jacksonianmarch

I think you're reading too much into this. We all knew Papelbon was going to set the market for closers. He did. He didnt want to give the sox a chance to match because he was waiting for a market setting contract. If he got what he wanted, he wasnt going to go back to the sox and ask them to match it. If the sox offered him that contract out of the getgo, then he's still in a sox uniform

The Sox had an offer out there that they wouldnt budge on and the Yankees did a quick strike and didnt allow them to shop the offer. It's good negotiating, but typically means you have the top offer by a fair amount, otherwise it doesnt work

I havent disagreed with you at all. This is a big money contract in length and AAV, and is unprecedented in the history of closers. From a business standpoint, this is a risky deal. It all depends, though, on what the sox planned to allocate towards Paps and what that vesting option is. If the vesting option vests after the first 3 yrs if he makes 180 appearances, then that's actually a good thing. If it vests if he puts on the uniform once over the next 4 yrs, then it's a bad deal. They say the option is easily reachable, but that doesnt help. If all it entails is that he stays healthy, then that is actually a big deal when talking about closers

You prefer....Madson....to...Papelbon. Seriously, WTF? Really? Papelbon showed he could do it in the AL East on the biggest stage. He closed out a world series and was the badass at the end of your pen. Madson has been very good over the last few yrs, but not having to close out AL lineups changes things a little. The only thing Madson has him on is ERA, which isnt entirely pitcher dependent.

The lineup is where you're going to have to deal with some changes. I think Lavarnway slots in as the primary DH and backup catcher, and Youk gets his fair share of time at DH as well. All that cap is going to get spent on pitching

he was rescued alive today. Good.

You can get the chart out all you want, you just lost your best reliever. How is that not a detriment to your team?

We saw a rookie strike thrower turn into a legit #2 and saw two scrap heap starters revive their careers. That isnt something you can count on. We got lucky

Motte throws 97-100mph and has a sick breaking ball. How does he not have closer stuff? Boggs and Salas got them by, but winning the WS requires you to have a good end guy. And I am not sure Bard is that guy for you guys

They now need at least one marquee reliever and an innings eating starter. Their offense will suffer if they do not replace Papi, but even if they retain Papi, I dont think he repeats his 2011 performance. Right now, really, the sox have 3 starters, 2 of which are injury prone and one who had cancer. If they cannot get 2 more starters and build some real depth behind their top 5, I am going to be very happy come October 2012

sounds about right. Offseason after a disappointing Red Sox season turns into a dick measuring contest on who is the more loyal fan. LOL, child, pipe down, nobody gives a s*** right now.

Well, if this is one of those "bridge" years, the sox fans might end up hanging themselves. If the Pats keep falling on their asses, the lockout continues, and the Bruins have a championship hangover, the Red Sox fervor will be at a fever pitch come April. If they miss the playoffs again, there might be an all out riot

You know Ells is leaving. The writing is on the wall. Might be a good time to sell high on him.

The thing is, though, which young guys are you talking about? Right now is not a good time in the sox org to "let the kids play" because most of the high level prospects of the last few yrs are either already in the rotation/lineup or are playing in San Diego and Cleveland. The sox have a few high level guys with flaws like Doubront (durability), Lavarnway (defense), Bowden (performance), but their true prospects are all AA or lower to start 2012. You almost have to fill the gaps. Now, maybe they go the cheap route in doing so. Maybe Kalish and Reddick fight for the RF slot, maybe Lavarnway is the opening day DH, maybe they move Aceves into the rotation, sign a guy like Chris Capuano to be the #5 guy and expect Bowden and Doubront to help set up for Bard as closer. Maybe they fill their bench with Bill Hall types, or maybe they give some kids a chance to get some PT as part timers. Who knows. But without a major impact prospect (aside from Lavarnway who I think has an impact bat), they really cannot go the "let them play" route

Spitball, your 2 world series titles came on the backs of Keith Foulke and Jon Papelbon, two marquee closers. WAR doesnt take into effect the vital role of a closer. If a middle reliever fails in his duties to hold a lead, the team has a chance to come back and win. If a closer blows the save or gives up a lead, then it's a loss. And we have seen multiple free agents wilt under the bright lights in Boston and NY. How will one of these free agent closers fare in that setting? And a closer by committee approach works when you have multiple players with closer stuff rotating around a situation. Aside from Bard, the sox don't have guys with the big arms or the filthy stuff just sitting out there in the pen or in the high minors. Philly absolutely overpaid, no doubt. But in doing so, they set the market for other guys the sox will be targetting and they took away your best reliever. This is a devastating blow right now. Obviously if Ben goes out and signs KRod and Bell, then maybe this doesnt hurt so bad

You have $20+ mil to play with prior to the lux tax threshold. This doesnt change that

The sox pen on the whole was actually a strength last yr until September. But you've now lost your best piece of that pen. That strength turned into a weakness in one day

Pal, you're rationalizing pretty hard here. Papelbon is a humongous loss. Not sure if he can be replaced

This is a humongous loss. Wow, this is awesome! Having an elite closer is one of the major reasons why I have seen my team win 5 world series titles. Locking down that last inning is crucial to being successful, just ask the Blue Jays, who blew over 20 saves last yr. Papelbon was home grown, had great stuff, handled the media, and handled the pressure. Yes, there are other great closers out there, but none of them have pitched in Fenway with the sox jersey on. If you stay internal, you pull your best setup man into a role he has not proven he can handle and if you go external, you're gonna have to pay an arm and a leg for someone who doesnt have the consistency that Paps had. If they now sign Madson for 4 yrs $44 mil, is it really going to be a better deal than signing Papelbon for one extra yr and $16 or so mil more?

20/22

His asst coach and heir apparent was caught raping a child in the shower by one of his graduate assistants. The grad assistant talked to his father and subsequently talked to Paterno the next day. This was in 1998, they effectively buried it. Paterno told the AD who effectively squashed the investigation.

Sad end to a great career. But he deserved to be fired and should be prosecuted. How he did what he did is morally reprehensible

The crazy thing about this offseason is that they could potentially revamp this team pretty significantly or they could keep it intact. With the FAs they have and the problems that finished the season, it would be interesting to see either extreme. It's impossible to predict until the first domino falls.

pot-kettle-black, lol