don't want pinch hitters for Nunez and Kinsler. I want Devers and Holt to sub for them. Pinch hit for Leon only if someone's on.

Judge is actually a gazelle out there. He has great speed, good hands, excellent timing, and a very good arm. Darn it.

OK, it is now a fact that Tanaka is getting more calls than our guys. Probably because he stays pretty close to the strike zone.

The Yankees only have a 3 run lead. Leon gets partial credit for Price's debacle, but also partial credit for Kelly's sterling 2 innings in relief. Leaving Leon in is mild insurance the Sox bullpen can keep it close. I seriously doubt a pinch hitter in the 3d would have made a difference. Tanaka is working our guys over pretty good. So far I think Cora is managing this game just fine.

I would too. After last night, I raved about Leon's catching. But tonight he gets partial credit for Price stinking up the joint. Still, it's only the 3d inning.